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ProgSword 
Forum Groupie 
Joined: June 23 2014 Status: Offline Points: 48 |
 Topic: Why isn't Snarky Puppy on Progarchives?Posted: October 23 2014 at 18:13 |
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(This isn't really a suggestion, more of a complaint)
I'm surprised these guys were rejected. They're basically Return to Forever and Nucleus' love child. Seriously been digging these guys over the past week. They even have nods toward some of Zappa's stuff on Waka/Jawaka and Hot Rats. Just tell me this isn't straight up fusion. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_XJ_s5IsQc
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chopper
Special Collaborator 
Honorary Collaborator Joined: July 13 2005 Location: Essex, UK Status: Offline Points: 19942 |
Posted: October 24 2014 at 03:54 |
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer 
Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
Posted: October 24 2014 at 04:48 |
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Well, I'll leave it to the JRF team to explain why they had to reject it but all I know is I liked the sample so much I have already set up that album on download from bandcamp. So thanks much for the post.
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
Posted: October 24 2014 at 05:26 |
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Into the third track, there's so much ROCK I bet if it was called an LTE album instead of Snarky Puppy, it would be a shoo-in. Hip hop, pop? Yeah, whatever.
...it is not a democracy so I don't think you, Progsword, should take it too much to heart. It's PA's loss anyway if bands like Snarky Puppy get rejected.
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
Posted: October 24 2014 at 05:27 |
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...and it's got plenty of odd time sig playing so don't tell me it's just straight up extended instrumental music. It's not. It's ok if you want to reject it but it's not hip hop for God's sake.
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Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin Joined: January 22 2009 Location: Magic Theatre Status: Offline Points: 23098 |
Posted: October 24 2014 at 05:34 |
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This thread just convinced me about ordering their newest, so thanks for that
 I don't really think they fit in with the fusion genre on PA, although you could make a case for 'jazz fusion'....but then again The Future Sound Of London are prog electronic yet do not fit in on PA either. I completely trust the fusion team on this decision anyway. Music can be incredibly tasty without having to be included on PA y'know?
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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams |
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
Posted: October 24 2014 at 05:38 |
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Fine, but this just reinforces a theme of resistance to anything that would be even a slightly left-field addition. Then again, given the amount of whining that takes place for months (even years in the case of Metallica) post such an addition, I don't blame the collabs either. But it all adds up to a pattern where only more of the same can ever get added and that's not a healthy situation. See his reference to Nucleus. I think people have forgotten that at the beginning wind instruments were indeed used extensively even in the prog side of JRF. It sounds too jazzy now because of the subsequent shift towards a guitar dominated format but it was a part of the jazz rock vocabulary in the beginning and nothing wrong with a band re-treading those steps.
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
Posted: October 24 2014 at 05:47 |
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One thing I can say though is it is def not straight up fusion as ProgSword claims. Maybe their other albums are, I wouldn't know, but We Like It Here certainly doesn't fit into typical fusion patterns and thank God for that. It's more of a Bela Fleck like footloose, colourful cocktail with hard rocking interspersed with pure jazz.
Edited by rogerthat - October 24 2014 at 05:48 |
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Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin Joined: January 22 2009 Location: Magic Theatre Status: Offline Points: 23098 |
Posted: October 24 2014 at 05:52 |
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Like I said, i ordered the new one and will hopefully be better equipped to partake in this discussion regarding the musical side of things.
I do not agree with your comment on 'more of the same getting added' to the extent that nothing new ever gets added. That's wrong, you just have to look harder....but then again I happen to think most music that's genuinely progressive lies outside of the prog umbrella nowadays.
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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams |
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
Posted: October 24 2014 at 05:58 |
Which is simply because - and sorry if this is going to sound like Pedro - prog is now just a sound, a cliche, a stereotype. And anything that gets called prog has to fit these cliches first now, which is against everything that prog epitomised in the 70s. I admit I was harsh with the more of the same barb but I don't mean it literally, just that I don't sense any expansion of the window. Only stuff that fits nicely into well established boxes. I have heard so many bands from that time say they never called themselves prog rock and it was the media that labelled them as such. If that is not happening - or hasn't happened, rather, since the birth of prog metal and post rock, - the prog community, and more so the fans and the media in this case rather than the musicians - need to consider why. When I heard the work of the great 70s prog rock bands as one born well after its decline, prog was not a nostalgia trip for me. It sounded exciting and ambitious. I sincerely hope prog doesn't get reduced to a nostalgia fix over the next few years but that's where I see things going. Maybe it's simply not attracting enough young fans, that could be the problem.
Edited by rogerthat - October 24 2014 at 05:59 |
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Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin Joined: January 22 2009 Location: Magic Theatre Status: Offline Points: 23098 |
Posted: October 24 2014 at 06:19 |
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I see what you mean and I happen to agree with most of what you say, but we need a Progressive Music Archives in order to embrace this new line of thinking and it would ultimately lead to a, granted specialised, version of RYM. It would be much easier just making a new web site for that, and that way the people who visit here, and have done so ever since the start of PA, can continue to discuss Prog Rock in it's archaic meaning (although slightly stretched at some points imo).
I didn't make the rules, I just uphold the notion of what PA was and continues to be: a Prog Rock website. I'll admit, it would be a helluva lot more interesting being an admin in the aforementioned scenario, because there is so much experimental music I listen to that isn't listed on PA.....yet I am a custodian of a web site with remarkably big traditions considering it's short life span, and unless I am completely blind as to what occupies most visiting members, then this new focus does not reflect their interests. Even if I agreed with the fact that we are NOT reflecting the true bands embodying the progressive spirit, there are still the hard core prog heads out there, which about 90% of our member base consists of, that you have to talk into completely overhauling the site.
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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams |
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rogerthat
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2006 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 9869 |
Posted: October 24 2014 at 06:23 |
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I fully empathise with your constraints and I am not new to these discussions. Which is why I suggested to Prog Sword to not take it to heart. It is a larger issue that concerns the state of prog rock as it stands today and more specifically how it is 'marketed' and perceived. I do think PA as the premier prog rock website is in a great place to influence opinion here but that also requires receptiveness from the other side. I am aware that I am more of an outlier in that regard and my opinion is very far from the consensus.
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aapatsos
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: November 11 2005 Location: Manchester, UK Status: Offline Points: 9226 |
Posted: October 24 2014 at 06:58 |
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I guess this is why the "General Music" forum exists - to recommend
music that people coming on PA might also like - I enjoyed that video
from Snarky Puppy (what a name!) and it would not stop me enjoying it if
they are not on PA. Based on this only sample, I can see why they are
not included in PA.
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Friday13th
Forum Senior Member 
Joined: April 30 2013 Status: Offline Points: 284 |
Posted: October 29 2014 at 10:16 |
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Some of Snarky Puppy is definitely jazz fusion, which does qualify it for progarchives. A lot of it though is very poppy. They're not terrible, but I'm personally annoyed by them 'cause I have some friends who think they're so unique and amazing since they've never heard other jazz fusion. Still, I do appreciate that they are a gateway for many new listeners to check fusion by other, better artists
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Intruder
Forum Senior Member
Joined: May 13 2005 Status: Offline Points: 2084 |
Posted: October 30 2014 at 07:17 |
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Either way, SP have mad musical skills - the three guitarists in the band may be some of the best in the biz at the moment. Is it prog? Is it pop-rock? Hip-pop? Fusion-pop? Hip-pop-fusion-pop-rock? Quasi-prog rock hip pop fusion rock? Just call it groovy music and let the people on the site know about it so that they may open a door that otherwise would've remained closed. That's the most powerful tool the PA site offers - a way to introduce listeners to good music and a way to let listeners discuss it. I love PA but I hate getting bogged down in labels (the scourge wrought by the commerce of the biz).
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I like to feel the suspense when you're certain you know I am there.....
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Gudwulf
Forum Newbie 
Joined: October 31 2014 Location: Bristol UK Status: Offline Points: 2 |
Posted: October 31 2014 at 15:38 |
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Great stuff! Part of my 70s musical education was via fusion or jazz-rock - the keys soloist is clearly influenced by Chick Corea and I can see how some of the latter jazzer's output could be included into a prog listener's playlist. But Snarky Puppy? No, not really.
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SteveG
Forum Senior Member
Joined: April 11 2014 Location: Kyiv In Spirit Status: Offline Points: 20478 |
Posted: October 31 2014 at 15:44 |
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^Cool avatar and a great movie. And nice relief from Gulbamsen's!.
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poligraf
Forum Newbie
Joined: April 25 2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 2 |
Posted: February 06 2018 at 06:50 |
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this seems like a good argument to me : 
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Argo2112
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 20 2017 Location: New Jersey Status: Offline Points: 4452 |
Posted: February 06 2018 at 09:45 |
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I've heard of these guys but never checked them out before. Very cool stuff, makes me want to here more of them.
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Mascodagama
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: December 30 2006 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 5111 |
Posted: February 06 2018 at 12:29 |
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Saw them live at the Marseilles Jazz Festival in 2016 and liked them - a very good fun live band, though I wasn’t really moved to get any of their albums afterwards. They aren't pushing the envelope musically - then again, not every band has to do that, and I bet they're acting as a gateway drug for many to get into the wider workd of jazz and jazz-rock / fusion, which is a great thing. Plus they are excellent players one and all.
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Soldato of the Pan Head Mafia. We'll make you an offer you can't listen to.
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Why isn't Snarky Puppy on Progarchives?
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Guldbamsen wrote: