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Popular Prog Albums that Aren't Really Prog

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dougmcauliffe View Drop Down
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    Posted: September 08 2019 at 18:28
I foresee a very angry thread... but here goes

A lot of people argue stuff like retro prog isn't really progressive, this got me thinking.

I was listening to Aqualung the other day and I thought: "this is a great album, but there's really nothing progressive about this". I would say Aqualung is a Folk/Hard Rock album. PA has it ranked as the 26th best prog album of all time... hmmm

The other album that comes to mind is operation mindcrime by Queensryche. Another really solid album, but besides the whole concept album thing, the music is more just in the line of metal.

Do any other popular "prog" albums that aren't really all that progressive come to mind?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFlowerKingCrimson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 08 2019 at 18:45
I feel aqualung is more like proto prog or semi prog. I agree that Operation Mindcrime isn't really prog or even prog metal either. It's maybe kind of like a metal version of the wall(which also isn't really prog in the strictest sense). 

Speaking of Pink Floyd they are sort of on the fence but their longer tracks do indeed sound like prog to me. DSOTM is sort of a cross between classic rock/rock and prog with maybe a little bit of space rock thrown in.

Other albums? Not sure off the top of my head. Maybe 90125?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Odvin Draoi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 08 2019 at 19:02
Almost all the djent trend. Some bands like Voyager use that "djenty" thing in a meaningful manner, yet almost all the other djent stuff is horribly non-progressing nonsensical piece of crap. Not only is it worthless, but also that so-called prog metal sub-genre ruined the prog metal scene. If only they were coined as experimental djent or something, rather than prog metal. So that, we could have saved the real progressive metal.

Edited by Odvin Draoi - September 09 2019 at 09:07

"Latens, Concludo, Perpetua"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote patrickq Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 08 2019 at 20:47
^
“djent:” I learned a new word today. Thanks.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Odvin Draoi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 08 2019 at 20:52
Originally posted by patrickq patrickq wrote:

^
“djent:” I learned a new word today. Thanks.


No problem. If only you knew the genius behind the coinage of that thing. LOL

"Latens, Concludo, Perpetua"
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I prophesy disaster View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote I prophesy disaster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 08 2019 at 23:13
King Gizzard and the Lizard Wizard seem to be universally liked by the people on this forum, although they split the forum in terms of whether or not they belong on this site.
 
 
 
 
I was thinking about thinking but it really didn't get me very far.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote I prophesy disaster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 08 2019 at 23:16
Originally posted by Odvin Draoi Odvin Draoi wrote:

Originally posted by patrickq patrickq wrote:

^
“djent:” I learned a new word today. Thanks.


No problem. If only you knew the genius behind the coinage of that thing. LOL
 
And the "d" is silent! Geek
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
I was thinking about thinking but it really didn't get me very far.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 08 2019 at 23:57
Breakfast In America - great songs but apart from Child Of Vision there is very little prog on it.

Anything highly rated by 10CC and ELO . Neither were prog bands (well maybe very early ELO when Roy Wood was still in the band)

Queen II. Sorry but this is not a prog album!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 09 2019 at 01:08
Originally posted by richardh richardh wrote:


Queen II. Sorry but this is not a prog album!



who said it was? Confused
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Frenetic Zetetic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 09 2019 at 01:25
Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by richardh richardh wrote:


Queen II. Sorry but this is not a prog album!



who said it was? Confused

Not I, and I definitely agree it's not prog! I sense a few members having an issue with this assertion.
Lying on the hill; crawling over the windowsill into your living room...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cristi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 09 2019 at 01:28
Originally posted by Frenetic Zetetic Frenetic Zetetic wrote:

Originally posted by Cristi Cristi wrote:

Originally posted by richardh richardh wrote:


Queen II. Sorry but this is not a prog album!



who said it was? Confused

Not I, and I definitely agree it's not prog! I sense a few members having an issue with this assertion.

I love Queen and here on PA they're under prog-related. So i don't see any problem. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Braka1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 09 2019 at 04:34
Originally posted by dougmcauliffe dougmcauliffe wrote:

I foresee a very angry thread... but here goes

A lot of people argue stuff like retro prog isn't really progressive, this got me thinking.

I was listening to Aqualung the other day and I thought: "this is a great album, but there's really nothing progressive about this". I would say Aqualung is a Folk/Hard Rock album. PA has it ranked as the 26th best prog album of all time... hmmm





Ian Anderson would agree with you. He famously objected to Aqualung being labelled prog, to the extent that it supposedly became part of inspiration for TaaB  (I'm dubious about that. He took to prog a bit too naturally for much of the rest of his career for it all to have been a satire!)

I'd mostly agree with you about 'Aqualung', though there are moments ('My God') that it wouldn't be controversial to call prog, and there is something just proggish about many of the arrangements, production and dynamics. Even 'Wind up' feels proggy to me, or at least prog-folk.  I don't think any of the labels 'folk rock', 'hard rock' or 'prog' are a sufficient description of it.

I think at the time, most of the top rock composers were experimenting and trying to push their material into new forms. It was 1971 and prog was just in the water, so to speak.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Grumpyprogfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 09 2019 at 04:54
I would say a lot of Steven Wilson's music is not prog. And early Radiohead.

Edited by Grumpyprogfan - September 09 2019 at 06:14
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dougmcauliffe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 09 2019 at 07:23
Originally posted by I prophesy disaster I prophesy disaster wrote:


King Gizzard and the Lizard Wizard seem to be universally liked by the people on this forum, although they split the forum in terms of whether or not they belong on this site.
 
 
 
 


One of my favorite bands, I think they definitely have a couple prog albums, but I would never call them a prog band.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Manuel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 09 2019 at 08:03
Most of Santana's music is not Jazz/Rock Fusion, but latin rock, and certainly not prog at all. A lot of the metal stuff falls also in this category. Interesting, yes, but prog, hardly.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote octopus-4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 09 2019 at 08:32
Looking at PA's top 100, Kind of Blue is absolutely one of the best masterpieces ever in the jazz world, but progressive?
Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dougmcauliffe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 09 2019 at 08:57
Originally posted by octopus-4 octopus-4 wrote:


Looking at PA's top 100, Kind of Blue is absolutely one of the best masterpieces ever in the jazz world, but progressive?


29th best prog album of all time? Better than the lamb lies down on Broadway?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote octopus-4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 09 2019 at 09:06
Originally posted by dougmcauliffe dougmcauliffe wrote:

Originally posted by octopus-4 octopus-4 wrote:


Looking at PA's top 100, Kind of Blue is absolutely one of the best masterpieces ever in the jazz world, but progressive?


29th best prog album of all time? Better than the lamb lies down on Broadway?
I think that musically it's better than the Lamb, only I'm not sure that it can be considered prog, also because it has been published in 1959.
Curiosity killed a cat, Schroedinger only half.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Grumpyprogfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 09 2019 at 09:09
Originally posted by dougmcauliffe dougmcauliffe wrote:

 
29th best prog album of all time? Better than the lamb lies down on Broadway?
 
Kind of Blue is not prog. It is jazz. Great album and yes I like it better than The Lamb. Side two of that disc is pretty bad. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dr wu23 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 09 2019 at 10:35
Doug,
I agree about Aqualung...other than TAAB and Passion....Tull never struck  me as prog.
And there are many bands/albums that are here that are not very proggy imho (Beatles, Who, Zep....)...but I don't want to start a big brou ha ha.

;)


Edited by dr wu23 - September 09 2019 at 10:36
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