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Steven Wilson Insurgentes 2016 remaster

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javajeff View Drop Down
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    Posted: October 31 2016 at 16:04
Does the 2016 Remaster version sound much different?† Any better?† If anyone has this new remaster, your insight is appreciated.† Thank you!


Edited by javajeff - October 31 2016 at 17:59
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barbu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 31 2016 at 20:46
2016 rem of a 2008 release. lol
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote zravkapt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 31 2016 at 21:24
Well, the new version sounds the way he really wanted it to sound.

A friend of mine has a cassette recording of the both of us at age 13 (him on guitar, me on vocals). I've been meaning to send it to Stevie boy so he can make it sound the way we intended it to.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kotro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 01 2016 at 03:08
The original sounds fine by me.
Bigger on the inside.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 01 2016 at 03:33
Has the master of remasters run out of things to remaster so like the ouroboros he is now devouring his own tail?
"You know what uranium is, right?
Itís this thing called nuclear weapons.
And other things.
Like lots of things are done with uranium.
Including some bad things.
But nobody talks about that."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pastmaster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 01 2016 at 11:21
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Has the master of remasters run out of things to remaster so like the ouroboros he is now devouring his own tail?

"Hmmm...I wonder what I can do to make even more money that I don't deserve? I've already exhausted my stealing of famous prog bands's work. I know! I can just remaster my own albums which don't need remastering!"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Valen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2016 at 05:41
Yes - it sounds better. Not as loud and compressed, and a much more enjoyable listen on headphones.

Probably not an essential purchase unless you're a completist.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2016 at 09:24
The 2016 reissue is remastered by SW and he has taken care of the compression issues of the original 2008 issue. The new version is said to have corrections for loudness across the album, giving way to more dynamics in highs and lows meaning quiet and loud parts, rather than just loud all the time.

I have the original 2008 CD as well as the 2009 vinyl version and even with the vinyl there is a much better difference to my ears, I will not get the 2016 CD, cause CDs are krapp Wink.

If you only have the 2008 CD and feel it is brickwalled to your ears then the 2016 reissue should take care of that. At least he did not issue it as a 25 disc package with 5 versions of every song both studio and live and a 50 page hardback book with 4 DVDs and charge you $300......It's a £8.00 CD.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Meltdowner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2016 at 09:40
I still don't have the album but I'd prefer getting the CD/DVD version, since I have all the following albums on Blu Ray. I bought the boring documentary with the same name by mistake, some months ago, I thought it was the album Thumbs Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Slartibartfast Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2016 at 13:04
Originally posted by zravkapt zravkapt wrote:

Well, the new version sounds the way he really wanted it to sound.

You'd think he would have gotten it right the first time.  There's too much good stuff going on in prog for me to get it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JediJoker7169 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2016 at 17:14
Originally posted by Valen Valen wrote:

Yes - it sounds better. Not as loud and compressed, and a much more enjoyable listen on headphones.
Precisely.  It's not like the original sounds terrible, but it is fairly squashed:
Quote DR Peak RMS Duration Track
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DR5        0.00 dB    -7.93 dB      5:08 01-CD Track 01
DR5        0.00 dB    -8.74 dB      4:48 02-CD Track 02
DR6        0.00 dB    -8.54 dB      8:18 03-CD Track 03
DR8        0.00 dB   -10.58 dB      5:58 04-CD Track 04
DR6        0.00 dB    -9.91 dB      8:37 05-CD Track 05
DR5        0.00 dB    -8.53 dB      4:32 06-CD Track 06
DR5        0.00 dB    -6.38 dB      4:24 07-CD Track 07
DR7        0.00 dB   -11.81 dB      3:25 08-CD Track 08
DR6        0.00 dB    -9.46 dB      6:17 09-CD Track 09
DR8       -0.10 dB   -12.45 dB      3:55 10-CD Track 10
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Number of tracks:  10
Official DR value: DR6
Compare that to the new master:
Quote DR Peak RMS Duration Track
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DR9       -0.06 dB   -12.14 dB      5:08 01-Harmony Korine
DR8       -0.09 dB   -13.34 dB      4:48 02-Abandoner
DR9       -0.58 dB   -12.55 dB      8:18 03-Salvaging
DR11      -1.33 dB   -15.57 dB      5:58 04-Veneno Para Las Hadas
DR9       -0.06 dB   -13.39 dB      8:37 05-No Twilight Within The Courts Of The Sun
DR9       -0.06 dB   -12.70 dB      4:32 06-Significant Other
DR9       -0.02 dB   -11.59 dB      4:24 07-Only Child
DR11      -0.49 dB   -16.12 dB      3:25 08-Twilight Coda
DR8       -0.02 dB   -12.65 dB      6:17 09-Get All You Deserve
DR11      -0.14 dB   -16.17 dB      4:00 10-Insurgentes
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Number of tracks:  10
Official DR value: DR9


Edited by JediJoker7169 - November 02 2016 at 17:26
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JediJoker7169 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 02 2016 at 17:27
My suggestion, for the curious: listen to the new remaster on Spotify and compare it with your 2008 CD/download.  You will need to either turn up the Spotify stream or turn down the old CD/download to make a fair comparison (loudness matching).  If you can't hear a difference or can but don't like it, this new remaster is not for you.  If you can and you like what you hear, it might be worth it to you.  I know it is to me.  You can even buy it as a CD-quality lossless download here (and elsewhere, probably at at least one online store available in your country). (Also available as a 24-bit/96kHz download here.)
Rock On,
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote javajeff Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2016 at 03:28
Steven Wilson Insurgentes on Amazon CD does not state 2016 remaster.  I would really hate to buy the old master.  The copyright year states 2016, but I wish they would be more precise.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2016 at 04:15
I'm waiting for the next year's ultimate limited edition deluxe remixed 350 gram vinyl remaster pressed with 24 carrot gold plated molds that are actually pressed by Steven Wilson himself. Can't wait.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2016 at 05:38
Originally posted by JediJoker7169 JediJoker7169 wrote:

Originally posted by Valen Valen wrote:

Yes - it sounds better. Not as loud and compressed, and a much more enjoyable listen on headphones.
Precisely.  It's not like the original sounds terrible, but it is fairly squashed:
Quote DR Peak RMS Duration Track
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DR5        0.00 dB    -7.93 dB      5:08 01-CD Track 01
DR5        0.00 dB    -8.74 dB      4:48 02-CD Track 02
DR6        0.00 dB    -8.54 dB      8:18 03-CD Track 03
DR8        0.00 dB   -10.58 dB      5:58 04-CD Track 04
DR6        0.00 dB    -9.91 dB      8:37 05-CD Track 05
DR5        0.00 dB    -8.53 dB      4:32 06-CD Track 06
DR5        0.00 dB    -6.38 dB      4:24 07-CD Track 07
DR7        0.00 dB   -11.81 dB      3:25 08-CD Track 08
DR6        0.00 dB    -9.46 dB      6:17 09-CD Track 09
DR8       -0.10 dB   -12.45 dB      3:55 10-CD Track 10
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Number of tracks:  10
Official DR value: DR6
Compare that to the new master:
Quote DR Peak RMS Duration Track
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DR9       -0.06 dB   -12.14 dB      5:08 01-Harmony Korine
DR8       -0.09 dB   -13.34 dB      4:48 02-Abandoner
DR9       -0.58 dB   -12.55 dB      8:18 03-Salvaging
DR11      -1.33 dB   -15.57 dB      5:58 04-Veneno Para Las Hadas
DR9       -0.06 dB   -13.39 dB      8:37 05-No Twilight Within The Courts Of The Sun
DR9       -0.06 dB   -12.70 dB      4:32 06-Significant Other
DR9       -0.02 dB   -11.59 dB      4:24 07-Only Child
DR11      -0.49 dB   -16.12 dB      3:25 08-Twilight Coda
DR8       -0.02 dB   -12.65 dB      6:17 09-Get All You Deserve
DR11      -0.14 dB   -16.17 dB      4:00 10-Insurgentes
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Number of tracks:  10
Official DR value: DR9
This is over-hyped pseudo-scientific bollocks. Geek
"You know what uranium is, right?
Itís this thing called nuclear weapons.
And other things.
Like lots of things are done with uranium.
Including some bad things.
But nobody talks about that."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2016 at 09:14
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

I'm waiting for the next year's ultimate limited edition deluxe remixed 350 gram vinyl remaster pressed with 24 carrot gold plated molds that are actually pressed by Steven Wilson himself. Can't wait.

I bet if some label would do this for the Fab Four catalog it would sell out in seconds!! The previous 800 reissues of their albums in both mono and stereo would be considered rubbish LOL


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barbu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2016 at 10:48
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:


I'm waiting for the next year's ultimate limited edition deluxe remixed 350 gram†vinyl remaster pressed with 24 carrot gold plated molds that are actually pressed by Steven Wilson himself. Can't wait.

An Hand Cannot Erase remaster before that pleeease.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JediJoker7169 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2016 at 17:04
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

This is over-hyped pseudo-scientific bollocks.
No, it isn't.  I'm an audio engineer with a degree in psychology and I can tell you point-blank that it is not pseudo-science, it is not over-hyped, and it is not bollocks.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 04 2016 at 09:30
I think there is merit in the DR numbers, I use it as a guide but not a shopping guide. I mean if I want the album I am going to buy it anyway. Since I am 99% LP records I don't suffer from the "loudness wars" or the listener fatigue that can plague digital playback.
I am old enough to know the difference having grown up on LP records, cassette/R2R tape...then comes along digital (CDs, music files) and now heavy back to LP records, for me there is a noticeable difference. I have done it countless times, meaning sit and spin my records all day long into the night 6-7 hours and never feel ear fatigue, headaches or the like.....YMMV.

Looking at the DR database on this particular album it makes sense to me, the 2008 CD version DR6, Vinyl issue DR11, I hear the difference on my system.

What probably needs to be scrutinized is the measuring process of this database, maybe that is what Dean is pointing out....dunno.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 04 2016 at 11:07
Originally posted by Catcher10 Catcher10 wrote:

Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

I'm waiting for the next year's ultimate limited edition deluxe remixed 350 gram vinyl remaster pressed with 24 carrot gold plated molds that are actually pressed by Steven Wilson himself. Can't wait.

I bet if some label would do this for the Fab Four catalog it would sell out in seconds!! The previous 800 reissues of their albums in both mono and stereo would be considered rubbish LOL
Jose, if EMI thought it was a good idea, they would do it in a heartbeat in order to squeeze some more drops out of the Beatles grape.  
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