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Prog Rock Dogma

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cstack3 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cstack3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 15 2018 at 22:27
Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

"Bass has to be played with fingers only, or it doesn't count!"

Interesting example! 

I've been playing bass for over 40 years, and the "fingers only" seems to be brought up more in the hard rock/blues rock genre (Led Zep for example), as well as blues, jazz, fusion and some related art forms. 

Prog is one of the few idioms where bassists not only used, but excelled using plectrum style.  Listen to Greg Lake's playing on "Schizoid Man," it would be essentially impossible to play with fingers.  He strove for a sound emulating the bottom end of a piano, using round wound strings and plectrum.

Chris Squire is another famous example, and there are many more.  Mike Rutherford could go back and forth in styles, as did Squire, but his sound was mostly Herco pick on Rotosounds.  For example: 




Edited by cstack3 - July 15 2018 at 23:59
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mortte Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 15 2018 at 23:28
Prog is really stupid and out of time music. That was the dogma in the music circles in Finland in the late seventies and early eighties.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cstack3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 15 2018 at 23:58
Originally posted by Mortte Mortte wrote:

Prog is really stupid and out of time music. That was the dogma in the music circles in Finland in the late seventies and early eighties.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Frenetic Zetetic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 16 2018 at 02:30
Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:

Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

"Bass has to be played with fingers only, or it doesn't count!"

Interesting example! 

I've been playing bass for over 40 years, and the "fingers only" seems to be brought up more in the hard rock/blues rock genre (Led Zep for example), as well as blues, jazz, fusion and some related art forms. 

Prog is one of the few idioms where bassists not only used, but excelled using plectrum style.  Listen to Greg Lake's playing on "Schizoid Man," it would be essentially impossible to play with fingers.  He strove for a sound emulating the bottom end of a piano, using round wound strings and plectrum.

Chris Squire is another famous example, and there are many more.  Mike Rutherford could go back and forth in styles, as did Squire, but his sound was mostly Herco pick on Rotosounds.  For example: 



I made said post because I'm a plectrum bass player - Squire is my bass hero Tongue. Great points all around, and I totally agree. I use Jazz III XL's exclusively, btw!
Jazz fusion all day, baby.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mortte Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 16 2018 at 04:33
Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:

Originally posted by Mortte Mortte wrote:

Prog is really stupid and out of time music. That was the dogma in the music circles in Finland in the late seventies and early eighties.

Thanks for stopping in!  Keep our US President, please!  LOL
LOL Where we can put him? Well, maybe he liked to spent his next 10 years in a fridge, itīs quite hot at the moment here...

Havenīt thought Finland very hippie/socialist land, but yesterday news make me smile, there was 2000 protesters in against Trump/Putin-meeting demonstration, only 50 people wanted to welcome them...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mortte Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 16 2018 at 04:34
Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:

Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

"Bass has to be played with fingers only, or it doesn't count!"

Interesting example! 

I've been playing bass for over 40 years, and the "fingers only" seems to be brought up more in the hard rock/blues rock genre (Led Zep for example), as well as blues, jazz, fusion and some related art forms. 

Prog is one of the few idioms where bassists not only used, but excelled using plectrum style.  Listen to Greg Lake's playing on "Schizoid Man," it would be essentially impossible to play with fingers.  He strove for a sound emulating the bottom end of a piano, using round wound strings and plectrum.

Chris Squire is another famous example, and there are many more.  Mike Rutherford could go back and forth in styles, as did Squire, but his sound was mostly Herco pick on Rotosounds.  For example: 



I made said post because I'm a plectrum bass player - Squire is my bass hero Tongue. Great points all around, and I totally agree. I use Jazz III XL's exclusively, btw!
Plectrum bass playing rules!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M27Barney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 16 2018 at 12:13
Wizard Hats and cloaks...are we talking dogma or cliche?
Play me my song.....Here it comes again.......
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TCat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 17 2018 at 13:20
....and to think I was worried about digressing.....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M27Barney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 18 2018 at 02:54
I am thinking that, since, there is no single authority on the largely amorphous subject of prog. There is no Dogma! But I suppose that when you start looking into the sub genre then by nature the qualification criteria for each area could be perceived as dogma....
Play me my song.....Here it comes again.......
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CPicard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 18 2018 at 05:15
Originally posted by M27Barney M27Barney wrote:

I am thinking that, since, there is no single authority on the largely amorphous subject of prog. There is no Dogma! But I suppose that when you start looking into the sub genre then by nature the qualification criteria for each area could be perceived as dogma....


There is no single authority, but there are some common opinions that tend to become the said dogma.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Braka Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 18 2018 at 06:27
I've only read the first two pages, but found that a lot of the quoted axioms were actually fairly reasonable.

However here are some that I have misgivings about:

There was no prog after the Spanish Civil war
Camel is not Camel without Noam Chomsky
All great prog was written by people with mouth ulcers
Pink Floyd only made records because they couldn't figure out how to design buildings properly

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Evolver Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 18 2018 at 10:43
"Camel is not Camel without Noam Chomsky"
 
To Noam is to love'm.
Trust me. I know what I'm doing.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scorpius Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 19 2018 at 11:34
"Wait, Pink Floyd released 3 more albums after Roger left? They must suck."
"The Final Cut is not Pink Floyd, its a Roger Waters solo album"
"When King Crimson formed, Prog was born"

and my favourite non-prog axiom LOL - "Wait, Peter Gabriel used to be in Genesis?"
Its simple, its genius, and most importantly, its Tangerine Dream.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The.Crimson.King Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2018 at 10:51
Originally posted by Davesax1965 Davesax1965 wrote:

Quoted a lot by H P Lovecraft, incidentally. 

Who was probably not into prog rock. 

HPL might have been into this one Wink

https://mutinyinjonestown.bandcamp.com/album/the-daemons-mock-me-while-i-sleep 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mathman0806 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2018 at 11:54
Based on a comment from the one song above all others thread: 

If you aren't into King Crimson, then you aren't into prog.

Or, generally:

If you aren't into [insert a classic prog rock band name], then you aren't into prog.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Frenetic Zetetic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2018 at 13:20
"Band X is not prog, because *insert reasons that are argued as prog for other bands*"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cstack3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2018 at 23:23
Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

"Band X is not prog, because *insert reasons that are argued as prog for other bands*"

Damn, at first I thought you said "Brand X!"  I was getting ready for a fight!  LOL
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