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Topic ClosedIs indie rock in a cultural identity crisis?
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zravkapt View Drop Down
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Points: 6446 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 28 2015 at 00:09
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:


Also, the Wikipedia's page on Indie Rock seems pretty accurate.



"By the end of the 1990s indie rock developed a number of subgenres and related styles. Following indie pop these included... space rock." ShockedConfused
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 28 2015 at 01:42
Originally posted by zravkapt zravkapt wrote:

Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:


Also, the Wikipedia's page on Indie Rock seems pretty accurate.



"By the end of the 1990s indie rock developed a number of subgenres and related styles. Following indie pop these included... space rock." ShockedConfused
Space Rock: "... it was later repurposed to refer to a series of late 1980s British alternative rock bands that drew from earlier influences to create a more ambient but still melodic form of pop music"

...such bands would include Flaming Lips, Spaceman 3, Spiritualized and, to a lesser extent, Mercury Rev.
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Points: 90 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 28 2015 at 05:45
Interesting how Mercury Rev sound like 2 different bands if you compare their first couple of albums yr self is steam and boces to what they sounded like on deserters songs. almost completely different. I guess flaming lips made a more gradual change into something very different in the end from their early stuff too..not sure I'd call any Lips stuff I've heard 'Space rock' though?
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Points: 20471 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 28 2015 at 15:16
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Originally posted by Polymorphia Polymorphia wrote:

Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Originally posted by HackettFan HackettFan wrote:

'Indie' refers to independent. There's no "independent" way of being in opposition to the mainstream. Wasn't there something called RIO (Rock In Opposition)? Do we want to call Fred Frith an Indie musician? Or my particular favorite, Henry Kaiser? They could be as entailed by some definitions, which demonstrates how much sense those definitions ever were. If "Indie people" (whoever counts as one of those) actually thought they were going to drive a coherent musical style, let alone a cultural movement, they were sorely mistaken. I think any attempt to define Indie is nothing but cherry picking. It has always been simply an 'other' category.
Aye, Indie was never meant as opposition to anything, it wasn't "independent" as in being detached and free from outside control. Independent simply meant being signed to a small record label that was separate (i.e., independent) from the corporate giants of the industry, just as a local coffee shop that isn't Starbucks is called independent coffee shop. By that definition Island, Charisma, Virgin, Caroline, Ralph, etc., were Indie labels in all but name and thus Fred Frith would have been an Indie artist if the term had been used ten years earlier than its common usage.

There never was an Indie culture - that's pure invention, however there were several separate and unrelated subcultures and scenes whose major artists were signed to indie labels so would have been called Indie bands. See the Wikipedia page on Indie music scene for more info.

Also, the Wikipedia's page on Indie Rock seems pretty accurate.

That's certainly what the term meant at first. It eventually came to refer to a canon of sorts, then a genre (even briefly a brand of bland piano pop), so, to be fair, it's definition is pretty ambiguous at this point. There definitely is a community of artists in the tradition of building upon past releases referred to as "indie" or "alternative." I gather this is what the author of the article is referring to and the way a lot of journalists use the term.
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Which is what the Wikipedia page says, which is why I linked it.
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 28 2015 at 17:59
Originally posted by thebeastmustdie thebeastmustdie wrote:

Interesting how Mercury Rev sound like 2 different bands if you compare their first couple of albums yr self is steam and boces to what they sounded like on deserters songs. almost completely different. I guess flaming lips made a more gradual change into something very different in the end from their early stuff too..not sure I'd call any Lips stuff I've heard 'Space rock' though?
It seems that you perhaps may misunderstand what the word "repurposed" means Wink
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Points: 90 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 28 2015 at 18:57

yeah nevermind Wikipedia for a moment though, what do you personally think? 
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 28 2015 at 19:20
Originally posted by thebeastmustdie thebeastmustdie wrote:

yeah nevermind Wikipedia for a moment though, what do you personally think? 

I recognise that there are two distinct styles of music that were at different times called Space Rock.  I do not *think* that the latter Space Rock is directly related to the earlier incarnation. It is more likely that the more recent style evolved out of the 1980s neo-psychedelic shoe-gazing/dream pop scene just as the earlier style evolved out of the 1960s psychedelic rock scene. Given the close relationship between psychedelic rock and space rock this parallel evolution was somewhat inevitable.
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Points: 90 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 28 2015 at 19:48
fair enough, makes sense. However it's a tag I've not really heard used in relation to more modern (i.e. post 80s) stuff so maybe that's why I'm having a hard time connecting it with some of those bands. In most cases I doubt those bands themselves would actually refer to themselves as makers of 'space rock', could be wrong though
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 28 2015 at 21:10
Originally posted by thebeastmustdie thebeastmustdie wrote:

fair enough, makes sense. However it's a tag I've not really heard used in relation to more modern (i.e. post 80s) stuff so maybe that's why I'm having a hard time connecting it with some of those bands. In most cases I doubt those bands themselves would actually refer to themselves as makers of 'space rock', could be wrong though
Back then few bands accepted the tags they were given. Today the trend appears to be a head-long rush to grab every tag going. Google and Mr Page have a lot to answer for.
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Points: 8856 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 28 2015 at 23:07
On a related note, does everyone really see Cocteau Twins as shoegaze? It's actually only recently that I heard them called that. I had always heard them called dream pop, and thought shoegaze was a heavier variant influenced by noise rock and 80s space rock.
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 29 2015 at 02:12
Originally posted by Polymorphia Polymorphia wrote:

On a related note, does everyone really see Cocteau Twins as shoegaze? It's actually only recently that I heard them called that. I had always heard them called dream pop, and thought shoegaze was a heavier variant influenced by noise rock and 80s space rock.
I agree. (and so does WikipediaWink)
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Points: 8856 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 29 2015 at 12:38
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Originally posted by Polymorphia Polymorphia wrote:

On a related note, does everyone really see Cocteau Twins as shoegaze? It's actually only recently that I heard them called that. I had always heard them called dream pop, and thought shoegaze was a heavier variant influenced by noise rock and 80s space rock.
I agree. (and so does WikipediaWink)
I was aware of that one. Tongue
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