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Yes vs Starcastle

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Poll Question: pick the one you enjoy more...
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
20 [80.00%]
5 [20.00%]
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Cristi View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 05 2017 at 12:08
Originally posted by Boojieboy Boojieboy wrote:

If there was no Yes, Starcastle would have had to copy some other band instead. I still laugh at their first album, and the rank plagiarism.

There's a huge difference between innovators and clones. They shouldn't be mixed.

plagiarism? 
you may accuse them of imitation, lack of originality, but not plagiarism.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Boojieboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 05 2017 at 12:16
Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

[plagiarism? 
you may accuse them of imitation, lack of originality, but not plagiarism.

No, I will accuse them of plagiarism because that's what they're guilty of. There are lots of bands that use familiar themes from other bands, but not to the extent they did. I'm a musician, and am very familiar with Yes' music. Analyzing Starcastle from a musician's and songwriting standpoint, I see them taking actual Yes melodies and inverting them and altering them slightly to where it's not obvious to most what they're doing. Then they add some new words to further cover their tracks. I've picked on their games and tactics. It's utterly shameful what they did. The vocal harmonizings and phrasings are also exact copies of patterns unique to Yes.


Edited by Boojieboy - October 05 2017 at 12:29
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Cristi View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 05 2017 at 12:46
Originally posted by Boojieboy Boojieboy wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

[plagiarism? 
you may accuse them of imitation, lack of originality, but not plagiarism.

No, I will accuse them of plagiarism because that's what they're guilty of. There are lots of bands that use familiar themes from other bands, but not to the extent they did. I'm a musician, and am very familiar with Yes' music. Analyzing Starcastle from a musician's and songwriting standpoint, I see them taking actual Yes melodies and inverting them and altering them slightly to where it's not obvious to most what they're doing. Then they add some new words to further cover their tracks. I've picked on their games and tactics. It's utterly shameful what they did. The vocal harmonizings and phrasings are also exact copies of patterns unique to Yes.

what exactly are those themes?
it's just Yes worship, you either like it or hate it. The same way The Watch is Genesis worship. I do like The Watch more than Starcastle though. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tom Ozric Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 05 2017 at 16:21
Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by Boojieboy Boojieboy wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

[plagiarism? 
you may accuse them of imitation, lack of originality, but not plagiarism.


No, I will accuse them of plagiarism because that's what they're guilty of. There are lots of bands that use familiar themes from other bands, but not to the extent they did. I'm a musician, and am very familiar with Yes' music. Analyzing Starcastle from a musician's and songwriting standpoint, I see them taking actual Yes melodies and inverting them and altering them slightly to where it's not obvious to most what they're doing. Then they add some new words to further cover their tracks. I've picked on their games and tactics. It's utterly shameful what they did. The vocal harmonizings and phrasings are also exact copies of patterns unique to Yes.



what exactly are those themes?
it's just Yes worship, you either like it or hate it. The same way The Watch is Genesis worship. I do like The Watch more than Starcastle though. 
So do I !!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SquonkHunter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 05 2017 at 20:01
You'll be hard pressed to find a stronger or longer Yes fan than me but I have to go with Starcastle on this one. OK, so they copied the style and sound of Yes. I don't hate them for it, I just look at it as having even more material of a style I already like anyway. They were certainly highly skilled musicians and had a very good studio sound. Their overall feel does strike me as more "cheerful" than Yes, if that makes any sense. I don't think those guys could have done dark music no matter how hard they tried. I always thought of them as sort of a "Yes light". Not as good as Yes, for sure, but certainly not bad either. Their biggest flaw was that they came on the scene a few years too late to make a lasting impression. By the time they were beginning to hit their stride, Prog was in a death spiral.


Edited by SquonkHunter - October 05 2017 at 20:03
"You never had the things you thought you should have had and you'll not get them now..."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 05 2017 at 20:06
The funny thing is Starcastle claimed they weren't even fans of Yes. They admitted to knowing who they were but they said they were more influenced by Stravinsky and classical. Lol.

Anyway, I don't know that Starcastle album so I won't vote. As a band I think they are ok. Their stuff is often a bit too overblown and not very memorable imo. Some good stuff here and there but it's sort of like Styx wanting to be a full blown prog band. Lol.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote twosteves Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 05 2017 at 21:20
Originally posted by Boojieboy Boojieboy wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

[plagiarism? 
you may accuse them of imitation, lack of originality, but not plagiarism.

No, I will accuse them of plagiarism because that's what they're guilty of. There are lots of bands that use familiar themes from other bands, but not to the extent they did. I'm a musician, and am very familiar with Yes' music. Analyzing Starcastle from a musician's and songwriting standpoint, I see them taking actual Yes melodies and inverting them and altering them slightly to where it's not obvious to most what they're doing. Then they add some new words to further cover their tracks. I've picked on their games and tactics. It's utterly shameful what they did. The vocal harmonizings and phrasings are also exact copies of patterns unique to Yes.

oh I agree with you 100%---I have never understood any interest in this band---so Starcastle is sickening to me for that reason---you can be influenced by someone but please come up with a better music. Don't copy something that is nowhere near as good as the music that inspired you.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rednight Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2017 at 08:19
Gary Strater, R.I.P.
"It just has none of the qualities of your work that I find interesting. Abandon (?) it." - Eno
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Dark Elf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2017 at 19:02
I would choose a recording of Steve Howe gargling over his bathroom sink rather than Starcastle. Even the name "Starcastle" reeks of tackiness.
And your little sister's immaculate virginity wings away on the bony shoulders of a young horse named George who stole surreptitiously into her geography revision.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dopeydoc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 07 2017 at 15:55
None, not good albums for me
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