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If You're New to Prog, Don't Start With Rush

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moshkito View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2018 at 08:45
Originally posted by SteveG SteveG wrote:

Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

The dope wasn't bad, the music was better, and the scene? Too much Clairol and Hair coloring for my tastes and the kisses tasted awful with all those chemicals!
You kids from the 70's and 80's had it much better then my g-g-generation. The hippy chicks I hung with didn't even bath, let alone dye their hair or wear makeup!

It's different for every generation. I simply think that this generation does not have the musical ability and lyrical flow to show that they have something that is outstanding and above the norm.

That's not to say that rap is nothing, for there are some very fine things in there, but considering what is behind it, and calling it  "music" is a bit scary for me!


Edited by moshkito - April 08 2018 at 08:46
... none of the hits, none of the time ... now you know what the art is all about!
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AFlowerKingCrimson View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2018 at 11:34
I just found out that Mike Portnoy is a fan of rap. That's quite surprising to me.
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The Dark Elf View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Dark Elf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2018 at 11:41
Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

I defy anyone to find me a lyricist who is more well read and has more intelligent and thought provoking lyrics than Peart. Can't do it because it can't be done. LOL The guy has read about a book day for the past fifty years. 

From a "prog" standpoint, I would suggest Ian Anderson and Peter Gabriel are far better. Peter Sinfield is quite accomplished as well. I would consider any one of the three as poets, as opposed to Peart as just a lyricist with an occasional hard-on for Ayn Rand.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Larkstongue41 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2018 at 12:17
^ I'd add Peter Hammill to this lot. You may not like his singing but his lyrics are quite extraordinary.

A certain member on here uses a line written by Peter Hammill from my very favourite verse all eras and genres included as his signature...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote doompaul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2018 at 12:33
I must be in the minority. I completely love Geddy's 70s screeching vocals.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Walkscore Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2018 at 13:55
Geddy Lee is an amazing vocalist. Some of the high notes he hits (even in the last tour) can only otherwise be reached by professional opera singers. Perhaps an acquired taste, but that is true of so much of progressive rock. I find some of Peart's earlier lyrics to be iffy, but many later tunes have really thoughtful lyrics.

One has to start somewhere, and everyone hears things a bit differently. The more music the merrier. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote verslibre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2018 at 14:43
Originally posted by doompaul doompaul wrote:

I must be in the minority. I completely love Geddy's 70s screeching vocals.

He sounds amazing on those records. On Hemispheres and Permanent Waves, he found the perfect middle.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ProgMetaller2112 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2018 at 18:51
Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

I defy anyone to find me a lyricist who is more well read and has more intelligent and thought provoking lyrics thanPeart. Can't do it because it can't be done.LOLThe guy has read about a book day for the past fifty years.



From a "prog" standpoint, I would suggest Ian Anderson and Peter Gabriel are far better. Peter Sinfield is quite accomplished as well. I would consider any one of the three as poets, as opposed to Peart as just a lyricist with an occasional hard-on for Ayn Rand.


Neil doesn't have a hard on for Ayn Rand. In fact he is past that time in his life. He knows better now.
War is peace.

Freedom is slavery.

Ignorance is strength.

― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four



"Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Frenetic Zetetic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2018 at 20:37
I agree that Gabriel, Hammill, Ian Anderson being better lyricists.

This, however, doesn't mean Peart didn't have some cool stuff.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mortte Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2018 at 22:42
Originally posted by doompaul doompaul wrote:

I must be in the minority. I completely love Geddy's 70s screeching vocals.
Me too!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tom Ozric Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2018 at 05:04
For what its worth ; I was digging Prog ( usual suspects - Genesis, Yes, Floyd.....).
......long story short - I acquired a VHS which had Rush live (late 70s, Xanadu and The Trees...) and I was BLOWN AWAY !! Im not sure the general consensus of the O.P. is 100% kosher, but then, Im a nobody. Who cares ??

Edited by Tom Ozric - April 09 2018 at 05:04
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeffro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2018 at 05:13
Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

Originally posted by AFlowerKingCrimson AFlowerKingCrimson wrote:

I defy anyone to find me a lyricist who is more well read and has more intelligent and thought provoking lyrics than Peart. Can't do it because it can't be done. LOL The guy has read about a book day for the past fifty years. 

From a "prog" standpoint, I would suggest Ian Anderson and Peter Gabriel are far better. Peter Sinfield is quite accomplished as well. I would consider any one of the three as poets, as opposed to Peart as just a lyricist with an occasional hard-on for Ayn Rand.

Good lord, have you not heard anything after 2112? 
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Jeffro View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeffro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2018 at 05:14
Originally posted by Mortte Mortte wrote:

Originally posted by doompaul doompaul wrote:

I must be in the minority. I completely love Geddy's 70s screeching vocals.
Me too!

Ditto. His voice from then is a part of what Rush was. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoeDent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 16 2018 at 09:19
How come no one ever picks a modern band for those new to prog? It's always the old guys whose time has long passed. We need to show that progressive rock is alive and kicking, right here right now!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 16 2018 at 09:32
Originally posted by RoeDent RoeDent wrote:

How come no one ever picks a modern band for those new to prog? It's always the old guys whose time has long passed. We need to show that progressive rock is alive and kicking, right here right now!

I guess it depends on how new. I would think most people, even these days, would find out about prog through the older bands. I would guess someone even hears about Rush or Pink Floyd before they hear about Porcupine Tree or Dream Theater but I suppose it just depends. I think usually the classic bands are recommended to give an idea of what the genre is all about. Also, imo, it wouldn't make sense to tell someone to listen to Spock's Beard or the Flower Kings before hearing the bands that influenced them such as Yes or Genesis. It also wouldn't make sense to tell someone to listen to Porcupine Tree before they heard Pink Floyd or the other classic prog bands but again that's just my opinion. None of this is written in stone. I'm sure there are a lot of younger prog fans who heard a lot of prog metal bands and PT and other modern bands before they even heard classic prog and I bet some of them still haven't heard any classic prog and have no interest in them. Their loss.


Edited by AFlowerKingCrimson - April 16 2018 at 09:33
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Argos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 16 2018 at 13:35
Originally posted by RoeDent RoeDent wrote:

How come no one ever picks a modern band for those new to prog? It's always the old guys whose time has long passed. We need to show that progressive rock is alive and kicking, right here right now!
I for one, didn't even know what prog rock was until I first heard to Pink Floyd and then King Crimson. Newer progressive rock bands, while they may be quite good, just don't have that success and status that classic 70s had. For every new fan of prog, I say listen to a lot of bands simultaneously--classic or modern--so as to find their preferred sound. They may then expand into more obscure stuff at their own pace.

I myself am also quite a new prog rock fan. I'd been a Pink Floyd fan for quite some time before delving deep into pure prog almost a year ago. I still have yet to fully listen to classic bands, but have been keeping tabs with modern bands as well (Dream Theater, Porcupine Tree, Opeth, Steven Wilson, Wobbler, The Flower Kings, Plini, etc).

I say leave them to explore the genre themselves using internet rankings and lists.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atavachron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 16 2018 at 14:32
^ Great points--  how nuanced someone's musical journey can be, and why a foundation in what came before is as important in prog as with anything else.
"Too often we enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought."   -- John F. Kennedy
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M27Barney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 17 2018 at 05:43
Rush were one of the first bands I saw Live in 1978 (I saw Genesis in 1977) that's 40 years ago! Mind u they did nothing of note after 1980...like Genesis who did nothing after 1977... there is a theme here!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 17 2018 at 12:32
As a young teen, first hearing Rush in 1975-76......Prog meant nothing to me. Not even sure I heard that term or read about it in music mags. Pink Floyd was considered psychedelic rock, and so on.....

Rush to me along with Yes, Tull and Floyd was simply rock music that was different than FM radio rock like Sabbath, LZ, The Who. 
Even when Rush was releasing 2112 to PW......it was simply just great music. I also never had any issues with Ged's vocals.
During that period, you could not find a more prolific drummer that created so much excitement on stage. Neil progressed into a monster drummer and helped push Rush into its own genre....


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote verslibre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 17 2018 at 13:37
Maybe the header should be changed to "If You're New to Prog, Don't Start With 'Tush'..."
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