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Topic ClosedWhat will Prog be like in 2035?
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Guldbamsen View Drop Down
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Points: 23098 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 27 2015 at 05:21
Wow...I think a little pee came out thereLOL

"Get up, Get down, Jolene" 

Damn, now I've got it playing too, and it looks as if the music of Jolene and the title track off Close to the Edge doesn't immediately scream for a collab, but then again, I'm still on my first spin.
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Points: 5091 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 27 2015 at 05:26
Maybe thanks to virtual reality we will be able to attend great concerts we missed in the classic period, witness the Isle of Wight and Woodstock festivals, attend ELP's Brain Salad tour etc Tongue  
Too bad the programmers will likely be more interested in rendering concerts from the Bee Gees and Donna Summer Angry
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 27 2015 at 05:27
Originally posted by Guldbamsen Guldbamsen wrote:

Wow...I think a little pee came out thereLOL

"Get up, Get down, Jolene" 

Damn, now I've got it playing too, and it looks as if the music of Jolene and the title track off Close to the Edge doesn't immediately scream for a collab, but then again, I'm still on my first spin.
Well, it would require a fully-functioning progphylactic membrane to work... Wink
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 27 2015 at 05:32
Originally posted by Gerinski Gerinski wrote:

Maybe thanks to virtual reality we will be able to attend great concerts we missed in the classic period, witness the Isle of Wight and Woodstock festivals, attend ELP's Brain Salad tour etc Tongue  
Too bad the programmers will likely be more interested in rendering concerts from the Bee Gees and Donna Summer Angry
and
Originally posted by Svetonio Svetonio wrote:

Prog fans will watch via hologram (smartly made by footages from the 70s) their beloved legends of Symphonic rock (and Pink Floyd) that to play on the computer desk, kitchen table or whatever, but yet in a real size only if they will not be stingy and spend more money for the best version and if they have enough big backyard.
Plus
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

 and/or graphene technology. 
equals...
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Points: 4807 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 27 2015 at 09:31
It'll be directly plugged into the skull. It'll be like that scene in THX-1138 where the school children are visiting the museum.
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 27 2015 at 11:04
In all crystal ball gazing it is necessary to some extent to look back to the previous 20 years (1995-2015) and then the two score years before that (1975-1995 and 1955-1975) and compare the changes that did occur in those vicennial steps. We also should look at 20-year predictions made then to what actually did happen and to do that we would need to separate science-fiction invention from science-fact research and development. (...still waiting on them hover-boots). When making that kind of comparison developments of the last 20 years appear to be less of a leap than those in previous 20-year periods and from that ... and I don't think this is merely a perception, I think progress is slowing down and has been for many decades now. We experience a sharp increase in development followed by a protracted period of decline. Taking all that into consideration I don't expect that future advances will happen anything like as quickly as most people predict.

In technology predictions tend to over-reach themselves with respect to research (i.e., invention and discovery) while in the same breath underestimate how technology will develop in light of (then) current research. The technology that is common-place today is not the result of new invention, it is a development of research that occurred twenty, forty and even sixty or more years earlier, (for example the principles behind Bluetooth technology were patented in 1947 by actress Hedy Lamarr and composer George Anthiel).Smart phones are the culmination of a plethora of old "inventions" packaged in a single unit.

In the Arts things are far harder to predict, partly because it is fashion-driven and partly because it is difficult to separate small changes that are the result of the adoption of technology and big changes that are due to cultural and sociological effects. We tend to focus upon the changes that are due to technology because at present that is the main driver in developments in music and the visual arts but what they produce in terms of artistic advancement is actually very small and in the long-term inconsequential. Prog Rock was not the consequence of any change in technology (though we habitually focus on the Mellotron and Moog, Prog was not a result of that technology, it was merely an early adopter of it), it was the culmination of developments in underground (for want of a better word) trends in popular music that occurred in the proceeding decade and social changes that followed the death of hippy idealism when faced with the realities of 1970s austerity. [This is why I believe that Prog was predominately a European phenomenon, America at that time was still buoyed-up by a degree of "American Dream" optimism that wouldn't manifest itself as a dramatic change in musical form until the advent of Hip-Hop and Rap music]. Changes and developments in other music genres can be mapped by similar non-technological changes. 

Digital recording, Desktop Studios, streaming, downloading and instant access to thousands of "up and coming" modern Prog bands has not resulted in any appreciable developments in Progressive Rock (or even Rock in general) as a musical entity, nor has it created any new forms of popular music. The pre-packaged manufactured Pop Music that was first created back in the 1950s prevails regardless of (or in spite of, or as a result of, depending upon your point of view) the alleged sea-change created by the so-called revolution in how music is produced and delivered. Whatever trends exist at present are too small and too shallow to extrapolate into future development. The only near-certainty is the Music Industry will not just roll over and die, they have too much at stake and too much to lose, but that is (and has always been) of no consequence to Progressive Rock.

When we look at the current state of Progressive Rock as a musical form (and not its relative status as a musical genre) and compare that to what was being produced 20, 30 and 40 years earlier then very little has actually changed, progressive as an adjective was discarded long ago and what follows is pretty much more of the same in varying amounts of eclectic mixing. Nothing wrong in that of course - Pop Music had dined-out on rehashing the same verse-chorus, three-chord, 12-bar format for 60 years without draining the pot dry so there is no reason why Prog music cannot continue to create "new" music recipes from a broader basket of ingredients. Ignoring Prog Metal and its variants, (not because it is irrelevant, but simply because it further clouds an already clouded issue), most, if not all, the activity in what we can loosely call Progressive Rock is happening (as one would expect) around the periphery of the genre, for example in Jazz Rock/Fusion, Avant/RIO and Crossover Prog (as indicated by were many New Suggestions end-up). Whether that crossover/fusion is from the outside looking in or the inside looking out is open to debate but what it is not (creating) are any new forms of Progressive Rock that we saw when the pioneers of the genre first started fusing external musical influences into the Rock genre. 

This new-found eclecticism of melding Prog Rock with Rock, Folk, Jazz or whatever isn't a new species, nor is it anything that hasn't been tried before. While this may cause some folk to get a little humid in the undergarments, some look upon this and dismiss it as Not Prog, while many more just nod in unexcited acceptance/recognition but then respond with "So what?" This isn't complacent rejection, the result of indifference or a conservative desire to preserve all that is holy, nor is it saying that it is bad or a stubborn failure to acknowledge that it is indeed Prog but more a disappointment that the "new" is nothing new. This is not a trend from which we can predict how Prog Rock will develop in the near-future, let alone in twenty years hence. A revolution it is not but more a vicus settlement that surrounds the Prog Rock fort.

What this means is the next twenty years will look pretty much like the last twenty have done, which in turn didn't look that different to the twenty years before it - it may get a little more diluted as influences from non-Prog (mainstream or otherwise) Rock continue to seep into the foundations but unless there is (an unpredictable) injection of something-wonderful then the status quo will prevail.
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Points: 933 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 27 2015 at 12:35
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

the status quo will prevail.


I agree Messrs Parfitt and Rossi just seem to go on forever. I guess they'll still be chuggin' their 3 chord boogie even in 2035.

Edited by Green Shield Stamp - April 27 2015 at 12:36
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Points: 6446 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 27 2015 at 17:11
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Points: 1127 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 27 2015 at 19:02
The epics will be 4 hours long.
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Points: 1127 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 27 2015 at 19:03
Originally posted by Green Shield Stamp Green Shield Stamp wrote:

Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

the status quo will prevail.


I agree Messrs Parfitt and Rossi just seem to go on forever. I guess they'll still be chuggin' their 3 chord boogie even in 2035.

Fine by me.
Shake & bake.
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Points: 78 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 27 2015 at 19:22
Hopefully by then the internet will be older and more matured, and less used and abused like it is now, and hopefully it will be used primarily for positive intentions, including learning and research.

What that means is, the insanely large amounts of great 70s music that is available on Youtube will be in the hands of people who want to learn, and are inspired by it.

Thanks to Youtube, a ton of older music is preserved, and in the future more people might be wanting to find it and can draw inspiration from it for years to come.


My first paragraph is assuming nothing serious happens and we continue on more or less how we have been... But on the other hand it is possible we go through some serious event that causes society to collapse, and in that case the role of music will change drastically. 

Music would then be used more or less how it was used prior to recording for money, to pass stories and entertain.
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Points: 48654 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 28 2015 at 07:00
I'm hoping I will have the ability to listen to 15 or more songs at the same time, while reading (actually ingesting) about a dozen different texts (novels, articles, etc.), taking a dump, and mowing the lawn.
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Points: 20451 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 28 2015 at 09:20
It really doesn't matter because we'll probably destroy the planet before then.
 
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Points: 3136 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 28 2015 at 13:18
Aye - If Islam takes over they will ban all music, That's why I've got my CD collection in a prog-bunker - twenty feet down and in a sound-proofed vault equipped with the finest CD system I can afford! I will be secretly listening to Tales from Topographic Oceans below street level while people are beheaded for eating a bacon sandwich !!!

Edited by M27Barney - April 28 2015 at 13:19
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Points: 3167 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 28 2015 at 13:45
I'm going to say this with 99.99% certainty. Islam is not going to take over.
http://pseudosentai.bandcamp.com/



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Points: 933 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 28 2015 at 14:48
Originally posted by M27Barney M27Barney wrote:


Aye - If Islam takes over they will ban all music, That's why I've got my CD collection in a prog-bunker - twenty feet down and in a sound-proofed vault equipped with the finest CD system I can afford! I will be secretly listening to Tales from Topographic Oceans below street level while people are beheaded for eating a bacon sandwich !!!


Sounds like 'Tales from UKIP Oceans' might be a better choice for you!
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Points: 2720 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 28 2015 at 15:29

Looking back to 1995, I don't feel that all that much has happened. Things have shifted around a bit, but nothing earth shattering springs to mind. I'd be quite willing to extend this back even further to, say, 1980.
The real development explosion seems to have happened between 1969 and 1980 (including the punk wake-up call to prog), but since then things seems to have been settling down peacefully. Sure, there have been unusual spikes here and there (Cardiacs, Mars Volta et. al.), but I can't shake the feeling that apart from computer technology and studio trickery there's hardly anything I haven't heard (or at least haven't heard the early stages of) 35 years ago from somewhere.
Sometimes I can't shake the feeling that musically we've reached the stage where everything's already been done. So basically I don't think that things will change a lot in the next 20 years or so, but that's a good thing, because I like the majority of what I'm hearing at the moment, and it's ok be by me if it carries on like that. Beautiful music will always remain beautiful music.
My problem is that whenever I come across something that seems to be genuinely new, for these ears it seems to be bordering on the unlistenable.


Oh damn, I've only just read Dean's post who seems to be saying almost the same thing. only much more eloquently. Don't read this rubbish, waste of time. Read Dean's post instead.



Edited by npjnpj - April 28 2015 at 15:31
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Points: 20478 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 28 2015 at 15:54
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

In all crystal ball gazing it is necessary to some extent to look back to the previous 20 years (1995-2015) and then the two score years before that (1975-1995 and 1955-1975) and compare the changes that did occur in those vicennial steps. We also should look at 20-year predictions made then to what actually did happen and to do that we would need to separate science-fiction invention from science-fact research and development. (...still waiting on them hover-boots). When making that kind of comparison developments of the last 20 years appear to be less of a leap than those in previous 20-year periods and from that ... and I don't think this is merely a perception, I think progress is slowing down and has been for many decades now. We experience a sharp increase in development followed by a protracted period of decline. Taking all that into consideration I don't expect that future advances will happen anything like as quickly as most people predict.

In technology predictions tend to over-reach themselves with respect to research (i.e., invention and discovery) while in the same breath underestimate how technology will develop in light of (then) current research. The technology that is common-place today is not the result of new invention, it is a development of research that occurred twenty, forty and even sixty or more years earlier, (for example the principles behind Bluetooth technology were patented in 1947 by actress Hedy Lamarr and composer George Anthiel).Smart phones are the culmination of a plethora of old "inventions" packaged in a single unit.

In the Arts things are far harder to predict, partly because it is fashion-driven and partly because it is difficult to separate small changes that are the result of the adoption of technology and big changes that are due to cultural and sociological effects. We tend to focus upon the changes that are due to technology because at present that is the main driver in developments in music and the visual arts but what they produce in terms of artistic advancement is actually very small and in the long-term inconsequential. Prog Rock was not the consequence of any change in technology (though we habitually focus on the Mellotron and Moog, Prog was not a result of that technology, it was merely an early adopter of it), it was the culmination of developments in underground (for want of a better word) trends in popular music that occurred in the proceeding decade and social changes that followed the death of hippy idealism when faced with the realities of 1970s austerity. [This is why I believe that Prog was predominately a European phenomenon, America at that time was still buoyed-up by a degree of "American Dream" optimism that wouldn't manifest itself as a dramatic change in musical form until the advent of Hip-Hop and Rap music]. Changes and developments in other music genres can be mapped by similar non-technological changes. 

Digital recording, Desktop Studios, streaming, downloading and instant access to thousands of "up and coming" modern Prog bands has not resulted in any appreciable developments in Progressive Rock (or even Rock in general) as a musical entity, nor has it created any new forms of popular music. The pre-packaged manufactured Pop Music that was first created back in the 1950s prevails regardless of (or in spite of, or as a result of, depending upon your point of view) the alleged sea-change created by the so-called revolution in how music is produced and delivered. Whatever trends exist at present are too small and too shallow to extrapolate into future development. The only near-certainty is the Music Industry will not just roll over and die, they have too much at stake and too much to lose, but that is (and has always been) of no consequence to Progressive Rock.

When we look at the current state of Progressive Rock as a musical form (and not its relative status as a musical genre) and compare that to what was being produced 20, 30 and 40 years earlier then very little has actually changed, progressive as an adjective was discarded long ago and what follows is pretty much more of the same in varying amounts of eclectic mixing. Nothing wrong in that of course - Pop Music had dined-out on rehashing the same verse-chorus, three-chord, 12-bar format for 60 years without draining the pot dry so there is no reason why Prog music cannot continue to create "new" music recipes from a broader basket of ingredients. Ignoring Prog Metal and its variants, (not because it is irrelevant, but simply because it further clouds an already clouded issue), most, if not all, the activity in what we can loosely call Progressive Rock is happening (as one would expect) around the periphery of the genre, for example in Jazz Rock/Fusion, Avant/RIO and Crossover Prog (as indicated by were many New Suggestions end-up). Whether that crossover/fusion is from the outside looking in or the inside looking out is open to debate but what it is not (creating) are any new forms of Progressive Rock that we saw when the pioneers of the genre first started fusing external musical influences into the Rock genre. 

This new-found eclecticism of melding Prog Rock with Rock, Folk, Jazz or whatever isn't a new species, nor is it anything that hasn't been tried before. While this may cause some folk to get a little humid in the undergarments, some look upon this and dismiss it as Not Prog, while many more just nod in unexcited acceptance/recognition but then respond with "So what?" This isn't complacent rejection, the result of indifference or a conservative desire to preserve all that is holy, nor is it saying that it is bad or a stubborn failure to acknowledge that it is indeed Prog but more a disappointment that the "new" is nothing new. This is not a trend from which we can predict how Prog Rock will develop in the near-future, let alone in twenty years hence. A revolution it is not but more a vicus settlement that surrounds the Prog Rock fort.

What this means is the next twenty years will look pretty much like the last twenty have done, which in turn didn't look that different to the twenty years before it - it may get a little more diluted as influences from non-Prog (mainstream or otherwise) Rock continue to seep into the foundations but unless there is (an unpredictable) injection of something-wonderful then the status quo will prevail.


"I personally see more of the same with outré genres like Tech/Death groups dropping growls for clean vocals and other bands adhering to the status quo of Prog's now defined structures and motifs.
 
All of this is pure speculation, of course..."
 
I believe we're in complete agreement on this. Give or take a few hundred words. Wink  Seriously, it's a very good post.
 


Edited by SteveG - April 28 2015 at 18:41
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Points: 4807 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 28 2015 at 15:55
Originally posted by M27Barney M27Barney wrote:


Aye - If Islam takes over they will ban all music, That's why I've got my CD collection in a prog-bunker - twenty feet down and in a sound-proofed vault equipped with the finest CD system I can afford! I will be secretly listening to Tales from Topographic Oceans below street level while people are beheaded for eating a bacon sandwich !!!

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Points: 16148 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 29 2015 at 11:30
Originally posted by Buddy ♫ Buddy ♫ wrote:

...
Thanks to Youtube, a ton of older music is preserved, and in the future more people might be wanting to find it and can draw inspiration from it for years to come.
...
 
Should this say ... "another TON"?
 
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