styx or kansas ? - Progressive Rock Music Forum

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Intruder

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Posted: March 09 2016 at 07:25

That slick pseudo-prog AOR sounds OK on the radio once in a while, but to actually put Kansas or Styx on the turntable....intentionally....well, no.

I like to feel the suspense when you're certain you know I am there.....

grantman

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Posted: March 09 2016 at 08:23

My big two faves from styx, are suite madame blue and castle walls heavy on atmosphere ,I find somewhat akin, to court of the crimson king, that is the vibe im getting of course, to each their own. My Kansas faves are Song for America and portrait (he knew) thank you everyone for your response to this thread

Edited by grantman - March 09 2016 at 08:26

Son.of.Tiresias View Drop Down

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Posted: March 10 2016 at 12:16

Welcome to PA grantman, but... What a stoopid question, I never understood why these two bands are always thrown into the same drawer.

The Kerry Livgren era Kansas is the one of the very finest rock´n´roll ever America has to offer. He with Proto-Kaw is even better. Period.

As for Styx in Prog, Styx´s 3 first albums with guitarist John Curulewski are progressive but since "Man of Miracles" just AOR-(hard rock), unfortunately. They may have thought they were prog group but not really were progressive anymore. Competent players, though. Dennis deYoung´s voice doesn´t make my day either although he is kinda intellectual, in American rock´n´roll circus as he summaries (then) American pop culture in all with his (in)famous statement documented in "Return to Paradise" video, 1996 as.... "It´s bullsh*t" Tongue

Edited by Son.of.Tiresias - March 10 2016 at 12:34

dr wu23

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Posted: March 10 2016 at 14:33

^I've never understood why they have been 'thrown into the same drawer' either but imho Kansas is light years beyond what Styx ever did. Other than Grand Illusion I can't honestly say they ever clicked with me and even then it pales in comparison to the first 5 Kansas albums. Kansas not only had some shorter rock songs that were radio friendly but were able to write some long epics also that were far better than anything Styx ever attempted.

Kansas is prog rock...emphasis on the rock part.....I'm not sure where Styx fits in.

One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin

TheLionOfPrague View Drop Down

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Posted: March 10 2016 at 20:15

dr wu23 wrote:

^I've never understood why they have been 'thrown into the same drawer' either but imho Kansas is light years beyond what Styx ever did. Other than Grand Illusion I can't honestly say they ever clicked with me and even then it pales in comparison to the first 5 Kansas albums. Kansas not only had some shorter rock songs that were radio friendly but were able to write some long epics also that were far better than anything Styx ever attempted.

Kansas is prog rock...emphasis on the rock part.....I'm not sure where Styx fits in.

Yep, I don't know where this AOR crap about Kansas comes from. Yes, ELP or Genesis also had short radio friendly songs (during the prog years I mean). Wayward Son or Dust in the Wind may be super radio friendly or whatever but they're damn good songs.

Edited by TheLionOfPrague - March 10 2016 at 20:17

I shook my head and smiled a whisper knowing all about the place

Son.of.Tiresias View Drop Down

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Posted: March 11 2016 at 03:03

TheLionOfPrague wrote:

Kansas is prog rock...emphasis on the rock part.....I'm not sure where Styx fits in.

It´s my sad duty to inform you this: The AOR crap came along with John Elefante, he turned Kansas into AOR, unfortunately. "Vinyl Confessions" album and watching the live video from Omaha, both from 1982, confirm this. After this is said farewell to Kansas... till Steve Walsh´s return many years later. Oh, how much I missed him back in the day Unhappy

Edited by Son.of.Tiresias - March 12 2016 at 03:04

uduwudu

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Posted: March 11 2016 at 04:35

Of course there is always Proto Kaw, the reincarnated pre Kansas that is I think still going. Only got a boot but it sounds like a prog rock type band to me. Not that I know what prog rock is...

Three of a perfect pair. '8.

Maybe one day some body can tell me why Kansas is pronounced Kansas But Arkansas (as in Black Oak) is not Kansas with Ar in front. ;)

Son.of.Tiresias View Drop Down

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Posted: March 12 2016 at 03:09

I mean the original Pro-Kaw´s recorded work from 1971 - 73 is better than their modern material, though is excellent still.

Tom Ozric

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Posted: March 12 2016 at 03:26

uduwudu wrote:

Of course there is always Proto Kaw, the reincarnated pre Kansas that is I think still going. Only got a boot but it sounds like a prog rock type band to me. Not that I know what prog rock is...

Three of a perfect pair. '8.

Maybe one day some body can tell me why Kansas is pronounced Kansas But Arkansas (as in Black Oak) is not Kansas with Ar in front. ;)

it just doesn't sound as cool - I mean 'Kansaw' ?? Alright if you're a lumberjack............and if you cut trees, you'll pick up Styx.....

dr wu23

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Posted: March 12 2016 at 12:13

Son.of.Tiresias wrote:

I mean the original Pro-Kaw´s recorded work from 1971 - 73 is better than their modern material, though is excellent still.

Not for me...I prefer the first 4 or 5 Kansas over the 'Proto-kaw' stuff.....though it's interesting material.

One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin

verslibre

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Posted: March 12 2016 at 18:19

TheLionOfPrague wrote:

Anyone who thinks songs like "The Pinnacle," "Lamplight Symphony," "Journey from Mariabronn," "Incomudro," "Cheyenne Anthem" and "Song for America" aren't prog ought to get an ear-check!

Kansas is FAR more a "prog" band than Styx ever was!

eBay

The.Crimson.King View Drop Down

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Posted: March 12 2016 at 18:33

Could never understand how a band that recorded "The Pinnacle" could lead the same album off with "It Takes a Woman's Love to Make a Man". Very little Styx that I can stomach, but I can cherry pick the 1st few Kansas albums to make 1 great prog album LOL

Mutiny in Jonestown : Progressive Rock Since 1987

AEProgman

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Posted: March 12 2016 at 19:21

Don't understand how they get compared together either.

Kansas when Livgren is the main composer of the songs up until Monolith and is prog to me.

Loved Styx in a different way as AOR with prog tendencies, loved songs Suite Madam Blue Suite, A Day, and Castle Walls.

Tom Ozric

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Posted: March 12 2016 at 20:46

STYX :
How can one...........

Movement For The Common Man
A Day
The Grove Of Eglantine
Song For Suzanne
Suite Madame Blue
Castle Walls

......................say they were never Prog ??

Pastmaster View Drop Down

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Posted: March 12 2016 at 20:59

Tom Ozric wrote:

STYX :
How can one...........

Movement For The Common Man
A Day
The Grove Of Eglantine
Song For Suzanne
Suite Madame Blue
Castle Walls

......................say they were never Prog ??

I don't know, to me they were clearly prog. To anyone who doesn't think Styx is prog, just take a listen to The Serpent is Rising and come back enlightened.

Tom Ozric

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Posted: March 13 2016 at 01:49

.....He who giveth Contradictions Collapse a 5 star rating - you're wrong buddy, should be 6 stars

......and Serpent will always be my fave Styx !

Cristi

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Posted: March 13 2016 at 01:53

Kansas
I like 70s Styx but beyond those years, their music got less and less interesting to put it politely LOL

I enjoy 80s Kansas a lot, I don't have any problems with their AOR years.

Son.of.Tiresias View Drop Down

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Posted: March 13 2016 at 03:42

dr wu23 wrote:

Son.of.Tiresias wrote:

I mean the original Pro-Kaw´s recorded work from 1971 - 73 is better than their modern material, though is excellent still.

Not for me...I prefer the first 4 or 5 Kansas over the 'Proto-kaw' stuff.....though it's interesting material.

Of course the first 5 albums from Kansas are superb. After having purchased "Point of Know Return" just before I went to army (19 years old) it just blew me away with its cheers superiority practically in everything, I haven´t had heard anything as brilliant in symphonic prog from America. Two keyboard player, two lead guitarists and two lead vocalists who all are superb musicians, well that´s something extraordinary and hard to beat. Frankly no other band could match their brilliance back in the day. Shortly after I had to buy all the early albums. I still enjoy all those and still give 5 stars each. Today I prefer prog that has wind instrument also as they always enrich the sound. I discovered Proto-Kaw after having listened their comeback album 12 years ago. Kansas is also the most important band in America´s prog history. For me personally the original material from Proto-Kaw is even better. That doesn´t belittle Kansas´ work in any way. Their are just different and brilliant, and that´s the essence of Prog.

dr wu23

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Posted: March 13 2016 at 16:45

Son.of.Tiresias wrote:

dr wu23 wrote:

Son.of.Tiresias wrote:

I mean the original Pro-Kaw´s recorded work from 1971 - 73 is better than their modern material, though is excellent still.

Not for me...I prefer the first 4 or 5 Kansas over the 'Proto-kaw' stuff.....though it's interesting material.

Overall certainly the most well known and prolific American prog band....still think their Kansas albums pack more melodic punch, better production, and songs than the Kaw stuff and Walsh is a better singer than the guy who sang earlier...imho. But the Kaw material is solid in it's own way.

Being a prog fan you should buy ,if you don't already own them, the first two Happy the Man albums. IMHo those are 2 superb US prog albums. Far different than what Kansas was doing.

One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin

Son.of.Tiresias View Drop Down

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Posted: March 14 2016 at 13:22

dr wu23 wrote:

Son.of.Tiresias wrote:

dr wu23 wrote:

Son.of.Tiresias wrote:

I mean the original Pro-Kaw´s recorded work from 1971 - 73 is better than their modern material, though is excellent still.

Not for me...I prefer the first 4 or 5 Kansas over the 'Proto-kaw' stuff.....though it's interesting material.

Being a prog fan you should buy ,if you don't already own them, the first two Happy the Man albums. IMHo those are 2 superb US prog albums. Far different than what Kansas was doing.

Thanks for the compliment, I really appreciate (calling me a prog fan as I´m basically a common working (more or less) man). I fully respect your opinions, and yes Kansas is more melodic and the production is top class and both Walsh and Steinhardt are better vocalists. In my younger days I would certainly have preferred Kansas but today it´s the other way. Proto-Kaw is something more serious stuff, in a way.

Thanks for advice for Happy the Man. I do own the s/t album but it´s not my cup of tea. I´d rather listen to "Happy the Man" sang by Peter Gabriel.