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Mozart or Shakespear

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Poll Question: Whom wrote/ composed the best fantasys
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
7 [41.18%]
10 [58.82%]
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dr wu23 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dr wu23 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 25 2019 at 15:39
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 27 2019 at 08:07
Hi,

Not sure this poll will go too well here ... I keep thinking that many folks have not heard Mozart enough to even compare to reading a play or two, which most kids in school today, find ... boring! 

I had heard Mozart by the dozen by the time I was ten. I had read 6 plays before I even got to college, and ended up reading more than 15 of his plays.

The comparison is strange, specially in a forum that likes "progressive" something or other. Both the writer and the musician were PROGRESSIVE in their time, and they helped spread the strength of the word (Willie) and music (Mozart) and as such, they both deserve to be way up there ... away from "preferences" and the "likes and dislikes".

Not sure I can even take this poll seriously ... even in a fun board!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fischman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 26 2019 at 13:50
In most cases between the two, I'd go with Mozart. 

But as great as Mozart's operas were, it's his symphonies, concertos, and chamber works that are what draw me to him.  Meanwhile, those are two killer plays.  In this case, against my own grain, I go with Shakespeare.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 26 2019 at 15:52
I prefer Shakespears Sister. Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 03 2019 at 08:18
Originally posted by Fischman Fischman wrote:

In most cases between the two, I'd go with Mozart. 

But as great as Mozart's operas were, it's his symphonies, concertos, and chamber works that are what draw me to him.  Meanwhile, those are two killer plays.  In this case, against my own grain, I go with Shakespeare.  

In Peter Greenaway's PROSPERO'S BOOKS there are moments that are just incredible and amazing ... and one of them is listening to Sir Gielgud do his thing with words ... he makes it sound so smooth and easy, that understanding them is not an issue, something that is really hard to put together when you and I are reading Shakespeare. We can make sense of a sentence or two but all of a sudden the continuity into the next set of lines and words is ... ??? what happened? ... all of a sudden, you do not have any questions what is being said.

My thoughts are that you have to get off the pentameter and this and that in poetry, and just enjoy the flow and freedom of the words and thoughts ... 

It's not "better" than Mozart ... it's almost similar, in that your imagination can easily fly left and right ... and that is always my favorite stuff in any literature.


Edited by moshkito - December 03 2019 at 08:19
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chaser Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 03 2019 at 08:21
The bard
Songs cast a light on you
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BaldJean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December 03 2019 at 11:52
the musical equivalent of Shakespeare is not Mozart but Bach. and Bach was a freemason too


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LAM-SGC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2020 at 17:33
Ralph Vaughan Williams and Sean O'Casey
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mortte Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2020 at 22:31
I have read some Shakesbeer, but not knowing much about his life. Loved anyway those plays! Mozart is not my fav classical composer, but Don Giovanni & Requem are masterpieces! Also the movie from his life, how much it really has truth, was very entertaining. So itīs Mozart.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Davesax1965 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 09 2020 at 03:44
Perhaps I should point out that it's actually 

"ShakespearE" and not "Shakespear". 

Which sort of sets the tone for the level of informed debate. ;-)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Mortte Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 09 2020 at 03:55
^Is Mozart really Mozard? Or Mozarella?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 09 2020 at 07:51
Hi,

In this day and age, and I am a Directing Major in Theater, I did not think, and I am not sure that most people ever read the plays or actually listen to anything Mozart ... you just know that one is gonna get ... gawd ... too many lyrics and long winded! ... and the other ... gee can you shut that violin off? Because it ends up being "too much" and longer than 3 or 4 minutes ... excuse me ... longer than 6 or 7 minutes (we're progressive here!) ... and the appreciation for both kinda goes weird ... 

I prefer Willie, but I have no problems with the wording or the long this and that ... speaking it so you and I can relate to it (tell the English Dept to shove the Iambic Puta Meter where the sun don't shine!) and so many great actors in the past 50 years have done to make sure we hear and understand what it is about ... while listening to Mozart, after 5 different things, I can't help thinking that the rest is just stuff figuring out what all this music is about ... how different can I make it ... or what happens if I change this note! 

Willie is way more than that, although I am more of the opinion that too much of it has been "decomposed" so academics can create in their imagination that THE GLOBE was not a place where you and I went to get drunk and enjoy some bawdy stuff, and maybe pick up a girl, or vice versa! Willie, could not have been something for the upper class, that the audience of poor folks could not understand ... and all these English Departments saying talking like all these folks, half drunk many times were there for the poetry ... is just weird ... we don't do that here ... no one shows up for poetry ... it's way too weird and no one understands it or knows what it is about!

But I still like the wording better than the Mozart stuff!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LAM-SGC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2020 at 13:33
Originally posted by Davesax1965 Davesax1965 wrote:

Perhaps I should point out that it's actually 

"ShakespearE" and not "Shakespear". 

Which sort of sets the tone for the level of informed debate. ;-)


Actually, there are several accepted spellings. And no one knows for sure which one is correct because in his lifetime he spelled it in various ways himself, if indeed he even existed.   

Edited by LAM-SGC - February 10 2020 at 13:33
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote geekfreak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 15 2020 at 13:18
Theses two incredible iconic men are truly extremely different sprees playwright and a composer both are sheer genius within there genre of expertise...but for the poll my vote goes to Mozart
Woot woot its almost 2021 here`s hoping for a better year than 2020
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 15 2020 at 13:21
I once went to an art gallery. That's the Mozart I've ever seen in one day. Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shadowyzard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2020 at 04:37
I'll take Beethoven & Shakespeare. Ying Yang
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dr wu23 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2020 at 08:25
Originally posted by LAM-SGC LAM-SGC wrote:

Originally posted by Davesax1965 Davesax1965 wrote:

Perhaps I should point out that it's actually 

"ShakespearE" and not "Shakespear". 

Which sort of sets the tone for the level of informed debate. ;-)


Actually, there are several accepted spellings. And no one knows for sure which one is correct because in his lifetime he spelled it in various ways himself, if indeed he even existed.   

True....there are only 3 examples of his actual handwriting and in all 3 he himself spelled his name differently.
Go figure....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shadowyzard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2020 at 08:42
As I heard (from "probably" the most prominent Shakespeare expert in Turkey - one of my teachers) Shakespeare also uses MWS (or M.W.S.) as an abbreviation of his name, "M" is a seemingly a title. Master William Shakespeare is one probability, it can also be Mocker William Shakespeare, given his presumed temperament, hahah.

Edited by Shadowyzard - July 20 2020 at 08:46
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2020 at 10:17
Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:

I once went to an art gallery. That's the Mozart I've ever seen in one day. Smile

Hi,

And ... did she have arms, or not?

Originally posted by jamesbaldwin jamesbaldwin wrote:

As a writer, possibly Shakespear is better but... I'm not a fan of his.

Instead, I love Mozart, expecially his Requiem, so... Mozart.
...

Not surprising ... in a different language than English, Shakespeare is very tough and difficult. Even my dad translated a couple of plays into Portuguese, and I have to tell you that looking at these later, the feelings and the words, just do not match ... and it makes it very difficult to think that this or that is not as good. Same thing goes for me with Boccaccio and a couple of other Italian writers, which somehow in my reading of it, seems like something is missing and I know it is in the translation of it.

Thus Shakespeare would likely have less of an appeal in other countries, although for many actors and actresses, it still is ... the best, since the characterizations, in general, are very strong!

Mozart, for me, is easy ... if you know how to close your eyes and just flow with the music ... you don't even need to know the words on anything, since the music is very expressive. And so is Shakespeare. Try to get PROSPERO'S BOOKS, and then one day play the DVD and record on a DAW or Audacity, just the words ... and then on another empty night, just listen to the words by Sir John Gielgud ... it will change your opinion, some. AND, believe it or not, this has become one of my favorite ways to listen to a lot of things, instead of seeing it ... for example ... watching MARAT/SADE (Peter Brook's opus incredibilitus!!!) is difficult since they films around the play going on, which was OK for a while, but very confusing otherwise ... because all of a sudden some points of view seem, not quite right. BUT, if you just hear the dialogue, and not having your vision encumbered, this play takes on another MASSIVE DIMENTION ... and it is downright revolutionary, to the point that I want to direct one of these productions with skinheads and such, just to give you an idea! It is an incredible amount of dialogue, and a lot of it has been incorporated subtly in many songs since it was first opened in 1965 ... and it probably was one of the first "psychedelic" productions in London, the other having been the famous version of "MIDSUMMER NIGHT'S DREAM", which by all thoughts and ideas is a monster of a dope play! All this before Sgt. Pepper! 

But the words are what made these great, and this was/is the Shakespeare tradition that we love dearly were it not for that stupid Iambic Puta Meter that English Departments continuously think is what defines Shakespeare, which is not true ... the audiences of the Globe would not have known Iambic Pee from Iambic Poo and get a laugh from the gag ... 

In Mozart's case, it is not the words, it is the inflection and the language he created with instruments to define something new in music, that up until that time was metronomic and stupid and repetitious ... something that even a movie points out very strongly ... and all of a sudden, you have someone seeing something else with all these notes, creating new feelings you and I never considered ... in so many ways it is not really different than Shakespeare!


Edited by moshkito - July 20 2020 at 10:34
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Anders Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2020 at 17:03
How do you compare a composer to a playwright?
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