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Trespass - an overlooked Genesis classic?

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M27Barney View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M27Barney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2017 at 05:34
I think I gave trespass five stars - as it's a very important release in terms of symphonic progressive rock and it's early evolution. Not in my top 25 though - but maybe in my top 200. And it was bettered by all the following genesis releases until ATTWT except TOTT which I feel is slightly inferior and WAW which is equal.
So You would have
SEBTP
F
NC
LLDOB
T & WAW
TOTT
not bothering with the rest as they aren't proper Genesis.....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guldbamsen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2017 at 04:29
I love Jim's review of it (man I miss him):

'5 stars Perhaps in my top 25
Trespass is a very special Genesis album. It is the only Genesis album which featured my favorite band line-up and if you look at the overall album rather than individual songs, I'm not sure they ever made a finer album. I can't overstate how important Anthony Phillips and Peter Gabriel are to my idea of the perfect Genesis. (After Lamb Genesis would fall several notches for me starting with the fairly weak Trick of the Tail.) While Steve Hackett and Phil Collins may have been technically more gifted than their predecessors, it is not technical savvy alone that makes great music. Trespass was the perfect marriage of youthful naivety, sentimentalism, band chemistry, and great songs. Everything comes together so perfectly here. After their debut, Genesis picked up their new drummer John Mayhew and gigged around working on new material and getting tight as a group. Mayhew is no Phil Collins in the technical sense but as I mentioned I welcome that. He gets the job done without overplaying and is perfectly adequate for this album. Much more important is the presence of Ant Phillips who is the heart and soul of Trespass. With his songwriting influences and gorgeous 12 string acoustic guitar playing, Trespass is awash in the same lush drapery that fills his later solo album The Geese and the Ghost. Ant is also a hugely underrated lead guitarist and his short solos and lead bursts are simply jaw dropping throughout. Gabriel is beyond fantastic with a youthful, soul-filled, passionate singing voice backed up by his significant flute passages, with probably more flute here than any other Genesis album. Released in 1970 Trespass caught Genesis up to Pink Floyd (Atom Heart Mother) in quality and while surging them ahead of Yes (Time and a Word) and King Crimson (Poseidon).

Musically Trespass is a feast for the ears and imagination, a celebration of times long gone, of medieval stories and myths. Ranging from softer acoustic sections to the aggressive rock of "The Knife," Trespass offers everything the Genesis fans needs but offers the extra delight of Phillips delicate touch and leadership. The youthful Gabriel is stunning in his intensity on "Looking for Someone." Listen to the way Banks and Phillips back up Pete during the early vocals, these gorgeous little runs dropped just perfectly, with an attention to detail every bit as effective as they would achieve on any of their higher rated albums. And I'd argue they are *more* musically pleasing on this one. Fantastic dramatic development and pastoral melodic grandeur are nearly non-stop throughout. "White Mountain" is all about mood sounding like an early lost Renaissance track. "Visions of Angels" is a leftover from the first album's sessions but was spruced up for inclusion here. It sounds very similar to the songs from the first YES album and is superb despite being noticeably different in feel from the other five songs here. Listen to the care Mayhew brings to the piece, there is certainly no reason whatsoever to feel shorted by Collins absence on Trespass. "Stagnation" was Tony Bank's favorite because it moved quickly from one passage to the next. It is perhaps the most elegant and mature piece of songwriting shifting between moods and styles. "Dusk" is a mellower favorite with lovely vocal harmonies and blended acoustic guitars over bell and flute. "Musical hot fudge" as my better half offered while we walked under the cold moon tonight talking about the album. And then comes "The Knife." Every bit as energetic and feisty as "Watcher of the Skies" or "Epping Forest" it is the transitional track from the calmer waters of Trespass to the increasingly more rocking albums ahead. Again, listening to the performances here I find Hackett having nothing over Phillips and Mayhew perfectly suited without any pretension.

Not only is Trespass a masterpiece in my book but I honestly think it may be the single finest Genesis album, at least if you are looking for heart. I think it really outperforms both Nursery Cryme and Foxtrot-both of those albums have some higher individual moments but also some lower ones. If you combined the best Cryme/Foxtrot moments you'd have another masterpiece, but compare the three side by side and I'll choose Trespass which is so much more alive! Give the new remaster a fresh listen and see if it doesn't capture your heart.'

“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tom Ozric Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2017 at 21:31
There’s something with Trespass that the other Genesis albums lack. I don’t quite know what it is, but Trespass is possibly my favourite album from the PG period.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cosmiclawnmower Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 17 2017 at 13:30
Despite being credited on the sleeve, the Mellotron doesn't figure big on Trespass at all.. much of it was written and worked up before they actually owned one (I think they had either borrowed one or there was one for use in the studio when they recorded Trespass) and I think it was just before they started recording Nursery Cryme when they purchased the ex- Crimson one.

Has anyone listened to the 'Genesis plays Jackson' 1969 demo on the 1970-1975 boxset?? it was something that I had been waiting for many, many years and for a long time thought lost.. Originally parts of 'The Movement' which was worked up whilst they were living at the Cottage and used for a proposed arts programme about the painter, Michael Jackson and contained parts which would later appear in Trespass, Nursery Cryme and the Lamb lies down.. but sadly it was aborted.. Produced by Paul Samwell-Smith after Peter Gabriel's flute session for Cat Stevens..

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thief Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 17 2017 at 00:01
Personally, I consider Trespass a stepping stone, an artistic success, and definitely a Unique piece of music. I'd rather have this naive-fairytale-ethereal vibe than saccharine compositions of A Trick of the Tail or Wind and Wuthering. Admittedly, subpar production and undeveloped songwriting skills hurt this album a bit... but still, Trespass is the first Genesis record that sends me to a pleasant, fantasy world of high castles and pre-raphaelite gardens, so beautifully hinted on the album cover. Post-Gabriel albums, while good, RARELY send me anywhere. And this is the reason I listen to prog in the first place.

But I must say this: when it comes to rating, currently Trespass might be a little overrated on Progarchives. Average of 4.16 is much higher than Benefit, The Least We Can Do is Wave to Each Other or In the Wake of Poseidon - all of them being more accomplished and progressive (also released in 1970).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BrufordFreak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 16 2017 at 19:45
Originally posted by Prog Sothoth Prog Sothoth wrote:

Man I dig "Dusk". Gorgeous little bugger.

Me too! 

Side One was good, but not great. Side Two is among the bands' best. Period. The opening and closing songs, "Stagnation" and "The Knife" are among the creepiest and powerful vocal and musical performances they ever did and "Dusk" is among the most gorgeous, purely pastoral songs (fore-shadowing Ant's solo career) containing an absolutely magical PG vocal performance--in the same league, IMHO, as that of "The Lamia."


Drew Fisher
https://progisaliveandwell.blogspot.com/
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HackettFan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 16 2017 at 16:21
Originally posted by M27Barney M27Barney wrote:

Originally posted by HackettFan HackettFan wrote:

I play Trespass frequently. I never overlooked it. It's a very rare gem. One thing you can't do is listen to any Neo Prog and hear Trespass. It really has a very unique flavor among the five, while still foreshadowing all of them. My favorites are Looking for Someone, White Mountain, and Dusk...it's all good except for Visions of Angels, which I often skip over, but even that's better than some weak tracks on some of the other five. It's so interesting hearing how they achieved such symphonic sound without the aid of a mellotron (I marvel at the same thing with Focus too).


Loads of mellotron on Trespass.....
Hmm...yes, once I look at the album info, Banks is indeed credited on Trespass with mellotron. I was confused by recollections of a later purchase of a mellotron from King Crimson, but I suppose now that this must have been for live work outside the studio. Now I ought to listen to Trespass again, as I am happy to. I had presumed that all the keyboard parts were produced by organ.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rednight Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 16 2017 at 14:44
It's pretty pure prog prototype, alright. It's been difficult for me to get into, though, but I do enjoy Gabriel's youthful vocals on it. It definitely was a bellwether as to what they'd become in a few short years.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M27Barney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 16 2017 at 04:56
Originally posted by HackettFan HackettFan wrote:

I play Trespass frequently. I never overlooked it. It's a very rare gem. One thing you can't do is listen to any Neo Prog and hear Trespass. It really has a very unique flavor among the five, while still foreshadowing all of them. My favorites are Looking for Someone, White Mountain, and Dusk...it's all good except for Visions of Angels, which I often skip over, but even that's better than some weak tracks on some of the other five. It's so interesting hearing how they achieved such symphonic sound without the aid of a mellotron (I marvel at the same thing with Focus too).

Loads of mellotron on Trespass.....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dr prog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2017 at 17:03
Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Regarding things ' like Trespass'......one of my favorites is Fantasy....especially the second one called Beyond the Beyond.

 
Love the title track. First album cooler imo. Sounds nothing like Genesis though
All I like is prog related bands beginning late 60's/early 70's. Their music from 1968 - 83 has the composition and sound which will never be beaten. Perfect blend of jazz, classical, folk and rock.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Squonk19 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2017 at 17:00
You've answered my original question folks - many thanks. Very pleased to see most of you enjoy Trespass as much as the other early Genesis albums. Overlooked? Definitely not, thankfully.😀
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Boojieboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2017 at 16:17
I love Trespass; there's nothing overlooked about it. I think it was the third album that I heard from them, borrowed from a good friend of mine, and eventually my own.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote iluvmarillion Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2017 at 02:05
Originally posted by richardh richardh wrote:

The Knife was actually inspired by The Nice - Rondo (Rutherford was a fan and brought it to Banks attention) . very Emersonesque . I never liked the Genesis Live version. Collins playing it was similar to Palmer playing Rondo in ELP. Too busy. Its needs that solid uncomplicated drumming to make it work properly.

The rest of the album is nice enough . Dusk and Stagnation stand out for me but as already said The Musical Box was a big stride forward with the added clout of Hackett and Collins (much like Wakeman and Howe elevated Yes around the same time).
That's really interesting you say that. To me the Collins version of The Knife, in Genesis Live (1973) is so much better, yet as an album, I prefer Trespass, without Collins, to Nursery Cryme, with Collins.

It's the same with Script For A Jester's Tear, which is an album I really love. I so much prefer Mosley to Pointer as a drummer, yet Script For A Jester's Tear is a much better album than Fugazi. Maybe it's the fact that the first Marillion album features their best material which they are anxious to release first.

Then with Trespass you have a situation where Anthony Phillips favours 12-string guitar over Steve Hackett, who favours electric guitar. So if Steve Hackett had played on the Trespass studio album would the album had been just as good. All you can say is that Trespass recorded with Phil Collins and Steve Hackett would have been a much different album to the album we listen to. But would it have been better? Who can say?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Big Swifty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 11 2017 at 01:50
Probably my least-played Genesis record. Some great cuts on there. The Knife is my favorite track.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HackettFan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 10 2017 at 16:21
I play Trespass frequently. I never overlooked it. It's a very rare gem. One thing you can't do is listen to any Neo Prog and hear Trespass. It really has a very unique flavor among the five, while still foreshadowing all of them. My favorites are Looking for Someone, White Mountain, and Dusk...it's all good except for Visions of Angels, which I often skip over, but even that's better than some weak tracks on some of the other five. It's so interesting hearing how they achieved such symphonic sound without the aid of a mellotron (I marvel at the same thing with Focus too).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MattGuitat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 10 2017 at 11:23
I really like and always preferred it to Nursery Cryme until recently (Salamacis and I didn't click well until a few weeks ago). I usually rank it on par with Trick of the Tail. Its definitely rawer and tracks like White Mountain and Stagnation (great track, but it could've used a little more structure) show that they were still learning how to flesh out a song properly, but tracks like Looking for Someone and The Knife show how could they were at composing at even such a young age. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lostrom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 10 2017 at 10:58
Overlooked? It is highly regarded - and rightfully so.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barbu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 10 2017 at 07:54
White Mountain, baby.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blacksword Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 10 2017 at 03:07
Originally posted by richardh richardh wrote:


The Knife was actually inspired by The Nice - Rondo (Rutherford was a fan and brought it to Banks attention) . very Emersonesque . I never liked the Genesis Live version. Collins playing it was similar to Palmer playing Rondo in ELP. Too busy. Its needs that solid uncomplicated drumming to make it work properly.

The rest of the album is nice enough . Dusk and Stagnation stand out for me but as already said The Musical Box was a big stride forward with the added clout of Hackett and Collins (much like Wakeman and Howe elevated Yes around the same time).


That surprises me, re; the Genesis live version. I much prefer the live version, mostly thanks to Collins

I love Stagnation too. A contender for best track on the album alongside The Knife.

Edited by Blacksword - November 10 2017 at 03:08
Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 10 2017 at 00:41
The Knife was actually inspired by The Nice - Rondo (Rutherford was a fan and brought it to Banks attention) . very Emersonesque . I never liked the Genesis Live version. Collins playing it was similar to Palmer playing Rondo in ELP. Too busy. Its needs that solid uncomplicated drumming to make it work properly.

The rest of the album is nice enough . Dusk and Stagnation stand out for me but as already said The Musical Box was a big stride forward with the added clout of Hackett and Collins (much like Wakeman and Howe elevated Yes around the same time).
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