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Kingsnake View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kingsnake Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2016 at 08:07
Originally posted by noni noni wrote:

Originally posted by O666 O666 wrote:

I am a huge fan of Camel. Unfortunately Camel is underrated band and I don't know why?!

Originally posted by Kingsnake Kingsnake wrote:

Camel is absolutely not underrated.

Who underrates Camel?

Almost anyone into progrock knows the band, and have at least one favorite album.
I really don't like the term 'underrated'.

I agree with Kingsnake, while references are often used in rating other bands new music with their reviews in DPRP and on this site Prog/Archives,  you will always see Camel mostly used.   Had Camel been more popular in the 70s and should of been on Top of the Pops or other TV shows as regular guests, I'm sure a lot more people would know more about this band.  Genesis were not that popular, until they kept being seen on TV shows and became world wide success with loads of hits.  The same goes with Yes, King Crimson and ELP.  All these bands had huge hits and appeared on TV shows.  Camel never made a hit and stayed with their albums , they only appeared in 2 common UK shows.  So not being able to have the common radio airing as with the other bands I mentioned.  It's a shame really,  had they made a few hits, Camel would be known by more people and even hear their music on local radio stations.
 
If and when Camel had their top 40-hit with (let's say) Remote Romance or No Easy Answer, what alternative future would have been for the band. Then maybe their label (Decca) would've been happy with the band, and kept them on their roster, only pushing Andy to write more hits (and if not, the label would provide outside writers to produce hits).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote O666 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2016 at 08:11
^ Nice shot. I agree.
I want to back to Camel's music. What do you think about ICE ? Do you like it? I really like to know Camel fans opinions about ICE.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kingsnake Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2016 at 08:21
I don't think  Ice is one of the best tracks.
Sometimes I like it, but most of the times it tries to hard. It's even boring. I like Lunar Sea much more, when discussing 10 minute instrumental epics.
 
With Ice, the band set a new standard, and after that Andy wrote more long (low tempo) songs with a long guitarsolo: Lawrence, The Hour Candle, For Today.
I think I like The Hour Candle the best, but the liveversion on Coming of Age.

But rather I like songs with more dynamics and changes like Lunar Sea, Sahara, Chord Change, Liggin' at Louis, Arubaluba, Skylines, etc.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kenethlevine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2016 at 10:22
Originally posted by Kingsnake Kingsnake wrote:

I don't think  Ice is one of the best tracks.
Sometimes I like it, but most of the times it tries to hard. It's even boring. I like Lunar Sea much more, when discussing 10 minute instrumental epics.
 
With Ice, the band set a new standard, and after that Andy wrote more long (low tempo) songs with a long guitarsolo: Lawrence, The Hour Candle, For Today.
I think I like The Hour Candle the best, but the liveversion on Coming of Age.

But rather I like songs with more dynamics and changes like Lunar Sea, Sahara, Chord Change, Liggin' at Louis, Arubaluba, Skylines, etc.

I see where you are coming from but I prefer Ice to all of those.  Latimer's technical guitar prowess improved dramatically from their first album to Moonmadness, and Ice is one of the best expressions of that  Ice is not as warm as some of those other tracks you mentioned, but I gather that's intentional given its theme.

I need to go back and listen to Sahara but of the ones you mention I think Chord Changes is the best.  Lunar Sea was the only track on Moonmadness I didn't connect with that well, and it's actually the lead solo towards the end that is the part that works least for me.   I actually prefer the workouts on a few of the Rain Dances and Breathless tracks like "One of these Days I'll get an early Night" or perhaps "Summer Lightning".
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Saperlipopette! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 23 2016 at 15:29
Originally posted by O666 O666 wrote:

I am a Camel HUGE fan and ofcourse I like Camel's vocalists . I like to know opinions about :  
Why they don't have big number of fans in PA ?! Many of Progressive Rock fans ignore Camel easily. Many of Prog fans never count Camel as a "Great Band" or "Prog Giant" in Prog history , bands like King Crimson , Genesis , Yes , ELP , Pink Floyd , ... and I don't know WHY?!. 
Camel is not a "Mid Level" band . They are a "High Level" band IMO. They impressed Prog Rock music scene during their career. They deserve to known more than now. 

Don't get me wrong; I love Camel. There's a kind of melancholic, soothing mood or atmosphere to their music that makes them very dear to me. But as to why they may not be considered a "prog giant" in the same sense that King Crimson or Yes undoubtly are - its really no mystery. Debuting in 1973 they were late comers to the scene, three, four maybe five years after the bands that had established the sound and mindset to what we now have come to know as progressive rock. And their music, great as it is didn't really bring anything new to the table. Look to any other genres or musical development throughout history and you'll find the same mechanisms and logic at work. Regardless of what you think of A Love Supreme, Revolver, In The Court..., Bitches Brew or Autobahn, bands and artists inspired by these revolutionary albums won't have the same impact or historical importance. I that light Camel has done really well compared to almost any band comparable that I can think of.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kingsnake Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 24 2016 at 02:44
I read that in top 10 best selling artists of all time (including Madonna, Michael Jackson and Elvis Presley), there were The Beatles, Led Zeppelin and Pink Floyd.

That's remarkable, these bands are all on Progarchives. I surprised me to see, that these bands sold hundreds of millions of albums worlwide. I can't say Camel has that many sales.

What that means is this: when people are new to the genre, they try the bands they know the best, and that will never be Camel (or Gentle Giant or Barclay James Harvest), regardless of their musical talents.

When people are already into progressive rock, of course they now bands like Camel. So is the band underrated? Maybe worldwide, but nog amongst prog-enthousiasts.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flight123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 24 2016 at 02:53
I would agree that Camel are highly esteemed in the world of prog while never achieving the album sales of the likes of Yes, etc.  Camel were relative late-comers with their first album being released in 1973.  Here in the UK, Camel were badly exposed by the punk explosion that started by the time 'Moonmadness' appeared although that proved to be their best selling album.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote O666 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 24 2016 at 10:48
Originally posted by Kingsnake Kingsnake wrote:

I read that in top 10 best selling artists of all time (including Madonna, Michael Jackson and Elvis Presley), there were The Beatles, Led Zeppelin and Pink Floyd.

That's remarkable, these bands are all on Progarchives. I surprised me to see, that these bands sold hundreds of millions of albums worlwide. I can't say Camel has that many sales.

What that means is this: when people are new to the genre, they try the bands they know the best, and that will never be Camel (or Gentle Giant or Barclay James Harvest), regardless of their musical talents.

When people are already into progressive rock, of course they now bands like Camel. So is the band underrated? Maybe worldwide, but nog amongst prog-enthousiasts.
Actually I talked about Prog Rock fans not worldwide market or something like it. I mean , they don't have large number of Progressive Rock fans ! IMO they deserve to have more fans in Progressive Rock scene. Perhaps I mistake about it. I compare number of topics about them or related to them in PA forum with another Prog Rock bands like Gentle Giant or BJH . Most of 70's Progressive Rock great bands (Not 6-7 Prog Giants like KC,Yes,Genesis...!) have more fans than Camel. 


Edited by O666 - September 24 2016 at 10:57
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote O666 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 24 2016 at 10:55
Originally posted by Saperlipopette! Saperlipopette! wrote:

Originally posted by O666 O666 wrote:

I am a Camel HUGE fan and ofcourse I like Camel's vocalists . I like to know opinions about :  
Why they don't have big number of fans in PA ?! Many of Progressive Rock fans ignore Camel easily. Many of Prog fans never count Camel as a "Great Band" or "Prog Giant" in Prog history , bands like King Crimson , Genesis , Yes , ELP , Pink Floyd , ... and I don't know WHY?!. 
Camel is not a "Mid Level" band . They are a "High Level" band IMO. They impressed Prog Rock music scene during their career. They deserve to known more than now. 

Don't get me wrong; I love Camel. There's a kind of melancholic, soothing mood or atmosphere to their music that makes them very dear to me. But as to why they may not be considered a "prog giant" in the same sense that King Crimson or Yes undoubtly are - its really no mystery. Debuting in 1973 they were late comers to the scene, three, four maybe five years after the bands that had established the sound and mindset to what we now have come to know as progressive rock. And their music, great as it is didn't really bring anything new to the table. Look to any other genres or musical development throughout history and you'll find the same mechanisms and logic at work. Regardless of what you think of A Love Supreme, Revolver, In The Court..., Bitches Brew or Autobahn, bands and artists inspired by these revolutionary albums won't have the same impact or historical importance. I that light Camel has done really well compared to almost any band comparable that I can think of.


I'm not agree with you completely. You right about their debuting lately. Till 1973 , Progressive Rock music giants , released some masterpieces and made a new stream of popular Rock music. Camel never be a clone or copy band. They made their own style. Their music is beautiful, Emotional and Technical but they can't found too many fans. There are some Prog Rock bands that start after 1973 and found too many fans more than Camel. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote maryes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 25 2016 at 10:38
One my favorites bands :  
 
My top albums: (in order) 
 
Mirage 
Snow Goose 
Moonmadness 
Nude
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lewian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 25 2016 at 14:10
Originally posted by Saperlipopette! Saperlipopette! wrote:


Don't get me wrong; I love Camel. There's a kind of melancholic, soothing mood or atmosphere to their music that makes them very dear to me. But as to why they may not be considered a "prog giant" in the same sense that King Crimson or Yes undoubtly are - its really no mystery. Debuting in 1973 they were late comers to the scene, three, four maybe five years after the bands that had established the sound and mindset to what we now have come to know as progressive rock. And their music, great as it is didn't really bring anything new to the table. Look to any other genres or musical development throughout history and you'll find the same mechanisms and logic at work. Regardless of what you think of A Love Supreme, Revolver, In The Court..., Bitches Brew or Autobahn, bands and artists inspired by these revolutionary albums won't have the same impact or historical importance. I that light Camel has done really well compared to almost any band comparable that I can think of.

Very well explained.
And if we look at the performance in polls at PA, Camel and their albums and songs do extremely well. Camel may lose tightly against Pink Floyd in band vs. band but other than that I've seen them winning all kinds of things here.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pennsylvanian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 04 2016 at 16:57
I think "Moonmadness" is a masterpiece... though I don't care for predecessor "Snow Goose" at all.  I love the dark 'nocturnal' vibe of "Moonmadness".  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barry L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2016 at 09:46
I first saw Camel live in 1976 and more or less seen every London gig since, and have every studio album ever recorded. I used to love the early LPs when I first got into them, but as each album was released, thought they were even more majestic. That I would say is up until Stationary Traveller where I witnessed soon after it's release my no.1 gig of all time (by any band), the Hammersmith Odeon concert of 1984. I really like Dust and Dreams too but I think the albums since aren't at the same high standard. There are some excellent individual tracks, however, with the trademark Latimer guitar making them all still enjoyable. My top 3 albums are: I can see your house from here, Nude and Stationary Traveller. Anyone got any news of a new studio album?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Aussie-Byrd-Brother Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2016 at 09:55
Listening to `Breathless' right now actually!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote O666 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2016 at 10:22
I like "Echoes" , "Summer Lightning" and "Down on the Farm" more. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Son.of.Tiresias Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 10 2016 at 02:00
Originally posted by Magnum Vaeltaja Magnum Vaeltaja wrote:

Originally posted by Dellinger Dellinger wrote:

There may be many prog bands with better vocalists than Camel... but Camel's vocals have never bothered me. Their limitations can actually make them rather charming. I have heard songs from them (from the 80's, I think) with Chris Rainbow (who I have heard with Alan Parsons Project and really liked how he sang, but didn't really sound the same with Camel anyway), whom I guess most would agree is a better singer than Latimer (Latimer himself would agree, I suppose). However, the songs just don't work, they lost their charm. Actually, I like Camels vocals more than John Wetton's or Peter Gabriel's, and I believe there would be people saying they prefere them over Jon Anderson or Peter Hamill... or even Phil Collins.

Honestly, I'm not sure why people really complain about the vocals on the classic Camel records; they give exactly what the music asks for. Could you imagine a voice like Jon Anderson trying to sing The White Rider or Peter Gabriel trying to belt out Song Within A Song? I'm laughing just thinking about how ridiculous that would sound. Latimer is a perfect singer for the band. His voice is every bit as smooth and subdued as the music he sings on top of.

Exactly. Stiil, I couId imagine Jon Anderson doing a couple of the most beautiful tunes, he did make Paul Simonīs "America" stellar. But Roger Waters singing "Lullabye" ? Ainīt gonna happen ?


Edited by Son.of.Tiresias - December 10 2016 at 07:12
You may see a smile on Tony Banksī face but thatīs unlikely.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scruffydragon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 10 2016 at 03:08
Camels music inspired by the Snow Goose is the only Prog I can actually remember from my primary school days way back in the 70's.One of our teachers was rather Hip and played this kind of music in PE or when we were getting into art stuff.It wasn't unusual for him to suddenly pull his guitar from the side of his desk and suddenly break into some sort of song/ditty. Such a wonderful teacher. Magical times.
 
It was many years after leaving school that I accidently brought this album at a a car boot sale because I loved the look of the cover and when I played it some wonderful memories of this teacher and primary school came flooding back. It remains to this day my favourite album.Big smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Son.of.Tiresias Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 10 2016 at 07:30
Originally posted by scruffydragon scruffydragon wrote:

Camels music inspired by the Snow Goose is the only Prog I can actually remember from my primary school days way back in the 70's.One of our teachers was rather Hip and played this kind of music in PE or when we were getting into art stuff.It wasn't unusual for him to suddenly pull his guitar from the side of his desk and suddenly break into some sort of song/ditty. Such a wonderful teacher. Magical times.
 
It was many years after leaving school that I accidently brought this album at a a car boot sale because I loved the look of the cover and when I played it some wonderful memories of this teacher and primary school came flooding back. It remains to this day my favourite album.Big smile

"The Snow Goose" is a superb album by any means indeed. Itīs a symphony, and of one most succesfull in fusion of a rock group and an symphony orchestra, my top 3 to be exact.

I have similar memories of great music lessons back in the day.

My music teacher, an elder woman played "A Passion Play" in its entirety in a music lesson spring 1974. I was still a kid but I liked the music... Three years later she played "Songs from the Wood", full album again. No interruptions ,no breaks just a brief introduction to the music and artist, nothing else. We missed nothing, she just let the music take over. We kids actually listened to the record without any trouble. I went stunned and became instantly a fan. The best music lesson. What an intelligent and nice person she was. 

She was "The Teacher" Big smile   My fav Tull tune ever since.


Edited by Son.of.Tiresias - December 10 2016 at 08:33
You may see a smile on Tony Banksī face but thatīs unlikely.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dellinger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 10 2016 at 20:40
Originally posted by Son.of.Tiresias Son.of.Tiresias wrote:

Originally posted by Magnum Vaeltaja Magnum Vaeltaja wrote:

Originally posted by Dellinger Dellinger wrote:

There may be many prog bands with better vocalists than Camel... but Camel's vocals have never bothered me. Their limitations can actually make them rather charming. I have heard songs from them (from the 80's, I think) with Chris Rainbow (who I have heard with Alan Parsons Project and really liked how he sang, but didn't really sound the same with Camel anyway), whom I guess most would agree is a better singer than Latimer (Latimer himself would agree, I suppose). However, the songs just don't work, they lost their charm. Actually, I like Camels vocals more than John Wetton's or Peter Gabriel's, and I believe there would be people saying they prefere them over Jon Anderson or Peter Hamill... or even Phil Collins.


Honestly, I'm not sure why people really complain about the vocals on the classic Camel records; they give exactly what the music asks for. Could you imagine a voice like Jon Anderson trying to sing The White Rider or Peter Gabriel trying to belt out Song Within A Song? I'm laughing just thinking about how ridiculous that would sound. Latimer is a perfect singer for the band. His voice is every bit as smooth and subdued as the music he sings on top of.


Exactly. Stiil, I couId imagine Jon Anderson doing a couple of the most beautiful tunes, he did make Paul Simonīs "America" stellar. But Roger Waters singing "Lullabye" ? Ainīt gonna happen ?



Actually, now that you mention it, I guess it would be hard to imagine Jon Anderson or Gabriel singing these parts... but it came into my mind that perhaps Peter Hamill could do it succesfully. I mean, if he restrained himself from going all over the place with his antics, but he is a really polifacetic singer, and if he sang as in the beginning of Darkness or Plague it might have worked.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kingsnake Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 03 2018 at 04:50
Camel is currently touring Europe (at least two dates in the Netherlands - Utrecht and Den Haag).

In live in Den Haag (The Hague) and I am about to see them in a venue called De Paard, coming tuesday.
I don't consider myself a fanboy, but I'm so excited. I have never been so excited to see a band play live (maybe only My Brightest Diamond, because I have crush on her and Saga, because well it's my favorite band).

But Camel is one of top5 favorite bands and they play Moonmadness in it's entirety, wich is such a great album.
I heard the touring band consists of Andy, Colin, Denis Clement and Pete Jones.

Also Andy has a hernia and his health is not all that great, wich means he will site down during the concert. I think it's very sympathetic that he continues the tour for the fans. Such a great guy, and I wish him the best and I hope he doesn't have too much pain.
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