What could Yes and King Crimson learn from each ..

someone_else wrote: Frenetic Zetetic wrote: Peter Gabriel and Jon Anderson are the best vocally/lyrically in my genuine opinion. They are like apples and oranges, though. Both 1st place voices and writers of a different flavor. Peter Gabriel and Jon Anderson are the two archetypes of prog vocalists. But classifying Jon Anderson among "the best lyrically" makes me laugh, cringe, or thinking that Jon and Ian are mixed up, depending on my mood .

HemispheresOfXanadu wrote: Frenetic Zetetic wrote: Peter Gabriel and Jon Anderson are the best vocally/lyrically in my genuine opinion. They are like apples and oranges, though. Both 1st place voices and writers of a different flavor. I've never put precedence on the vocal work for King Crimson. I will say I enjoy Adrian as front man more so than any other, though (TAAAALK?! IT'S AAALLL TAAAAALK...) I LIKE IT.

Mortte wrote: Dellinger wrote: ReactioninG wrote: Yes could have learned lyrics and mood from King Crimson and possibly lead vocalist approach. Lake, Wetton and Belew were so much better than Anderson. I don't always understand what Yes is getting at with their music, and I don't think they do either. It's maybe better than King Crimson but other than elements in the brilliant Trevor Horn's songs I don't pick up much meaning, it's just a bag of sonic fun. In The Court of the Crimson King is soul shaking and there are some interesting 80s ideas from Belew. Yes is like a Yes album cover, a floating island.... It's what gives Genesis the edge in that match up, by the way. Peter Gabriel was surreal but it was more grounded in human experiences and more moving in that way. For me the vocals are much better with Yes than King Crimson (or Genesis for that matter). Anderson is just one of my favourite singers, while the only I really like a lot from Crimson is Lake, and that's only when he is in the right track (like Epitaph, Court, and Poseidon). Lyrics, yeah, I guess Yes could have done better, but they actually suit the music nicely and I'm not sure they could have been improved within that context. Besides, many of the times the lyrics were not suposed to make much sense, Anderson has said that the words themselves were meant to be part of the music too... because of their sound, not their meaning. Anderson is of course his own kind, but I really love both Lake & Wetton. It´s great the present vocalist Jakko Jakszyk sounds really much Greg Lake. But on the other hand I have liked all KC vocalists, even Gordon Haskell.

I love Lake as well, though he can become somewhat annoying at times (like Schizoid Man)... the ones I love most are the ones I already mentioned, and I wish he had done more of that sort of singing later on. Wetton I never really liked so much, at least not in the 70's. I love the work Crimson did with him, but not his singing... actually, I guess it's greatly because of him that I couldn't really get into UK. Somewhat his singing got better with Asia (though the music wan, of course, nowhere near the same brilliance), at least on studio. Strangely enough, some of the few Lake songs I have heard him sing sound very nice (Schizoid Man with Crimson themselves, and Court with Asia and Steve Hackett)... and some songs I heard from him from Gabriel's Genesis sound very nice too (particularly I was never a fan of Watcher of the Skies, but the version with Wetton singing is much warmer and made me love the song). Jakko I think has been doing a very nice job with Crimson, and though mostly he sings everything very well, including Lake's parts, I wouldn't really say he sounds very similar to him. And particularly "Epitaph" he just can't do right.

Peter Gabriel and Jon Anderson are the best vocally/lyrically in my genuine opinion. They are like apples and oranges, though. Both 1st place voices and writers of a different flavor.

Dellinger wrote: ReactioninG wrote: Yes could have learned lyrics and mood from King Crimson and possibly lead vocalist approach. Lake, Wetton and Belew were so much better than Anderson. I don't always understand what Yes is getting at with their music, and I don't think they do either. It's maybe better than King Crimson but other than elements in the brilliant Trevor Horn's songs I don't pick up much meaning, it's just a bag of sonic fun. In The Court of the Crimson King is soul shaking and there are some interesting 80s ideas from Belew. Yes is like a Yes album cover, a floating island.... It's what gives Genesis the edge in that match up, by the way. Peter Gabriel was surreal but it was more grounded in human experiences and more moving in that way. For me the vocals are much better with Yes than King Crimson (or Genesis for that matter). Anderson is just one of my favourite singers, while the only I really like a lot from Crimson is Lake, and that's only when he is in the right track (like Epitaph, Court, and Poseidon). Lyrics, yeah, I guess Yes could have done better, but they actually suit the music nicely and I'm not sure they could have been improved within that context. Besides, many of the times the lyrics were not suposed to make much sense, Anderson has said that the words themselves were meant to be part of the music too... because of their sound, not their meaning.

Anderson is of course his own kind, but I really love both Lake & Wetton. It´s great the present vocalist Jakko Jakszyk sounds really much Greg Lake. But on the other hand I have liked all KC vocalists, even Gordon Haskell.

Mortte wrote: Dellinger wrote:   I was really surprised by Return to Ommadawn. If you put someone who is just starting to know Oldfield and show him his first 4 albums, and include this one as if it were one of his 70's albums, I don't think he could notice that it isn't so. I listened it first time yesterday and I have to say there are parts you can hear it´s from today. And those are that parts that I wasn´t really fond of (they are mostly drum parts). But yes, mostly it´s really great, really love those pipe organs, also what picture I have from the later Tubular Bells versions (going to listen them too some of these days) I think he has succeed in this new Ommadown much better. Going to listen it again.

I have only heard Tubular Bells 2, not the third one, but I was rather disappointed by that second one. That one seemed to be trying to create an equivalent of each part of the first one once again, but each and every part sounded less inspired, like just a bad immitation (except for a few very nice pieces). On return to Ommadawn he rather seemed to try and capture the mood again, but with entirely new music, not trying to copy the first one again.

Dellinger wrote:   I was really surprised by Return to Ommadawn. If you put someone who is just starting to know Oldfield and show him his first 4 albums, and include this one as if it were one of his 70's albums, I don't think he could notice that it isn't so.

I listened it first time yesterday and I have to say there are parts you can hear it´s from today. And those are that parts that I wasn´t really fond of (they are mostly drum parts). But yes, mostly it´s really great, really love those pipe organs, also what picture I have from the later Tubular Bells versions (going to listen them too some of these days) I think he has succeed in this new Ommadown much better. Going to listen it again.

Dellinger wrote: Mortte wrote: ^Do you like any album old band or artist has made in it´s older days? The question was not for me, but at the top of my head, yeah, Magnification, as you already mentioned is nice enough... and from the Yes camp, Out There from Rick Wakeman is indeed a great one too. From King Crimson, The Power to Believe. From Pink Floyd, The Division Bell. From Mike Oldfield, Return to Ommadawn and Songs from Distant Earth (many would put Amarok there too, perhaps above those ones).

Division Bell was an album to me that I didn´t listen at all when it came. I thought then "Take it Back" is miserable AOR-song and not like even "High Hopes" because I thought it´s solo is almost straight copy from "Welcome To the Machine"-solo. But some years after it´s release somebody put it while we are traveling in car and then I really liked Cluster One. Now I think those both non-Waters albums are ok although they not rise even close to the greatest moments of Floyd.

The Dark Elf wrote: Rednight wrote: The Dark Elf wrote: I believe King Crimson learned they should borrow Yes's drummer. Borrow? Steal? Filch? Appropriate? Commandeer? Inherit? Purloin? Snatch? Poach? Pilfer? Despoil? Pillage? Acquire? Adopt? Pick a word. Don't be dense.

Hey, look who has a thesaurus! Nice to see you're using it, and Happy New Year. And you're still wrong. Sure, Fripp suggested to Bruford that he might have a more rewardable place elsewhere towards the end of his tenure with Yes, but the latter wasn't stolen in the process. Bruford left on his own volition, citing, incidentally, his frustration with one Yes co-founder showing up repeatedly late for recording sessions. By the way, all this is common knowledge.