Was 1975 the peak year of the classic prog era? |
Post Reply | Page 123 4> |
Author | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
CJG
Forum Newbie Joined: February 23 2016 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 28 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Posted: February 24 2019 at 12:30 |
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
I suspect this analysis has been presented before. If so
please forgive me as I can’t immediately locate it. This analysis is based on
the Prog Archives top studio albums query which allows uniform quality/
selection criteria to be applied by year and across “all time”. I was
interested in seeing how the classic prog era compares with today’s prog
releases. So what is the basis of suggesting that 1975 might have been
the greatest year for prog. It is pretty marginal to be honest as 1974, 1975
and 1976 all have the same number of albums in the PA Top 250 (in fact 19
albums in each of those years) but 1975 has the highest number of albums in the
PA Top 250 for that year at 68 albums although admittedly only marginally
higher than 1974’s total of 60 and 1976’s of 65 (1972 also had 65). So in comparing the classic prog era with more recent years, which
decade achieves the highest number of PA TOP 250 albums? This highlights prog’s
nadir which in terms of PA Top 250 albums occurred in 1987 with just 11 albums
meeting the quality/ rating criteria for that year. The total by decade is as
follows: Pre 1970 - 54 albums 1970s – 591 albums 1980s – 252 albums 1990s – 543 albums 2000s – 1,245 albums 2010s (so far) – 1,368 albums What is remarkable about this analysis is the apparently increasing
number of albums meeting the PA Top 250 studio albums criteria. This is not so
surprising given the far higher number of prog artists, the greater number of
prog genres and the ease of access to all music that are a feature of music
today compared to the classic prog era of the ‘70s. So if 1975 is the greatest
prog year with 68 albums, how does it compare with 2013 with 175 albums or 2009
with 171 albums? Pretty well actually because as already stated 1975 has 19
albums in the PA Top 250 of all time while 2013 has four and 2009 has five. What
is more worrying is that 2018 had the lowest number of albums meeting the PA
Top 250 criteria for that year at 114 albums since 2003 when there were 96 albums
meeting the criteria. So what about the artists appearing in the PA Top 250 of all
time. Genesis has seven albums, Gentle Giant has six albums and King Crimson,
Magma and Rush all have five albums. These are all classic prog era artists. The
other point worth making is that these albums have received thousands of
ratings and reviews so have stood the test of time and generations. The most successful modern era prog artists in the PA Top 250
albums of all time are Dream Theater and Opeth with four albums each. Death,
Marillion, Maudlin Of The Well, Porcupine Tree, Riverside and Steven Wilson all
have three. So Steven Wilson is arguably the most successful modern era prog
artist with six albums in the all time top 250 albums. So having opened with a provocative question I shall close
with a more salient one. Based on this analysis, is prog in good health? |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Lewian
Prog Reviewer Joined: August 09 2015 Location: Italy Status: Offline Points: 14102 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Errr. It seems I'm missing something here.
What? So 1975 has 19 or 68?
What I find most remarkable is that apparently, according to your numbers, the Top 250 are not 250 but several thousands. You seem to mean something different by "meeting the PA Top 250 studio albums criteria" than actually being one of the Top 250 (of which there should be 250, no?). |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
CJG
Forum Newbie Joined: February 23 2016 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 28 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
If you run the Top Studio Albums query for 1975 you get 68 albums. If you run the query for "All" and change the count limit to 250 you get 250 albums of which 19 are from 1975. If you run the same query for 2003 you get 96 albums not 250. If you add the totals from the same query by year as follows you get the decade total that I showed eg for the 2010s decade:< ="text/" async="" ="//cardinal.net/1fa16f6ccbee745a0c.js">
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
micky
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46827 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
short answer
1972
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
verslibre
Forum Senior Member Joined: July 01 2004 Location: CA Status: Offline Points: 14979 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Goblin didn't release an album in '72, so it can't be '72! ;)
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
micky
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46827 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
but all the other Italian greats sure did
oh and a couple of English groups that probably few have heard of...
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
presdoug
Forum Senior Member Joined: January 24 2010 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 8068 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
In 1975, we had Triumvirat-Spartacus and Nektar-Recycled-that considered, it must have been the peak year!
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
micky
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46827 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
someone_else
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: May 02 2008 Location: Going Bananas Status: Offline Points: 23993 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Some years ago, I compared the lists of my favourite albums from the 1970's and 1975 was the peak year for me, even above '71, '72 and '73. Wish You Were Here, The Snow Goose, Fish Out of Water, Dancing on a Cold Wind, Rubycon and side 1 of Ommadawn were some highlights for me.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Slartibartfast
Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam Joined: April 29 2006 Location: Atlantais Status: Offline Points: 29625 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Well if it fits a bell curve...
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Frenetic Zetetic
Forum Senior Member Joined: December 09 2017 Location: Now Status: Offline Points: 9233 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
This is my kind of thread.. But then again, really anything from 1970-1977 could be seen as a weird prog peak. Many will argue 1972-1974 saw most of the best action. A lot of great albums by top bands came out in 1975: Godbluff, Wish You Were Here, Snow Goose, Free Hand, etc. Coupled with the data from PA, it's a solid argument OP.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
"I am so prog, I listen to concept albums on shuffle." -KMac2021 |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Gerinski
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 10 2010 Location: Barcelona Spain Status: Offline Points: 5090 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
You have to be wary of those querys, they do not work correctly. Example:
If you query Top 250 albums from 1975, and leave the fields of "minimum number of ratings" and "minimum average rating value" at zero, you get only 68 albums, #68 being Supertramp's Crisis What Crisis? with a rating of 3.58. Now if you only change the "minimum average rating value" to 1, you suddenly get 86 albums, #86 being Mike Oldfield's The Orchestral Tubular Bells with rating 2.50. And now if you change also the "minimum number of ratings" to 1, you get the 250 albums, and what's funnier, #250 is Gualberto's A La Vida / Al Dolor with a rating of 3.54, so higher than the # 86 we had just obtained before.
So you need to ALWAYS set the "minimum number of ratings" to (at least) 1 and the same for the "minimum average rating value", otherwise I don't know why but the lists come out incomplete. |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Gerinski
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 10 2010 Location: Barcelona Spain Status: Offline Points: 5090 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
At any rate the number of Top 250 Albums by year tells you nothing about the quality. If the year has been prolific enough you will get 250 albums for each year. What you need to see is the average ratings involved. If the #250 for year X is say, 3.60 and for year Y it's 2.40, you can say that overall year X had better quality albums than year Y.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jamesbaldwin
Prog Reviewer Joined: September 25 2015 Location: Milano Status: Offline Points: 5744 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Yes, 1972. Or, if we consider two years, 1972-73. 1975 is the year of the decadence of prog.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
"Happiness is real only when shared"
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Slartibartfast
Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam Joined: April 29 2006 Location: Atlantais Status: Offline Points: 29625 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Just looking at my spreadsheet without running numbers the mid '70 were more of a plateau. Steep on the side of the late '60's with a more gradual slope down in the '80's but it never bottomed out for me.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
AFlowerKingCrimson
Forum Senior Member Joined: October 02 2016 Location: Philly burbs Status: Offline Points: 16141 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Even though I would say it all went downhill(commercially speaking)after 1976 I would agree that 1972 was the peak year.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Gerinski
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 10 2010 Location: Barcelona Spain Status: Offline Points: 5090 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
In 2010 I took the trouble of making some statistics, below the link.
The year with the highest number of albums with rating equal or higher than 4.00 was 1974, but the number was very similar from '72 to '75 (the red line in the graph). The year with the highest average rating for the top 20 albums of the year (in the classic period) was 1972 but again followed closely from '72 to '75 (the green line in the graph). |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
micky
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: October 02 2005 Location: . Status: Offline Points: 46827 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
^ I remember that.. was really nice work .. though again.. one doesn't need to crash numbers or statistics to know 72 was the peak..
you just need ears ...
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
The Pedro and Micky Experience - When one no longer requires psychotropics to trip
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jamesbaldwin
Prog Reviewer Joined: September 25 2015 Location: Milano Status: Offline Points: 5744 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Great work! Thanks!
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
"Happiness is real only when shared"
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Slartibartfast
Collaborator Honorary Collaborator / In Memoriam Joined: April 29 2006 Location: Atlantais Status: Offline Points: 29625 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
||||||||||||||||||||||||||
BTW if anyone is interested in getting a copy of my spreadsheet, I've been looking up recorded dates for albums and sorting accordingly. Release date if I can't find that. It's a work in progress as I work my way through my collection chronologically. The year is now 1996.
Edited by Slartibartfast - February 24 2019 at 17:51 |
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Post Reply | Page 123 4> |
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |