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When your fav neo band stopped being neo.

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LAM-SGC View Drop Down
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    Posted: March 09 2020 at 10:09
Was there a moment when neo really wasn't neo anymore? When it had become its own thing, band by band I mean, not across the board.

Let's take Arena, for example, as a band that were still making classic neo well into the 90s, their first two albums are 100% classic neo, but then on the 3rd studio album, they had found their own sound and it wasn't neo anymore it was just Arena.

I don't know how it was in your circles back in the day but where I was Wind & Wuthering was a new kind of breakthrough album for Genesis, and was and still is considered by many as the first neo album, because rather than looking back to classic prog, it looked forward and reflected the moods of the day....enter Marillion and the others... but when did that sound really end for bands and turn into something else. Obviously, it varies from band to band.

So when did your favourite neo band stop being neo?

EDIT: Jesus, I hate autocorrect.


Edited by LAM-SGC - March 09 2020 at 12:00
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote progaardvark Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 10:37
I'll pick Marillion. I'd say they stopped being a neo prog band with the Brave album, though I could see one arguing that the change started happening as early as Clutching at Straws. In fact, I'd say they would be a better fit under eclectic if you consider their entire discography, but their hallmark earlier albums will always have them pegged as neo prog.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote essexboyinwales Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 10:40
Originally posted by LAM-SGC LAM-SGC wrote:

Was their a moment when neo really wasn't neo anymore?


I can't really remember, but I never saw the 2nd or 3rd instalments....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LAM-SGC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 10:45
Originally posted by essexboyinwales essexboyinwales wrote:

Originally posted by LAM-SGC LAM-SGC wrote:

Was their a moment when neo really wasn't neo anymore?


I can't really remember, but I never saw the 2nd or 3rd instalments....


Eerrr, what?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psychedelic Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 10:49
Porcupine Tree stopped being Neo-Prog for me with the release of their Progressive Metal "In Absentia" album in 2002, but I still like them. Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote verslibre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 11:42
Originally posted by LAM-SGC LAM-SGC wrote:

Was their a moment when neo really wasn't neo anymore? When it had become its own thing, band by band I mean, not across the board.

Let's take Arena, for example, as a band that were still making classic neo well into the 90s, their first two albums are 100% classic neo, but then on the 3rd studio album, they had found their own sound and it wasn't neo anymore it was just Arena.

I don't know how it was in your circles back in the day but where I was Wind & Wuthering was a new kind of breakthrough album for Genesis, and was and still is considered by many as the first neo album, because rather than looking back to classic prog, it looked forward and reflected the moods of the day....enter Marillion and the others... but when did that sound really end for bands and turn into something else. Obviously, it varies from band to band.

So when did your favourite neo band stop being neo?
 

Are you referring to The Visitor? It sounded less derivative, but to me it's still Neo. I don't care what they identify as, but they're not as good now. The first few albums (yes, up through The Visitor) are excellent melodic prog rock. I saw them perform at Prog Fest '97 (only two albums out) and they tore the roof off the venue. Good times!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LAM-SGC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 12:03
Originally posted by Psychedelic Paul Psychedelic Paul wrote:


Porcupine Tree stopped being Neo-Prog for me with the release of their Progressive Metal "In Absentia" album in 2002, but I still like them. Smile


Porcupine Tree were never neo, they started as a one-man mushroom psych band, then a couple of Pink Floyd type albums, then he found the PT sound.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LAM-SGC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 12:06
Originally posted by verslibre verslibre wrote:

Originally posted by LAM-SGC LAM-SGC wrote:

Was their a moment when neo really wasn't neo anymore? When it had become its own thing, band by band I mean, not across the board.

Let's take Arena, for example, as a band that were still making classic neo well into the 90s, their first two albums are 100% classic neo, but then on the 3rd studio album, they had found their own sound and it wasn't neo anymore it was just Arena.

I don't know how it was in your circles back in the day but where I was Wind & Wuthering was a new kind of breakthrough album for Genesis, and was and still is considered by many as the first neo album, because rather than looking back to classic prog, it looked forward and reflected the moods of the day....enter Marillion and the others... but when did that sound really end for bands and turn into something else. Obviously, it varies from band to band.

So when did your favourite neo band stop being neo?
 

Are you referring to The Visitor? It sounded less derivative, but to me it's still Neo. I don't care what they identify as, but they're not as good now. The first few albums (yes, up through The Visitor) are excellent melodic prog rock. I saw them perform at Prog Fest '97 (only two albums out) and they tore the roof off the venue. Good times!


I completely disagree, I saw them live in May 2018, on the Double Vision tour, and I think they are better now live and on album than they have been in a very long time. As for The Visitor, fantastic album, but I don't hear classic Neo on that at all.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote verslibre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 12:53
I haven't liked any of the vocalists after Paul. And he sounded exactly the same live as he did on album.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LAM-SGC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 13:47
Originally posted by verslibre verslibre wrote:

I haven't liked any of the vocalists after Paul. And he sounded exactly the same live as he did on album.


Wow! You've got some catching up to do. Paul Wrightson left in 1998.
The current singer Paul Manzi has been with them since 2010.
Double Vision (2018) is my joint favourite album with The Visitor.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote friso Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 14:02
It's a given that Arena adapted some metal guitars on the 'Immortal?' album, but to me it still ticks all the neo-prog boxes way up to 'Pepper's Ghost'. 'Seventh Degree' and 'Double vision' are more like symphonic metal records because of the lack of progressive songs. I do like 'The Unquiet Sky' though.

I'm guitarist and songwriter for the prog-related band Mother Bass. Find us at http://www.motherbass.com. I also enter stages throughout the Netherlands performing my poetry.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Grumpyprogfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 14:08
Sanguine Hum is not neo. However, they are classified neo on PA. More Canterbury to my ears. So my fav neo band was never really neo.

Edited by Grumpyprogfan - March 09 2020 at 15:06
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote verslibre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 14:55
Originally posted by LAM-SGC LAM-SGC wrote:

Originally posted by verslibre verslibre wrote:

I haven't liked any of the vocalists after Paul. And he sounded exactly the same live as he did on album.


Wow! You've got some catching up to do. Paul Wrightson left in 1998.
The current singer Paul Manzi has been with them since 2010.
Double Vision (2018) is my joint favourite album with The Visitor.
 

I think you missed the part where I said "I haven't liked..." LOL

I dropped off after Pepper's Ghost, and I've sampled the newer albums, but wasn't moved to buy them. I like the old stuff best.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote verslibre Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 14:57
Originally posted by friso friso wrote:

It's a given that Arena adapted some metal guitars on the 'Immortal?' album, but to me it still ticks all the neo-prog boxes way up to 'Pepper's Ghost'.

I agree.

Originally posted by friso friso wrote:

'Seventh Degree' and 'Double vision' are more like symphonic metal records because of the lack of progressive songs.
 

That's why I'm not into them. We've already got Threshold, and I've got most of their albums.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Manuel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 15:21
Not really my area of expertise, since I don't think about labels very much. I either like the music or I don't, simple as that. Labels help clasifly the music and give us an orientation as to what kind of music to expect, but if I don't like it, I don't mind what lebel is under, I won't get into it, and if I like it, I'll certainly enjoy it. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LAM-SGC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 15:23
Originally posted by verslibre verslibre wrote:

Originally posted by LAM-SGC LAM-SGC wrote:

Originally posted by verslibre verslibre wrote:

I haven't liked any of the vocalists after Paul. And he sounded exactly the same live as he did on album.


Wow! You've got some catching up to do. Paul Wrightson left in 1998.
The current singer Paul Manzi has been with them since 2010.
Double Vision (2018) is my joint favourite album with The Visitor.
 

I think you missed the part where I said "I haven't liked..." LOL

I dropped off after Pepper's Ghost, and I've sampled the newer albums, but wasn't moved to buy them. I like the old stuff best.


You're right, sorry. I misread it as "haven't heard" 😂
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Enchant X Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 23:28
Pendragon went through a change I think from neo prog to something else a bit more heavy , but I haven't heard their latest album though I'm told it's very good I really must check it out soon . Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 00:48
Neo Prog was just a bunch of bands that revived the old symphonic approach in the early eighties. It was a movement but the style evolved. Marillion's second album was quite different as was IQ's second album compared to the first. The Wake is probably what people have in their minds eye as 'classic' neo but IQ hardly made another album like it. 'Genesis on a Walkman' was the disparaging throw away comment of one critic (it might have been the whole review though!) at the time.
I just see it as music that is very broadly symphonic in approach but less about fantasy subjects or deep concepts. Its more emotional and human based and suicide and death are favourite subjects. I enjoy it for what it is and I'm not sure as already said that the labelling is that helpful.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Hercules Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 02:42
There's not really such a style as neo-prog.

It's just a new wave of bands doing classic symphonic prog (and some of them doing it extremely well).

And some bands do evolve their styles - look at Strawbs, who went from bluegrass to prog folk to glam rock to symphonic to God knows what and back again.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote essexboyinwales Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 04:00
Originally posted by LAM-SGC LAM-SGC wrote:

Originally posted by essexboyinwales essexboyinwales wrote:

Originally posted by LAM-SGC LAM-SGC wrote:

Was their a moment when neo really wasn't neo anymore?


I can't really remember, but I never saw the 2nd or 3rd instalments....


Eerrr, what?


Sorry, an attempt at humour, based around The Matrix...


I don't really get the whole "neo" label.  I don't see why IQ aren't "symphonic", because they are to my ears....

As someone else said, it was just about a new wave in the early-mid '80s!
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