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Kati
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 10 2010
Location: Earth
Status: Offline
Points: 6253
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Posted: March 25 2015 at 05:05 |
My pleasure, really, thank you, ExittheLemming
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Kati
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 10 2010
Location: Earth
Status: Offline
Points: 6253
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Posted: March 25 2015 at 05:35 |
I will stop mentioning the above, because even I had enough of it and I do not want to drag this longer or be a downer towards others nor do I want any pity either. Let's all focus on moozik, this makes us really happy!
Edited by Kati - March 25 2015 at 05:37
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
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Posted: March 25 2015 at 05:41 |
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What?
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Kati
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 10 2010
Location: Earth
Status: Offline
Points: 6253
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Posted: March 25 2015 at 05:42 |
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odinalcatraz
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 12 2010
Location: London
Status: Offline
Points: 347
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Posted: March 25 2015 at 15:57 |
ExittheLemming wrote:
Everyone and their dog's understudy hairdresser's personal trainer on PA got asked to review the second Corvus Stone album. This type of carpet bombing spamming for reviews just chafes everyone's teats and would ordinarily be potentially counter productive to positive appraisals of this music from any discerning and objective reviewer. (I opened a separate thread devoted to the acceptability or otherwise of such marketing practices recently) The album's current score of 4.09 however, clearly contradicts this rationale and seems contrarily inflated by less than assiduous reviews. Yes, that IS judgmental isn't it?. I received a PM asking me to review the album which I flatly declined. I then bought the album based on a You Tube video for Boots for Hire which I enjoyed hugely. I've not submitted a written review yet but would hazard three sparklies from this habitually grudging rodent i.e. good but clearly NOT essential (CS II is a devoted and sincere fans' record, NOT an original artist's one) None of the foregoing spamming can be attributed to Sonia so where the accusations of reviewer manipulation stem from is at best obscure at at worst delusional. As Dean says, no-one on PA has any problem with band members, their friends and family submitting reviews as long as they don't pretend to be disinterested third parties.
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Hi Exit! First of all I have to say thank you for buying the album. As I say to everyone, it means a lot to us and always will. Now I have to ask why you said this: " I received a PM asking me to review the album which I flatly declined."? You are not the first to say this when I know you weren't asked at all. If you have a PM asking you to review it, please copy it here. I would be happy if you did! I guess I approached about 15 Collaborators/Reviewers on here. If you're worried about our reviews by fans, then count the collab reviews as a percentage and then check a few other bands. I think you will see absolute proof that I was VERY keen to get reviews here by non fans. The reviews have been fair and the collab/Fan balance is very good! I never comment here or anywhere else about specific bands doing "prog by numbers". I find it all very nice but quite forgettable. Many of those bands hit the top 10 here every year. It is not for me to say that many listeners of "prog", like what they know, just as in the popular music and movie world. We don't do what sells(because it is boring) and therefore, I do ask people here if they would like to hear the albums and that does cost us money. I NEVER ask anyone to do a review. That would be kind of silly. Bands further up the food chain, have independent record companies who send out huge numbers of albums to get reviews(They charge all that to the bands of course). That way, the band aren't accused of doing too much promotion because they pay someone else to do it! Many of those bands also pay for artwork, guests, production and brick wall mastering but again, we don't. We feel that anyone who is paid for, doesn't really care about what a band does, just about the money they earn for services rendered. Unless a band is well known, then care is added in to that mix. You need to understand that this weird world we know as prog, is not easy for musicians. In fact, we are mostly pretty clueless as to how to get heard at all. I put a lot of thought in to the problem and the potential problem of being accused of daring to promote at all. We certainly have had our fair share of criticism on that front, so I was right to try and avoid it by asking you guys! Believe me... If we wanted to, we could ask MANY fans to write reviews. We don't! We have encouraged a small number who truly love what we do, to do so if they feel so inclined. MUCH more than that, I have suggested to many that they should join PA and get involved. Unfortunately, most just enjoy liking stuff on Facebook. Apart from wondering why you say you were asked to review it, you also say a youtube video of "Boots for hire" and I wonder where you found that? We haven't got one. I hope you are enjoying the album more as time goes on. Both albums seem to be that way. Colin
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http://www.corvusstone.com
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earlyprog
Collaborator
Neo / PSIKE / Heavy Teams
Joined: March 05 2006
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 2081
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Posted: March 25 2015 at 16:39 |
Kati wrote:
moshkito wrote:
ExittheLemming wrote:
Everyone and their dog's understudy hairdresser's personal trainer on PA got asked to review the second Corvus Stone album.
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Liar! i wasn't asked!
earlyprog wrote:
I personally get annoyed when I see newbies/zero posters in a review claiming that this or that album is the greatest thing since the Pill or something like that. I see this once again with Drifting Sun. |
I don't really see an issue with that, since in the long run other folks will add their own to it! I mean, I was thinking that after your response I would not want to listen or bother with that album at all, and I am pretty sure that the majority of folks on PA are much more discerning and caring about the music and the art form than that! |
hahahaha! moshkito! That's so funny! Without asking the band, I can send you a cd and meanwhile a download too if you want to review it? I'd be glad to send you their album and thrilled to get a review from you? Really! hugs, Sonia |
I knew it! just as I thought
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earlyprog
Collaborator
Neo / PSIKE / Heavy Teams
Joined: March 05 2006
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 2081
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Posted: March 25 2015 at 16:43 |
Dean wrote:
I'm not much of a touchy-feely person but ... |
Dean, is that you?
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earlyprog
Collaborator
Neo / PSIKE / Heavy Teams
Joined: March 05 2006
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 2081
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Posted: March 25 2015 at 17:01 |
Kati wrote:
P.S. I figured out was more or less said about me, due to forum comments, that was obvious and I cornered a few close friends too, who had no choice in consideration towards me told me more or less what had happened as I refused being left in the dark especially when it concerns me, things I don't understand why. I still do not understand what happened and what was said. no one broke PA rules. It's all very odd and confusing. To be clear here, I never ever asked for 5 star reviews ever. Album 2 I did not ask anyone for a review. Album one only asked Lucas and Angelo here on PA and asked VanderGraafGenerator aka Juris on fb. I would never do that, ask for higher rating, I'd be to ashamed to do that. Only other person I've discussed the ratings was Horizons on the first album but that was after he reviewed the album and he was so nice too to me. xxxx I have discussed lightly as general comment ratings with Aussi-bird-brother too in private but only because he is my friend, again all this on the first album release, this one new second Album I did not want to put anyone on the spot. Another big hug to you, Dean |
That just about says it all. I get the picture. Do you really have to continue discussing this in the open.
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Kati
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 10 2010
Location: Earth
Status: Offline
Points: 6253
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Posted: March 25 2015 at 18:09 |
earlyprog wrote:
Kati wrote:
P.S. I figured out was more or less said about me, due to forum comments, that was obvious and I cornered a few close friends too, who had no choice in consideration towards me told me more or less what had happened as I refused being left in the dark especially when it concerns me, things I don't understand why. I still do not understand what happened and what was said. no one broke PA rules. It's all very odd and confusing. To be clear here, I never ever asked for 5 star reviews ever. Album 2 I did not ask anyone for a review. Album one only asked Lucas and Angelo here on PA and asked VanderGraafGenerator aka Juris on fb. I would never do that, ask for higher rating, I'd be to ashamed to do that. Only other person I've discussed the ratings was Horizons on the first album but that was after he reviewed the album and he was so nice too to me. xxxx I have discussed lightly as general comment ratings with Aussi-bird-brother too in private but only because he is my friend, again all this on the first album release, this one new second Album I did not want to put anyone on the spot. Another big hug to you, Dean |
That just about says it all. I get the picture. Do you really have to continue discussing this in the open. |
Earlyprog, What I discuss is none of your business and should not concern you, now considering that you are so inquisitive if you scrolled further down on the forum I also clearly stated that I did not want to keep mentioning this as even I AM GETTING BORED WITH MYSELF. And for the second time, leave me alone.
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ExittheLemming
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2007
Location: Penal Colony
Status: Offline
Points: 11415
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Posted: March 26 2015 at 02:03 |
odinalcatraz wrote:
Hi Exit! First of all I have to say thank you for buying the album. As I say to everyone, it means a lot to us and always will. Now I have to ask why you said this: " I received a PM asking me to review the album which I flatly declined."? You are not the first to say this when I know you weren't asked at all. If you have a PM asking you to review it, please copy it here. I would be happy if you did!
Apart from wondering why you say you were asked to review it, you also say a youtube video of "Boots for hire" and I wonder where you found that? We haven't got one. I hope you are enjoying the album more as time goes on. Both albums seem to be that way. Colin
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I was asked to review the 2nd Corvus Stone album by a member called maxfax on 26th October 2014 at 05:27 who stated he was 'doing promotion' Are you therefore saying a PA member is promoting the album without your consent? I've also PM'd you a copy of the original message from maxfax.The Youtube video for 'Boots For Hire' has subsequently been removed but I think I listened to the track from here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5rRqVRF9YU&list=PLoRNXsrOuZ-VFPxCn5uOpb-r1qWxNMsgU&index=19
Edited by ExittheLemming - March 26 2015 at 02:23
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richardh
Prog Reviewer
Joined: February 18 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 25890
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Posted: March 26 2015 at 02:21 |
For what its worth I am a fan of Corvus Stone ( Colin is aware of this) and bought the second album ( I gave the first a 4 star review) I like CS2 and would probably give that a 4 star review also if I ever pull my finger out and get round to it. No one here has suggested I should review it either in PM or on the forum. I am quite grateful for that as I am quite lazy!
Edited by richardh - March 26 2015 at 02:21
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odinalcatraz
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 12 2010
Location: London
Status: Offline
Points: 347
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Posted: March 26 2015 at 07:07 |
ExittheLemming wrote:
odinalcatraz wrote:
Hi Exit! First of all I have to say thank you for buying the album. As I say to everyone, it means a lot to us and always will. Now I have to ask why you said this: " I received a PM asking me to review the album which I flatly declined."? You are not the first to say this when I know you weren't asked at all. If you have a PM asking you to review it, please copy it here. I would be happy if you did!
Apart from wondering why you say you were asked to review it, you also say a youtube video of "Boots for hire" and I wonder where you found that? We haven't got one. I hope you are enjoying the album more as time goes on. Both albums seem to be that way. Colin
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I was asked to review the 2nd Corvus Stone album by a member called maxfax on 26th October 2014 at 05:27 who stated he was 'doing promotion' Are you therefore saying a PA member is promoting the album without your consent? I've also PM'd you a copy of the original message from maxfax.The Youtube video for 'Boots For Hire' has subsequently been removed but I think I listened to the track from here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5rRqVRF9YU&list=PLoRNXsrOuZ-VFPxCn5uOpb-r1qWxNMsgU&index=19
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Thank you for this reply Exit. It could explain a lot of the problems we have had here. Whoever the hell maxfax is, is clearly spam or something. He has no name and asks for email adresses. Obvious spam to me but how many believed him and treated us badly on here based on that? I would never ever write a one line request to someone, or ask for an email address. What the hell is maxfax up to? Anyone else had requests like that about us or any other band?
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http://www.corvusstone.com
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
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Posted: March 26 2015 at 07:11 |
While he has never posted in the forum he has rated a few albums - every spammer leaves footprints in the sand that the Admins can follow.
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What?
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odinalcatraz
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 12 2010
Location: London
Status: Offline
Points: 347
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Posted: March 26 2015 at 07:17 |
richardh wrote:
For what its worth I am a fan of Corvus Stone ( Colin is aware of this) and bought the second album ( I gave the first a 4 star review) I like CS2 and would probably give that a 4 star review also if I ever pull my finger out and get round to it. No one here has suggested I should review it either in PM or on the forum. I am quite grateful for that as I am quite lazy!
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Thank you Richard! Yes I know well that you bought the album but not that you're lazy! I have now found out that someone who rated a bunch of albums on here "MAXFAX", has sent a request to exitthelemming, to do a review and asking for his email address. That must have gone to others too. Someone is deliberately trying to destroy our band? Anyone I ever contacted on here gets a real, unique and considered message and never a request to review us. Damn it's hard this prog business!
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http://www.corvusstone.com
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odinalcatraz
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 12 2010
Location: London
Status: Offline
Points: 347
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Posted: March 26 2015 at 07:24 |
Dean wrote:
While he has never posted in the forum he has rated a few albums - every spammer leaves footprints in the sand that the Admins can follow. |
This is all very sad I had no idea till now, why we get bad press from some on here. Now I find out that someone is offering OUR album to people on here in a very stupid way and being believed. Now we have a reputation as self promoters from hell. How can that be reversed? Is that happening to other bands too? Anyone I REALLY contacted about any album, gets a sensible message NOT asking for a review and will confirm that. I look forward to a day when reviews don't all start "I was asked to review this album"
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http://www.corvusstone.com
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ExittheLemming
Forum Senior Member
Joined: October 19 2007
Location: Penal Colony
Status: Offline
Points: 11415
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Posted: March 26 2015 at 07:24 |
odinalcatraz wrote:
Thank you for this reply Exit. It could explain a lot of the problems we have had here. Whoever the hell maxfax is, is clearly spam or something. He has no name and asks for email adresses. Obvious spam to me but how many believed him and treated us badly on here based on that? I would never ever write a one line request to someone, or ask for an email address. What the hell is maxfax up to? Anyone else had requests like that about us or any other band?
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As Dean states, maxfax has, somewhat unusually for a purported spammer, submitted some rating only reviews (and gave CS II 5 stars) I'd recommend you report this to the Admins so that they can investigate what looks like some uber dodgy behaviour. Feel free to ask them to contact myself for corroboration etc BTW I would never judge any music based on whatever nefarious means it was brought to my attention (that would just be prejudicial and I will review CS II as fairly and objectively as any grudging hate filled rodent could be expected to )
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The Dark Elf
Forum Senior Member
VIP Member
Joined: February 01 2011
Location: Michigan
Status: Offline
Points: 12609
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Posted: March 26 2015 at 07:30 |
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...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology...
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odinalcatraz
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 12 2010
Location: London
Status: Offline
Points: 347
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Posted: March 26 2015 at 08:17 |
I agree about the any press thing in some ways. The thing is that I would walk away from(and have) anything that makes me feel bad or I don't like. One thing I am not and never will be, is an annoying spammer or self promoter. I'll never say that any album I am involved in is "great". Conversely, I'll also never put down a musician or album publicly either. Music to me, is fun and mysterious, not a commercial enterprise. Um... I guess that defines what prog is supposed to be?
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http://www.corvusstone.com
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odinalcatraz
Forum Senior Member
Joined: July 12 2010
Location: London
Status: Offline
Points: 347
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Posted: March 26 2015 at 08:23 |
ExittheLemming wrote:
odinalcatraz wrote:
Thank you for this reply Exit. It could explain a lot of the problems we have had here. Whoever the hell maxfax is, is clearly spam or something. He has no name and asks for email adresses. Obvious spam to me but how many believed him and treated us badly on here based on that? I would never ever write a one line request to someone, or ask for an email address. What the hell is maxfax up to? Anyone else had requests like that about us or any other band?
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As Dean states, maxfax has, somewhat unusually for a purported spammer, submitted some rating only reviews (and gave CS II 5 stars) I'd recommend you report this to the Admins so that they can investigate what looks like some uber dodgy behaviour. Feel free to ask them to contact myself for corroboration etc BTW I would never judge any music based on whatever nefarious means it was brought to my attention (that would just be prejudicial and I will review CS II as fairly and objectively as any grudging hate filled rodent could be expected to)
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We love rats! (we proved it in one of our videos!) We never get upset by bad reviews. That isn't the problem. The problem is when rumours are put in public about us acting like fools with over promotion. Nobody likes self promoters, least of all me! Well Dean knows now and hopefully that will be passed on to all prog reviewers and collaborators. If there is a maxfax, then you can be damn sure there are more of them! As far as ratings, Daily people sign up, rate 20 to 400 albums and disappear. That is the real problem on PA. That actually is dodgy and has a massive effect on albums.
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http://www.corvusstone.com
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Dean
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
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Posted: March 26 2015 at 08:34 |
it has a small effect on albums but it is bad for the image of the PA.
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What?
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