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mlkpad14 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote mlkpad14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 30 2018 at 12:46
Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

Originally posted by Guldbamsen Guldbamsen wrote:


Yeah I've made the same joke a couple of times before.
'Yeah so I know you're a big music fan, so I just got you some Elvis and Cradle Of Filth albums.'
'How does the music sound?'

"Use your ears and decide for yourself". Problem solved! LOLCool

Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

Originally posted by Hercules Hercules wrote:

I think we worry too much about genres. Just enjoy the music.

Quoted for truth.

In some cases, yes, but genres signify a certain style of music... the way people play it, the inspiration, the crowd who's listening... Organization is key in such a huge world of music!

Can you imagine two people talking about good "music"... "Yo, I just acquired that new Beastie Boys release!"... "Really, well I have been getting into John Coltrane!" LOL

I'd argue that's an awesome conversation, and how it SHOULD be! LOL 

I'm also a jazz nerd with eclectic taste so the above is not abnormal for me Cool

I am a jazz nerd and I love the Beastie Boys, but they should not be in the same sentence now, should they? The point is that these bands are completely different from each other, and their unifying characteristics can help everybody make sense of and acquire a taste for the music. Many don't like a certain style of music... because it is completely different.

Bruce Springsteen and Magma... Confused
Good music isn't dead; it just isn't on radio.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Squonk19 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 30 2018 at 14:08
Genres can provide a useful route map for the new explorer, and can generate interesting debate and even a sense of belonging and empathy amongst like-minded music lovers. However, if we become obsessed with them and argue which genre a certain group or album belong in, the journey to new discoveries will get very muddled.

I was as guilty as anyone when I was younger of sticking to my hard rock, heavy rock, prog rock and glam rock genres at the expense of everything else. Positively tribal in my musical tastes (and clothing etc.). How refreshing it is to appreciate all music and take it for what it is and marvelling when bands stretch themselves musically. Jazz, classical, folk, post rock, alt rock..... l'll listen to anything if the artists have something to say. The fact that I don't appreciate rap, hip hop, indie, modern pop, country and western etc. as much as the music we focus on here on this forum, is unimportant. In all those so called genres there is music I really like too.

Anyway.....I can think of lots of bands who straddle that so-called genre bridge (including Dream Theater and Arena, as mentioned) and isn't that great!
"...and the man in the mirror has sad eyes."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote noni Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 30 2018 at 14:33
I hate the guitar riffs and the roaring by singers in these metal bands. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mlkpad14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 30 2018 at 15:35
Originally posted by noni noni wrote:

I hate the guitar riffs and the roaring by singers in these metal bands. 

Your opinion is your opinion, but please elaborate: what don't you like about the growling?

Many people don't like metal music because they think it is unintelligent and vacuous. However, that is as far from the truth as possible. Pig squeals and deep growls are just another music variable, and if they are used properly - dynamics, rhythm, melody, texture, and form in mind - then they can be really awesome. As with some of the elements that you hear in music, they do grow on you; if not, then at least you can appreciate them as another component of the music world. What's more, these growls do not define metal, as many people seem to think nowadays; metal is a huge world, that has many different subgenres and characteristics. That is how it should be treated; a lot of metal is extremely technical, and being a guitarist, I can appreciate the level of playing that certain musicians demonstrate.

Now, if the sound of growling just does not sit well with you, that is fine.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Frenetic Zetetic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 30 2018 at 17:38
Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

Originally posted by noni noni wrote:

I hate the guitar riffs and the roaring by singers in these metal bands. 

Your opinion is your opinion, but please elaborate: what don't you like about the growling?

Many people don't like metal music because they think it is unintelligent and vacuous. However, that is as far from the truth as possible. Pig squeals and deep growls are just another music variable, and if they are used properly - dynamics, rhythm, melody, texture, and form in mind - then they can be really awesome. As with some of the elements that you hear in music, they do grow on you; if not, then at least you can appreciate them as another component of the music world. What's more, these growls do not define metal, as many people seem to think nowadays; metal is a huge world, that has many different subgenres and characteristics. That is how it should be treated; a lot of metal is extremely technical, and being a guitarist, I can appreciate the level of playing that certain musicians demonstrate.

Now, if the sound of growling just does not sit well with you, that is fine.

^You nailed it here IMHO.

Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

Originally posted by Guldbamsen Guldbamsen wrote:


Yeah I've made the same joke a couple of times before.
'Yeah so I know you're a big music fan, so I just got you some Elvis and Cradle Of Filth albums.' 
'How does the music sound?'

"Use your ears and decide for yourself". Problem solved! LOLCool

Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

Originally posted by Hercules Hercules wrote:

I think we worry too much about genres. Just enjoy the music.

Quoted for truth.

In some cases, yes, but genres signify a certain style of music... the way people play it, the inspiration, the crowd who's listening... Organization is key in such a huge world of music!

Can you imagine two people talking about good "music"... "Yo, I just acquired that new Beastie Boys release!"... "Really, well I have been getting into John Coltrane!" LOL

I'd argue that's an awesome conversation, and how it SHOULD be! LOL 

I'm also a jazz nerd with eclectic taste so the above is not abnormal for me Cool

I am a jazz nerd and I love the Beastie Boys, but they should not be in the same sentence now, should they? The point is that these bands are completely different from each other, and their unifying characteristics can help everybody make sense of and acquire a taste for the music. Many don't like a certain style of music... because it is completely different.

Bruce Springsteen and Magma... Confused

No I hear you dude, I'm just being a smart ass lol. I have very eclectic ears and influences, so I'm WAY less resistant to someone bringing up Gentle Giant and Wu Tang Clan in the same sentence, for example lol.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote mlkpad14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 30 2018 at 19:00
^Smile
Good music isn't dead; it just isn't on radio.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dellinger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 30 2018 at 22:02
Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

Originally posted by noni noni wrote:

I hate the guitar riffs and the roaring by singers in these metal bands. 


Your opinion is your opinion, but please elaborate: what don't you like about the growling?

Many people don't like metal music because they think it is unintelligent and vacuous. However, that is as far from the truth as possible. Pig squeals and deep growls are just another music variable, and if they are used properly - dynamics, rhythm, melody, texture, and form in mind - then they can be really awesome. As with some of the elements that you hear in music, they do grow on you; if not, then at least you can appreciate them as another component of the music world. What's more, these growls do not define metal, as many people seem to think nowadays; metal is a huge world, that has many different subgenres and characteristics. That is how it should be treated; a lot of metal is extremely technical, and being a guitarist, I can appreciate the level of playing that certain musicians demonstrate.

Now, if the sound of growling just does not sit well with you, that is fine.


As far as I'm concerned, I do love metal... or at least some kinds of metal. But mostly I don't like growling, and it's just an aesthetic thing, it just doesn't sound right for me, it's not an enjoyable sound... though lately I have come to be able to stand it better if the songs are really great. The only artist whose Growlings, gruntings, or harsh and extreme vocals in general I have actually come to enjoy (in some songs, not really all) is Devin Townsend... he just seems to nail it for me on where and how to use them.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote omphaloskepsis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2018 at 05:01
As years pass by, it's difficult for me to dig vanilla Prog Metal.  However, I like bands fusing ProgMetal with genres like RPI, Jazz Fusion, and Neo.    

For example, Native Construct and Seven Impale fuse Jazz and Prog Metal in a fresh way.

   Italian Prog Metal bands like Afasia and " La Bottega Del a Vapore" wear RPI on their sleeves, pants, and shoes.  They're Italians, they can't help it.Wink

I liked when Gandalf's Fist folded Metal into their Neo groove on "The Clockwork Fable". Especially the 3rd CD.

 Bands blending Prog Metal with folk, opera, and Kraut Rock is a good thing.  I preordered the new Therion- "Beloved Antichrist" ....a 3 hour full fledge opera with 27 different vocal roles.  Are Therion considered Symphonic Metal?

Diablo Swing Orchestra excites me because I like the Metal x Swing synthesis.  Plain prog metal and vanilla Symphonic Metal bores me.Sleepy


Edited by omphaloskepsis - February 04 2018 at 05:13
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote noni Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2018 at 07:50
Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

Originally posted by noni noni wrote:

I hate the guitar riffs and the roaring by singers in these metal bands. 

Your opinion is your opinion, but please elaborate: what don't you like about the growling?

Now, if the sound of growling just does not sit well with you, that is fine.

It's not exactly singing is it,  just someone screaming down a microphone!...  I was put off by the band Riverside at first,  but this only happens briefly...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mlkpad14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2018 at 10:24
Originally posted by noni noni wrote:

Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

Originally posted by noni noni wrote:

I hate the guitar riffs and the roaring by singers in these metal bands. 

Your opinion is your opinion, but please elaborate: what don't you like about the growling?

Now, if the sound of growling just does not sit well with you, that is fine.

It's not exactly singing is it,  just someone screaming down a microphone!

What is wrong with the latter? It still requires a lot of skill.

Try growling right now. See how it feels.
Good music isn't dead; it just isn't on radio.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dr wu23 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2018 at 11:21
Belching and farting on cue also requires skill....

;)
One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Dellinger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 04 2018 at 21:29
Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

Originally posted by noni noni wrote:

Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

Originally posted by noni noni wrote:

I hate the guitar riffs and the roaring by singers in these metal bands. 


Your opinion is your opinion, but please elaborate: what don't you like about the growling?

Now, if the sound of growling just does not sit well with you, that is fine.


It's not exactly singing is it,  just someone screaming down a microphone!


What is wrong with the latter? It still requires a lot of skill.

Try growling right now. See how it feels.


It might require a lot of skill or not, however, if it's not a pleasant sound for the music why shoule one just like it? Growling might have been cool for a one off... or for some cases when it really serves the purpose, but not overused. It's like the song "Careful with that Axe, Eugene" by Pink Floyd. I really love it, and I love that powerful scream (Ummagumma version, of course), but just immagine if a whole genre, or sub genre, of rock had been created that requires screaming out your lungs in every single song. It would have become tiresom all too soon.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Frenetic Zetetic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 05 2018 at 02:56
Originally posted by Dellinger Dellinger wrote:

Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

Originally posted by noni noni wrote:

Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

Originally posted by noni noni wrote:

I hate the guitar riffs and the roaring by singers in these metal bands. 


Your opinion is your opinion, but please elaborate: what don't you like about the growling?

Now, if the sound of growling just does not sit well with you, that is fine.


It's not exactly singing is it,  just someone screaming down a microphone!


What is wrong with the latter? It still requires a lot of skill.

Try growling right now. See how it feels.
 

It might require a lot of skill or not, however, if it's not a pleasant sound for the music why shoule one just like it? Growling might have been cool for a one off... or for some cases when it really serves the purpose, but not overused. It's like the song "Careful with that Axe, Eugene" by Pink Floyd. I really love it, and I love that powerful scream (Ummagumma version, of course), but just immagine if a whole genre, or sub genre, of rock had been created that requires screaming out your lungs in every single song. It would have become tiresom all too soon.

An entire sub genre of hard rock/metal was created in that manner - Death Metal! Tongue Check out Death "Scream Bloody Gore" from 1987. You'll hate it! LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wiz_d_kidd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 05 2018 at 10:16
Originally posted by Squonk19 Squonk19 wrote:

Genres can provide a useful route map for the new explorer, and can generate interesting debate and even a sense of belonging and empathy amongst like-minded music lovers. However, if we become obsessed with them and argue which genre a certain group or album belong in, the journey to new discoveries will get very muddled.


I agree.  Problems arise, however, when you try to classify a band as either genre A or genre B --- but not both.  Many bands have characteristics of multiple genres.  Forcing them into one or the other only causes endless debate.  This is what I see happening over and over again in PA.

Why not adopt the method used on Bandcamp, where they apply tags (as many as required) to describe how a band straddles multiple genres?  Instead of shoe-horning a band into either genre A or B, they can be classified as both genres (using tags), and can be discovered by people looking for either?  It also allows very descriptive tags, such as "Wiccan" to be added to bands for witchy people looking for such a thing, and it doesn't require the endless debate about whether a sub-sub-sub-genre called "Prog Wiccan" should be created.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote noni Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 05 2018 at 11:27
Originally posted by wiz_d_kidd wiz_d_kidd wrote:

Originally posted by Squonk19 Squonk19 wrote:

Genres can provide a useful route map for the new explorer, and can generate interesting debate and even a sense of belonging and empathy amongst like-minded music lovers. However, if we become obsessed with them and argue which genre a certain group or album belong in, the journey to new discoveries will get very muddled.


I agree.  Problems arise, however, when you try to classify a band as either genre A or genre B --- but not both.  Many bands have characteristics of multiple genres.  Forcing them into one or the other only causes endless debate.  This is what I see happening over and over again in PA.

Why not adopt the method used on Bandcamp, where they apply tags (as many as required) to describe how a band straddles multiple genres?  Instead of shoe-horning a band into either genre A or B, they can be classified as both genres (using tags), and can be discovered by people looking for either?  It also allows very descriptive tags, such as "Wiccan" to be added to bands for witchy people looking for such a thing, and it doesn't require the endless debate about whether a sub-sub-sub-genre called "Prog Wiccan" should be created.

^

I agree totally.   Often looking at new music,  bands often don't fall into the same genre of music.  Though even today, certain genres leave me confused after reading the descriptive explaination.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mlkpad14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 05 2018 at 14:37
Originally posted by Dellinger Dellinger wrote:

Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

Originally posted by noni noni wrote:

Originally posted by mlkpad14 mlkpad14 wrote:

Originally posted by noni noni wrote:

I hate the guitar riffs and the roaring by singers in these metal bands. 


Your opinion is your opinion, but please elaborate: what don't you like about the growling?

Now, if the sound of growling just does not sit well with you, that is fine.


It's not exactly singing is it,  just someone screaming down a microphone!


What is wrong with the latter? It still requires a lot of skill.

Try growling right now. See how it feels.


It might require a lot of skill or not, however, if it's not a pleasant sound for the music why shoule one just like it? Growling might have been cool for a one off... or for some cases when it really serves the purpose, but not overused. It's like the song "Careful with that Axe, Eugene" by Pink Floyd. I really love it, and I love that powerful scream (Ummagumma version, of course), but just immagine if a whole genre, or sub genre, of rock had been created that requires screaming out your lungs in every single song. It would have become tiresom all too soon.

They should not, if they don't like it. But people make it seem like it is a negative factor, one that makes metal inferior to genres like prog. Ha!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mlkpad14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 05 2018 at 14:38
Originally posted by wiz_d_kidd wiz_d_kidd wrote:

Originally posted by Squonk19 Squonk19 wrote:

Genres can provide a useful route map for the new explorer, and can generate interesting debate and even a sense of belonging and empathy amongst like-minded music lovers. However, if we become obsessed with them and argue which genre a certain group or album belong in, the journey to new discoveries will get very muddled.


I agree.  Problems arise, however, when you try to classify a band as either genre A or genre B --- but not both.  Many bands have characteristics of multiple genres.  Forcing them into one or the other only causes endless debate.  This is what I see happening over and over again in PA.

Why not adopt the method used on Bandcamp, where they apply tags (as many as required) to describe how a band straddles multiple genres?  Instead of shoe-horning a band into either genre A or B, they can be classified as both genres (using tags), and can be discovered by people looking for either?  It also allows very descriptive tags, such as "Wiccan" to be added to bands for witchy people looking for such a thing, and it doesn't require the endless debate about whether a sub-sub-sub-genre called "Prog Wiccan" should be created.

That's how Metal Music Archives operates. Prog Archives should really add multi-tagging.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dellinger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 05 2018 at 21:31
But I guess multiple tagging should be able to put different tags depending on the album. Some bands music varies very much from one album to another. Look no further than Opeth and their last 3 albums compared to their death metal ones (and then add to the difference of styles Damnation too).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Frenetic Zetetic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 06 2018 at 01:57
Open tagging wouldn't be a bad idea.

For the record, MetalArchives is absolute hell on the eyes after about 5 minutes.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mlkpad14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 06 2018 at 04:35
Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

Open tagging wouldn't be a bad idea.

For the record, MetalArchives is absolute hell on the eyes after about 5 minutes.

Not Metal Archives, but MMA: http://www.metalmusicarchives.com/

And yes, multi-tagging exists so that each album can be grouped into a different genre. Each of the artist's genres will appear right above the bio, with as many tags as necessary.
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