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Joined: June 22 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 16130
Posted: April 07 2015 at 10:58
Guldbamsen wrote:
Blacksword wrote:
Guldbamsen wrote:
I think you're right - I have a tendency to mix up those two.
Well, they are both excellent!
I think the Orbs Adventures beyond the Ultraworld and FSOL's Lifeforms are among the best electronic music albums I've ever heard from any era. The early to mid 90's was an excellent time for electronic music. The technology enabled people who were perhaps not as good musicians as their 70's predecessors, but who had excllent ideas nonetheless to bring them to life.
They are indeed! Love that album from The Orb although here recently I've been spinning UFO more. Well it's still a rather recent buy, so that may have something to do with it. As for the last part of your post; there may be something to it, but I think it had more to do with all the new electronic devices being made available. The musicians from the 90s and forward were and are using a completely different approach to music making and that is also what is reflected in the pudding.
I do get why a lot of the old timers find it difficult to get into though, but then again people felt the same back when Dylan went electric. Merely a changing of the guards.
Yeah, I think I understand why many rock fans don't get it when it comes to dance music and electronica.
I still listen to Orb et al quite regularly. UFOrb is an excellent album. OOBE and Blue Room are ambient classics. If you haven't already, you should check out their album Orbvs Terrarvm. Very ethereal and not very dancey, but great to chill to..
Joined: May 12 2009
Location: Coolwood
Status: Offline
Points: 6393
Posted: April 07 2015 at 18:34
verslibre wrote:
Progosopher wrote:
Since I have never heard Empetus, I couldn't say what it was like.
It's the album that got me into Steve's music. I bought it in 1988, without knowing what a note of Steve's music was like, on the strength of the track titles and the quintessentially '80s cover art. It's a stellar sequencer-centric album, but it does conclude with a fantastic ambient piece called simply "The Memory."
Projekt reissued it in 2008 with a second 74-minute disc of all-new music, which is a nice bonus, but they didn't use the original "dated" cover image that I prefer.
The first track, "Arrival."
For me it was Dreamtime Return, which is mostly ambient but it has its share of sequencing. I think he actually cares about his audience. Not many artists would add 74 minutes of music to a re-release. I like the way both covers depict a sense of flow and structure. Cool track!
The world of sound is certainly capable of infinite variety and, were our sense developed, of infinite extensions. -- George Santayana, "The Sense of Beauty"
Joined: March 03 2015
Location: New Orleans
Status: Offline
Points: 33
Posted: April 07 2015 at 20:00
Progsopher, I like the energy of Arrival. The quantized rhythm is used intelligently to create an emotion by building up rather than just being machine background. Also the quality of synthesized sounds is great!
Edited by Daniele Spadavecchia - April 07 2015 at 22:26
Joined: July 27 2010
Location: Tel Aviv
Status: Offline
Points: 4160
Posted: April 08 2015 at 01:12
Lafayette Assburn wrote:
But, for myself, the main reason has nothing to do with hipness. It's that, what with the new technologies (the easily-laid down arpeggiators and whatnot), EM has become something ANY non-musician can slap together given a modicum of stamina. I mean ,I don't know for certain but ,it has GOTTA be easy to produce.
A single artist can put out 4/5 cds a year. TThat puts EM in the arena of metal-facility.
It takes a mediocre "musician" at best - and this SORT OF bothers me.
But then again, so does much pop music and I enjoy that equally.
So what if it's easier to make? If it sounds good it really doesn't bother me how it was made or how talented the guy making it is (if it sounds good he'll be very talented for me).
What's so bad with the fact that it's easier to make music these days? I only see it as a plus. Sure there's probably more mediocre music out there, but there's more music in general, so there's also more good music.
Joined: October 03 2008
Location: Là, sui monti.
Status: Offline
Points: 10837
Posted: April 08 2015 at 05:14
What amuses in Assbum's original post is the complaint about artists able to release 4-5 CDs a year. Looking back into Jazz history, some musicians such as Miles Davis, Charles Mingus or John Coltrane were able to release 3 LPs a year on their sole name, and they also appeared on other musicians' LPs.
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 16148
Posted: April 08 2015 at 09:11
Hi,
The only thing that bothers me with "EM", is the fact that many folks merely copy someone else, because of the new piece of equipment that the new guy/girl now has in his/her possession.
20 years ago, I found it really sad, that many "New Age" folks, including a major store here in Portland, had never heard Eno, AshRaTempel, Tomita, Carlos, Roach, Riley, Tangerine Dream, Popol Vuh, David Parsons, Deuter ... and so many other things, and when I mentioned it, they were very upset, lest I would hurt their commerciality ... which was not hip of me! Now, I'm not going to sit here and cynically say that all of the stuff they had on CD and Cassette was that bad ... but they could handle Vangelis with Jon Anderson on one cut from "Heaven and Hell" but thought that the rest was "evil and strange", and all it was, simply, just a Greek styled symphony! It was, to be honest, simply misguided music appreciation and attention. I always found offensive the one woman that did erotic tapes, and it was a blatant copy of Shakti Yoni and Flora Purim, and it was so sexless and methodical, that it was downright offensive. It just tells you how a particular group of folks liked the plastic arts ... including the "new age" ... which has been old age for a very long time!
After that I got into Orb and Future Sound of London and others. I did not find them "electronic" per se, and I think that the dependency on the beat to keep a thing going, was un-necessary and sometimes actually boring. I was more used to a more freeform style and less beatoriented material, but then I listened to Klaus Schultze again, and went ... oppps ... time to re-evaluate things and from then on the beat did not bother me, although after the fluffy clouds, it did get a bit ... blazee ... for my tastes!
I have not heard, a whole lot of modern EM's ... mostly as the past couple of years, I have concentrated on eliminating most of my LP collection ... but I'm pretty sure there is a lot out there. And Tangerine Dream, still is, for me, the ultimate classical electronic music!
Edited by moshkito - April 08 2015 at 09:13
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com
Joined: October 03 2008
Location: Là, sui monti.
Status: Offline
Points: 10837
Posted: April 08 2015 at 11:27
Hey, moshkito, this New Age stuff is barely connected with the 70's German Electronic music. Furthermore, I still can't understand why people are upset with the presence of rhythms and beatboxes in some electronic genres: The Orb, Future Sound of London, Aphex Twin, Orbital, Autechre, etc... all come from the 80's English Techno scene, not from the 70's Berlin School! Are you aware that something happened after the 70's???
If for a majority of people, Electronic Music = 70's German Cosmic music, then I wouldn't make you listen to the 50's / 60's music of Pierre Henry, Pauline Oliveros, Dirk Raajmakers or Bernard Parmegiani, it could shock you! I can already hear you: "What? No VCS??? No synthesizers but oscillators and frequencies generators?? THAT'S NOT ELECTRONIC MUSIC!!!"
Joined: November 06 2012
Location: here
Status: Offline
Points: 8856
Posted: April 08 2015 at 11:33
verslibre wrote:
Projekt reissued it in 2008 with a second 74-minute disc of all-new music, which is a nice bonus, but they didn't use the original "dated" cover image that I prefer.
Be patient. The new cover will become dated soon enough.
Joined: July 01 2004
Location: CA
Status: Offline
Points: 14980
Posted: April 08 2015 at 11:42
Polymorphia wrote:
verslibre wrote:
Projekt reissued it in 2008 with a second 74-minute disc of all-new music, which is a nice bonus, but they didn't use the original "dated" cover image that I prefer.
Be patient. The new cover will become dated soon enough.
Never cared that much to begin with. Refer to the first half of the sentence.
Joined: August 12 2011
Location: Uruguay
Status: Offline
Points: 86
Posted: April 08 2015 at 11:46
I find myself liking EM more and more with the passing of years. I still have to delve into electronic prog (at least listening to something more than Eno and some Pink Floyd's electronic experiments like On The Run), but I have found some interesting projects based on electronic music, even when it comes to pop music.
There's for example Imogen Heap's electronic-based pop music which is really interesting (way more interesting that what pop music usually gets), finds a good line between ambition and being accesible and makes great use of technological progress. Kind of a more focused and less weird Björk (who also makes interesting electronic-based music). Another pop music example could be IAMX, that blends synth-pop, cabaret music, folk and electronic dance music, blending acoustic, electric and electronic instruments.
But I think the most interesting efforts of making electronic music (or at least music based on EM) comes from both the post-rock scene, with bands like 65daysofstatic (especially after We Were Exploding Anyway) and God Is An Astronaut (especially since Origins) and even Sigur Rós last album and some songs by Clogs or even Godspeed You! Black Emperor or Tortoise, and from the jamtronica or livetronica scene, with bands like Papadosio, The Disco Biscuits, Conspirator and The Motet, especially Papadosio who have injected a psychedelic and space rock sound into the mix, a bit of folk, and a proggish and post-rockish sound too. Though The Motet come in a close second place because they add some afrobeat rhythms into the mix.
I don't know if anything that I have mentioned before could be considered EM per se, but then again, I'm not sure if everything Eno has done could be considered electronic music per se (some of his work is obviously electronic, but still, everything?). Maybe electronic-rock or electronic-pop are more appealing to me than "pure pop", whatever it is.
I think it's important to make it clear whether EM is necessarily music completely made with electronic instruments or could incorporate some acoustic/electric instruments. Because, severly manipulating sounds from "real" instruments digitally does not count as electronic music just because the sounds were originally made with acoustic/electric instruments? And were do we draw the line?
While we think (or at least I do) let's listen to this amazing piece of music
Joined: May 12 2009
Location: Coolwood
Status: Offline
Points: 6393
Posted: April 08 2015 at 12:00
Daniele Spadavecchia wrote:
Progsopher, I like the energy of Arrival. The quantized rhythm is used intelligently to create an emotion by building up rather than just being machine background. Also the quality of synthesized sounds is great!
Well said.
The world of sound is certainly capable of infinite variety and, were our sense developed, of infinite extensions. -- George Santayana, "The Sense of Beauty"
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 16148
Posted: April 08 2015 at 14:58
CPicard wrote:
Hey, moshkito, this New Age stuff is barely connected with the 70's German Electronic music. Furthermore, I still can't understand why people are upset with the presence of rhythms and beatboxes in some electronic genres: The Orb, Future Sound of London, Aphex Twin, Orbital, Autechre, etc... all come from the 80's English Techno scene, not from the 70's Berlin School! Are you aware that something happened after the 70's??? ...
Nahhh ... all music died after 1979!
PS: I have so many of those, you probably would faint watching how many of them!
It probably died when Guy Guden took his sabbatical from the radio top ten porn wars!
Edited by moshkito - April 08 2015 at 15:00
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
Posted: April 09 2015 at 05:47
moshkito wrote:
PS: I have so many of those, you probably would faint watching how many of them!
nope - I'm still conscious.
moshkito wrote:
It probably died when Guy Guden took his sabbatical from the radio top ten porn wars!
Who can forget the shock-wave that created, the repercussions of which can still be felt today. Who would have believed that some many musicians around the world would have put down their instruments to never create music again because late-night radio programme broadcasting from a small Californian radio station went off the air.
The "New Age" scene of the 80's required electronics as well as acoustic instruments and fluff piano. Little "New Age" shops stocked cassettes , incense burners, healing books, and jewelry. I found cassette tapes of Ralph Lundsten ....who btw, previously...was a more obscure artist and now, (and for a short time), was being distributed through New Age shops along with Emerald Web and the Tangerine Dream of the 80's. People would enter the store and if a conversation started because they were holding "Underwater Sunlight" in the palm of their hand, the impression I personally got of them was that they were confused. Not confident historically in the knowledge that this band had actually, at one time, recorded ATEM or that they had been part of a scene in Berlin. Suddenly Tangerine Dream and Vangelis were sugar in a cup of coffee, instead of remembering that Heaven and Hell was released in 1975 , prior to the existence of this money making New Age fluff and that it did in fact mean something different.
This New Age scene was about dressing a certain way and looking to the big sky for guidance in this world. Not to evoke something actually, but to acknowledge a spirit of the positive that would guide us all away from our daily complaining of things like "there's too much rain outside and I feel depressed", or "wow Bob, I don't have the experience of flying in a plane and I'm scared that airflight could be risky". "Oh, don't worry Tom, let the spirit take you into it's arms and guide you away from the negative things in life" Unlike metamorphosis which occurs naturally, this was pushed as a marketing tool for electronic music , sustaining ambient sounds, the smell of incense, the attitudes, and the preaching and teachings of meditation. I will hold just 1 NOTE!...while you sir, will travel into oblivion and away from the negative. If you believe in the spirit, anything you desire in life will come true. Well, I didn't need an incense burner or a 2 note keyboard ambient phrase to do that. I was still hearing Klaus Schulze X in my head as I stood outside the New Age shop realizing that this change was surface B.S. and designed for people who I couldn't relate to because they depended on the big sky for all their answers. Now it's about dancing.
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 16148
Posted: April 09 2015 at 08:01
Dean wrote:
Who can forget the shock-wave that created, the repercussions of which can still be felt today. Who would have believed that some many musicians around the world would have put down their instruments to never create music again because late-night radio programme broadcasting from a small Californian radio station went off the air.
indeed.
As usual, totally mis-informed as well!
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
Posted: April 09 2015 at 08:41
moshkito wrote:
Dean wrote:
Who can forget the shock-wave that created, the repercussions of which can still be felt today. Who would have believed that some many musicians around the world would have put down their instruments to never create music again because late-night radio programme broadcasting from a small Californian radio station went off the air.
Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 16148
Posted: April 09 2015 at 14:13
Dean wrote:
moshkito wrote:
Dean wrote:
Who can forget the shock-wave that created, the repercussions of which can still be felt today. Who would have believed that some many musicians around the world would have put down their instruments to never create music again because late-night radio programme broadcasting from a small Californian radio station went off the air.
indeed.
As usual, totally mis-informed as well!
Explain.
No need to, because you have no humor and did not even appreciate a joke.
On top of it, you do not know southern California radio history and still think that it is some kind of Mars'ian or Venusian Philosophy.
Conversation over, when you stop being rude, and agree to disagree and have a glass of wine or otherwise!
Over and out!
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com
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Do you find yourself distancing yourself from EM?
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Guldbamsen wrote:
nope - I'm still conscious.
