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GruvanDahlman 
Prog Reviewer 
Joined: December 15 2011 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 25 |
 Topic: Dragon (New Zealand) - Crossover progPosted: March 09 2015 at 10:30 |
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Hi!
I think that Dragon, from New Zealand, ought to be included into PA. Unfortunately only the first two albums ate progressive rock but still, I do feel they are worthy of an inclusion. Genre: crossover prog Country: New Zealand Dragon is a band that was formed in Auckland, New Zealand, in 1972. In 1975 they relocated to Sydney, Australia. Dragon was signed by the Vertigo label and released two albums in 1974 and 1975. The music of Dragon was progressive rock in the vein of Gnidrolog or Raw Material, sounding very british. After these two albums for Vertigo they continued to release music that was increasingly accessible, switching to pure pop and/or rock, in pursuit of chart success. The band achieved that, becoming a very succesful band in the late 70's and 80's. They are still active today. For fans of progressive music only the first two albums, Universal radio (1974) and Scenten gardens for the blind (1975), are of interest. Though not overly complex Dragon deliver a warm, keyboard dominated type of prog that is both complex, accessible and sophisticated with quite a heavy touch at times. Sound clips: http://youtu.be/YZg43jBZeRY http://youtu.be/PwFRUvVPXoo http://youtu.be/PH48DQFWj_o http://youtu.be/p7hwjAAmfXE http://youtu.be/C7mr9OzvTWM http://youtu.be/IdhAwZNo_30 Discography: Universal Radio (1974) Scented Gardens for the Blind (1975) Sunshine (1977) Running Free (1977) O Zambezi (1978) Power Play (1979) Body and the Beat (1984) Dreams of Ordinary Men (1986) Bondi Road (1989) Incarnations (1995) Sunshine to Rain (2006) Live 2008 (2009) Happy I Am (2009) It's all Too Beautiful (2011) Chase The Sun EP (2011) The Great Divide EP (2012) The Dragon Years, 40th Anniversary Collection (2012) Dragon - Trilogy [3-CD set - live recordings from 70's, 80's and present] (2014) ROSES (2014) Current members Todd Hunter - bass guitar, vocals (1972–1995, 2006–present) Mark Williams - vocals, guitar (2006–present) Bruce Reid - guitar (2006–present) Pete Drummond - drums, vocals, keyboards (2006–present) Former members Ray Goodwin - guitar, keyboards, vocals (1972–1976) Graeme Collins - vocals, piano (1972) Neil Reynolds - drums (1972) Neil Storey - drums (1972–1975; d. 1976) Ivan Thompson - vocals, keyboards (1973–1974) Marc Hunter - vocals (1973–1979, 1982–1997; d. 1998) Geoff Chunn - drums (1974) Robert Taylor - guitar (1974–1984) Paul Hewson - keyboards (1975–1985; d. 1985) Kerry Jacobson - drums (1976–1983) Richard Lee - vocals, guitar, violin (1979–1980) Billy Rogers - harmonica, saxophone, piano, vocals (1979) Alan Mansfield - keyboards (1982–1997) Terry Chambers - drums (1983–1985) Tommy Emmanuel - guitar (1985–1988, 1995) Don Miller-Robinson - guitar (1985) Doane Perry - drums (1985–1988) David Hirschfelder - keyboards (1987–1989) Peter Grimwood - guitar (1988) Lee Borkman - keyboards (1988–1989) John Watson - drums (1988–1989) Andy Sidari - samples (1989) Randall Waller - guitar (1989) Barton Price - drums (1989) Mike Caen - guitar (1989–1995, 1996–1997) Jeffrey Bartolomei - keyboards (1989–1996) Mitch Farmer - drums (1989) Rajan Kamahl - keyboards (1991–1993) Peter Northcote - guitar (1995) Ange Tsoitoudis - guitar (1996–1997) Dario Bortolin - bass (1996) Brad Ford - drums (1996) Mick O'Shea - drums (1996–1997) Billy Kervin - bass (1996–1997) Darren Percival - guest vocals (2007) Bernie Segedin - guest vocals (2007) |
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Windhawk
Special Collaborator 
Honorary Collaborator Joined: December 28 2006 Location: Norway Status: Offline Points: 11400 |
Posted: March 09 2015 at 10:34 |
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Websites I work with:
http://www.progressor.net http://www.houseofprog.com My profile on Mixcloud: https://www.mixcloud.com/haukevind/ |
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irrelevant
Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator Joined: March 07 2010 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 13382 |
Posted: March 11 2015 at 08:22 |
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Definite crossover for the first two albums. Alas...
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kev rowland
Special Collaborator
Honorary Reviewer Joined: November 18 2005 Location: New Zealand Status: Offline Points: 2150 |
Posted: March 14 2015 at 20:11 |
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Here in NZ we all love Dragon, along with bands such as Th' Dudes and Split Enz they are part of rock royalty from the 70's. But, I've only ever heard the much later material for which they became famous. Given that they were given a 3-1 rejection some six years ago, and have released nothing that could be deemed progressive since then, I don't see how we could revisit them now....
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All five volumes of The Progressive Underground now available
https://www.amazon.com/Kev-Rowland/e/B07RJVRB2X |
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GruvanDahlman
Prog Reviewer
Joined: December 15 2011 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 25 |
Posted: March 15 2015 at 04:19 |
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Well, I do see your point. It's such a shame they didn't record more progressive albums, since the first two holds such a promise. I sort of expected the answer received and fully appreciate the reason for them not to be included. I wasn't aware that they had been under discussion but it does not surprisr me in the least.
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Tom Ozric
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2005 Location: Olympus Mons Status: Offline Points: 15916 |
Posted: March 15 2015 at 05:07 |
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All I know is that their first 2 albums are major Prog rarities.
Then I know they became pompous mainstream tools............ Still wish I could find Scented Gardens For The Blind on vinyl.......... |
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sl75
Forum Groupie 
Joined: April 11 2012 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 64 |
Posted: March 22 2015 at 19:21 |
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I thought they were approved for Prog-Related???
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sl75
Forum Groupie
Joined: April 11 2012 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 64 |
Posted: March 22 2015 at 19:31 |
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http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=67698&PN=2
harmonium.ro posted halfway down the page to say they'd been approved for Prog Related, and it looks like they were waiting for someone to finish off the discography etc - which, it looks like GruvanDahlman could do for them. It's weird seeing the reasoning on both threads that, although Dragon's first two albums are undoubtedly progressive rock, they should be rejected from any full prog category because of the rest of their discography. I'm sure I've read somewhere on this site that an artist has only to release ONE prog album to be eligible for inclusion here - Dragon have released two! |
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yam yam
Forum Senior Member 
Joined: June 16 2011 Location: Kerberos Status: Offline Points: 5820 |
Posted: March 22 2015 at 21:35 |
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^ There was a lot of support from various prominent members of the site in that thread for this band to be added to Prog Related - including a
 from a member of our current admin team. Seems to me it was a done deal that never did get done...and it just needs finishing off now. 
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GruvanDahlman
Prog Reviewer
Joined: December 15 2011 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 25 |
Posted: March 23 2015 at 06:59 |
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The more I listen and ponder the more I feel they ought to be included. From what i can gather it seems like some sort of slip-up. I sure hope this could be remedied now. 😊
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Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin Joined: January 22 2009 Location: Magic Theatre Status: Offline Points: 23098 |
Posted: March 23 2015 at 08:05 |
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^Hi Christian.
I think it's a case of a band falling between the cracks. Alex left PA for his own personal reasons before Dragon was added. If you'd care to write a bio, then I'm sure we could get these guys included. Another thing: I'm sure this will infuriate most of the posters here advocating them, but had Dragon been suggested for Prog Related today, I'm pretty sure they would've been turned down. It's not like they aren't as 'proggy-sounding' as most of the other acts featured in PR, but we've made a decision to only add bands to this sub, if they in some way influenced or indeed made their mark on our much beloved genre. Dragon cannot claim either (maybe apart from a few obscure Aussie groups). I mean no disrespect by the way - I have loads of favourite artists, who all straddle the fence of progressive and pop/mainstream/hard rock/blues/electronic/jazz, but I do see the reason why Sun Ra, Grateful Dead, Cream, Scorpions and The Beach Boys aren't featured. Let's face it, if we were to include every 70s act that ever flirted around with the style, then we'd be facing a PR section twice as big as all the others combined. As a matter of fact, there's been quite a few well respected members and posters alike over the years all advocating for the removal of both the proto and related subs, because they "water-down" the focus of prog rock to something the site had never intended for when it first started out. We're basically somewhere in the middle nowadays, which does mean that both of these sub genres are very difficult to get into (which is the way it should be imo).
Edited by Guldbamsen - March 23 2015 at 08:05 |
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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams |
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GruvanDahlman
Prog Reviewer
Joined: December 15 2011 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 25 |
Posted: April 04 2015 at 08:58 |
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I have given this much thought and I have decided not to write a bio on Dragon. After carefully weighing arguments from both camps, I feel that though the first two albums are prog, the overwhelming part of the Dragon discography contains too much fluff and pop. I would love to review their first two records but feel that an inclusion would add to the feeling of "watering down" the contents on PA.
I thank all of you who took the time to discuss this topic, All the best! Christian |
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Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin Joined: January 22 2009 Location: Magic Theatre Status: Offline Points: 23098 |
Posted: April 04 2015 at 11:35 |
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Hi again Christian
I understand your sentiment on this. I hope my previous post didn't discourage you from going forward with a bio. That was not my intention at all. If you do change your mind, I think it's only fair to let these guys in seeing as they were approved so long ago.
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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams |
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GruvanDahlman
Prog Reviewer
Joined: December 15 2011 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 25 |
Posted: April 04 2015 at 11:55 |
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Hi again!
I assure you, you didn't put me off. Rather you pointed towards a very significant point and I ultimately felt that you were right. If Dragon ever is inducted I will be pleased but I will not be the one getting them in. They and their likes (one-offs in prog territory, prior to plunging themselves into other genres) are a difficult bunch to handle. |
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Guldbamsen
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin Joined: January 22 2009 Location: Magic Theatre Status: Offline Points: 23098 |
Posted: April 04 2015 at 12:01 |
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Ok thanks for clarifying
 I certainly don't want to be the one to put a stop to a decision made long before I became admin. |
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“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”
- Douglas Adams |
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sl75
Forum Groupie
Joined: April 11 2012 Location: Australia Status: Offline Points: 64 |
Posted: April 05 2015 at 05:30 |
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Can't we just write a bio that says something like:
"Dragon were formed in New Zealand as a progressive rock band. They recorded two albums which have become cult classics in Australia and New Zealand. They then moved to Australia, radically changed direction, and after that no one here cares. Listen to the first two albums only." Edited by sl75 - April 05 2015 at 05:35 |
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GruvanDahlman
Prog Reviewer
Joined: December 15 2011 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 25 |
Posted: April 05 2015 at 05:37 |
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That would sum up just about everything. Quite to the point.
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Tom Ozric
Prog Reviewer
Joined: September 03 2005 Location: Olympus Mons Status: Offline Points: 15916 |
Posted: April 05 2015 at 06:10 |
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Their discog. will have ratings like (now I haven't heard, nor seen the first 2 rare albums) but they might be good.
4-4-0-0-0-0-0-0.........however many April Sun In Cubas or Rains they've done. |
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Kati
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 10 2010 Location: Earth Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
Posted: April 05 2015 at 06:21 |
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Awww first link I LIKE VERY MUCH the song, I usually have to try others before making up my mind, this I like inc. vocals! DRAGON Universal Radio 01 Universal Radio - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZg43jBZeRY&feature=youtu.be
Now why as per above was this rejected? It tops so many accepted albums here on PA to be honest. That bass and guitar and percussion, come on, really? Seriously? This frickin' brilliant! Verv Floyd like vocals/Roger Waters. Seriously, am I mistaken or see it was rejected here on PA?
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Kati
Forum Senior Member
Joined: September 10 2010 Location: Earth Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
Posted: April 05 2015 at 06:24 |
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I am confused here
 maybe I misunderstood things. What was the outcome here?
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Dragon (New Zealand) - Crossover prog
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