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SteveG View Drop Down
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Points: 20445 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 28 2017 at 04:08
Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:

Yeah, tribalism is the oldest ism and the root of, well, many of our problems.  Just that communists, just like capitalists, are unaware of how tribal they are.
Good post Roger. All isms are tribal, from 6000 BC (BCE) to now. It's easy to get fanatic, no matter if your side is decent or not. Also, isms tend to repel each other, causing compounded problems. There is no easy fix and I fear that there never will be one.
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Points: 9869 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 28 2017 at 08:42
If we haven't licked the problem in thousands of years, we are unlikely to going ahead.  Probably hardwired in our DNA.  What was an essential survival skill for early man is now a nuisance, sometimes a menace, that makes it difficult to work with each other.
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Points: 64319 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 28 2017 at 16:36
But tribalism is not racism, and both rear their ugly heads just as often.   The two things are completely different and seem to depend on a whole host of irrational desires and needs.   In fact the entire concept of 'teamwork' suggests there are other teams that are inferior or must be competed against.   Reagan was right: what we need is a good old fashioned alien invasion to truly bring all people of the Earth together.
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
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Points: 34550 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 29 2017 at 07:58
A fluke? Oh Micky...I am glad you don't run the Democratic PartyLOL That is a bit of a dangerous mindset.
Ah so demographics will save us 20 years from now, now 4? Bit of a moving goal post my man. 
Yes each year a new wave of young people are entering voting age, and each year a wave of people are also getting older. For the time being, people getting older > getting younger and this will be the case for a few years I reckon. We can't kick back and say in 20 years all is good, and we cant just wave off 2016 and assume oh the base will come back together. We need to be active and have a plan, and remember it aint just the WH. We saw how, sadly, restricted the PotUS can be. We can't keep winning the WH while being slaughtered in Congress (where the rust belt was already going red well before 2016). 

Originally posted by A Person A Person wrote:

Originally posted by JJLehto JJLehto wrote:

Oh yeah...gunna have to disagree. I have no issue at all bashing capitalism and the societal problems it can produce but racism is very clearly outside that. That person can't seriously claim racism is a result of capitalism, and thus....ending capitalism would end racism? That, sounds a bit silly. Racism is sadly an inherent part of human nature and I reckon will exist outside any socioeconomic system.

I would disagree but I dont want to drag the thread in that direction, but I will say that race in its modern conception is only a few hundred years old and not a part of human nature imo (and I'd further add there is no such thing as human nature).
I guess I'll just say: While I am not sure about the history of how race is perceived and what its modern conception is and all that, I find that a bit difficult to believe. I totally get that capitalism exacerbates these issues....low wage workers always hated immigrants, who tended to be low wage aka competition and this continue today. (Well now even college educated high wage white collar people are becoming opposed as they face competition from foreign educated workers....loloops guess people only like free markets so much)
But I do believe racism (prejudice against a group of people) has always been a part of history, sadly it seems inherent to human nature. 
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Points: 34550 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 29 2017 at 08:25
Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:

Yeah, tribalism is the oldest ism and the root of, well, many of our problems.  Just that communists, just like capitalists, are unaware of how tribal they are.
Indeed and that's why I can't really believe capitalism and its creation of modern race etc is really the problem. You said it, that is old as people itself and transcends everything. 

Though I will say I did mean tribalism in a more specific way, I guess it'd have been more accurate to say "identity politics". 
That's what I was thinking.  It really has f**ked everything up. That's how this "alt right" even happened. This collection of fairly diverse right wing (sometimes vaguely) groups, former leftists, libertarians...all kinda pooled into this one group. Unified by the need to identify with the same type of people, basically white people (and share a general opposition to liberalism). 
We see it on YouTube. People will arm themselves and go to war to defend some youtube person they like, no matter what they say or do, even if it means taking on racist and sexist comments. We no longer accept "separate the work and the person" and its spilled over to all of society. Everyone is putting aside XYZ 123 to rally around and defend to death their person, party, group etc
And since the parties are aligning more and more around identity, of course politics is becoming more hostile. 

538 had a great article on down ballot voting and how it was a record high in 2016, ya know the vanishing of "purple America" and honestly most are turning red. Tribalism...gotta vote GOP no matter what
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Points: 34550 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 16 2017 at 22:24
In yet another middle finger to the GOP, Trump will apparently NOT pull out of the Paris Accord now :O
I mean, good, this is great news, just the shock of it is still lingering. Being anti environment (and anti intl community) was as sincere as Trump seemed. 
Also can't lie....it's kind of hilarious. After how the GOP has been for the last 9 years it's funny as hell to see this, they must be livid. 

I doubt he's pivoting, maybe it's revenge? Maybe he realized to get anything done there's no hope in the GOP? Did he actually get and accept smart advice and is ally building (instead of isolating) to get tax cuts passed??
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Points: 2720 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2017 at 04:28
With Trump threatening to kill 25 million North Korean people in front of the UN, it somehow puts Hitler into perspective, doesn't it. Bloody amateur, he was.
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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2017 at 09:56
And unlike the Austrian boy he loves, Trump actually has the firepower to wipe off 25 million people. 

Edited by The T - September 20 2017 at 09:57
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SteveG View Drop Down
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Points: 20445 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2017 at 10:27
Confused Hitler had the power to kill 13,000,000 just in the Holocaust alone. That's not even taking in to consideration all the civilians killed in bombings and all of allied military killed in the WWII.
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2017 at 12:12
I mean in just a few seconds. 
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SteveG View Drop Down
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Points: 20445 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 21 2017 at 04:01
^That's true, but I still feel a similarity. LOL
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Points: 20451 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 21 2017 at 12:28
trump.jpg
One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
Haquin
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Points: 20445 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 21 2017 at 13:51
 LOL Rof!
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 22 2017 at 11:13
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

^That's true, but I still feel a similarity. LOL
LOL
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JJLehto View Drop Down
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Points: 34550 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 24 2017 at 22:22
Well, I said a while ago what's happening in the US is just part of a global movement (the hollowing out of the center/mainstream in favor of left and mostly right populism) and thus far it seems to be holding true. 

Germany had their election and while Merkel and the CDU won as expected, they did see a big drop off in support, as did the SDP the 2 historical parties of Germany. AfD won 13.5% of the vote gaining 87ish seats making them the 3rd largest party in Germany Shocked 

This shall be spun as a win for the centrists and sanity, and obviously good they won, but a little scary to see those AfD numbers. Even in the rock of sanity and stability right wing populists are finding success, and I shudder to think what may happen with the next crash, especially if they and Europe follow austerity again (which is likely to be the case especially with the German libertarians winning back a bunch of seats, and demanding they pick the finance minister in exchange for allying with the CDU)
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Points: 34550 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 26 2017 at 10:51
Today is the Republican Primary for the AL senate race to replace Sessions

It's widely expected that Roy Moore will win, the twice suspended Chief Justice of the AL Supreme Court. First time for refusing to remove a federal law calling for the removal of a ten commandments statue, second time for telling judges to ignore the Supreme Court ruling on gay marriage. 

He also compared homosexuality to bestiality and once referred to certain groups of people as "reds and yellows". For a cherry on top, at a rally yesterday he whipped out a gun on stage. 
And this man is almost certainly gunna be our next Senator from Alabama
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SteveG View Drop Down
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Points: 20445 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 26 2017 at 10:55
Nationalism is the new disco JJ. When people get tired of falling off their platform heals, some equivalent of punk will take over. It's all a big circle.
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Points: 15783 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 26 2017 at 12:26
Originally posted by JJLehto JJLehto wrote:

Today is the Republican Primary for the AL senate race to replace Sessions

It's widely expected that Roy Moore will win, the twice suspended Chief Justice of the AL Supreme Court. First time for refusing to remove a federal law calling for the removal of a ten commandments statue, second time for telling judges to ignore the Supreme Court ruling on gay marriage. 

He also compared homosexuality to bestiality and once referred to certain groups of people as "reds and yellows". For a cherry on top, at a rally yesterday he whipped out a gun on stage. 
And this man is almost certainly gunna be our next Senator from Alabama

Moore is a lunatic. Have you seen this from Jeff Stein's Vox article? 
Quote

Jeff Stein

Some right-wing conservatives think Sharia law is a danger to America — do you?

Roy Moore

There are communities under Sharia law right now in our country. Up in Illinois. Christian communities; I don’t know if they may be Muslim communities.

But Sharia law is a little different from American law. It is founded on religious concepts.

Jeff Stein

Which American communities are under Sharia law? When did they fall under Sharia law?

Roy Moore

Well, there’s Sharia law, as I understand it, in Illinois, Indiana — up there. I don't know.

Jeff Stein

That seems like an amazing claim for a Senate candidate to make.

Roy Moore

Well, let me just put it this way — if they are, they are; if they’re not, they’re not.

That doesn’t matter. Oklahoma tried passing a law restricting Sharia law, and it failed. Do you know about that?

Jeff Stein

No, I don’t.

Roy Moore

Well, it did. The thing about it is it shouldn’t have failed because it can be restricted because it’s based on religious principles ...

Be careful on the religion [question] because it’s very confusing. People don’t explain the definition of religion. Put it right at the top, “Religion is the duties you owe to the creator and the manner of discharging it,” per the United States Supreme Court, per Joseph Story.

When you define religion, we get it all straight. You’re free to worship Buddha and Muhammed. The reason that is free is because of Christian principles. Because of the two tables of the law — the first table can’t be directed by government. He never gave Caesar the authority over the rights of conscience.

In fact, it says it right here if you look right there, that the rights of conscience are beyond the reach of any human power; they are given by God and cannot be encroached on by any human authority without a criminal disobedience of the precepts of natural or revealed religion. ...

Jeff Stein

I’d like to learn more about the communities in America you think are under Sharia law.

Roy Moore

I was informed that there were. But if they’re not, it doesn’t matter. Sharia law incorporates Muslim law into the law. That’s not what we do. We do not punish people according to the Christian precepts of our faith — so there’s a difference.

I’ll just say: I don’t know if there are. I understand that there are some.
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The T View Drop Down
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Points: 17493 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 26 2017 at 12:29
Lol. 

Well, it's Alabama after all.
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Points: 20445 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 27 2017 at 04:09
^And we fought the Civil War to preserve this? Disapprove
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