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Guldbamsen View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 28 2014 at 10:27

That can't be right.
“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 28 2014 at 16:01
It doesn't seem right, but owners are cheap and treat musicians like bus boys and waiters. Plus original bands performing in small venues , (a hole in the wall), are often appreciated by the crowd , but don't often walk away with 2 pennies to rub together. Unless I'm invited to sit in with a more popular band in the city, I'm paid nothing...however if I play covers the money is there. Especially if you have a following and please Mr. Money bags.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 06 2014 at 11:14
Dear Marje,

Am I really a liberal?

yours respectfully, 

Perplexed of Hampshire




Following a suggestion on the social media platform known as Facebook to "Meet the woman whose photo is making liberal heads explode all across the Internet, and enjoy all the wonderful reasons they hate it so", I was disappointed to find that as a "liberal" my head not only failed to explode, my ire was not piqued and my blood refused to boil. I also find that I harbour no ill-feelings towards this person, Holly Fisher (who now goes by the moniker of Holly Hobby Lobby), nor do I hate her or have any desire to shower her in verbal abuse or condemnation. Also any resulting notion that I was perhaps not as "liberal" as I thought I was was notably missing from my reaction too and as such it did not cause me to question my own beliefs and opinions or change my view of those that hold opposing beliefs or opinions. That both Chick-Fill-A and Hobby Lobby is for all practical purposes unknown outside of the insular world of the Untied States is immaterial, those of us in the rest of the World (ie "All Across The Internet") do know the back-story here and the while distance from which we view this may not afford us the same perspective as those who invited us to meet Mrs Fisher, or of those whose heads did metaphorically explode (or implode), it does mean we understand the underlying issue and can have an opinion on it.

Of course the photograph was taken and disseminated purposely to provoke a reaction, (the glee in the accompanying tag for supporters to "enjoy all the wonderful reasons" is evidence of that), it was trolling for all those negative reactions and it duly got them: 'Quelle surprise' - or more accurately - 'Quelle désappointement'. Any indignation from either side is a tad hollow and disingenuous.

What the photograph and the viral reaction/counter-reaction it has created demonstrates is not the intended message, but the stupidity of those that use The Internet, regardless of their politics, religion or philosophy. Not just in those who felt the overwhelming need to vent their spleen and post a stream of bile in reaction to it or in support of it, but in those who felt the equally overwhelming need share it All Across The Internet. 

Regardless of whether it is written into a constitution or whether it is a basic human right the freedom of speech permits people to hold and voice opposing views, it does not mean that I should tolerate or respect them - the right to hold the view is to be respected, but not the view itself or the person holding it. However, this does not grant anyone the right to be disrespectful towards them, and equally it does not grant anyone the right to be disrespectful in defence of someone else. 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 06 2014 at 11:34
Wise words Dean. I wish I could live up to them, but there are times when the foolish and angry teenager pops up in me when dealing with such people (Danish Nationalists have a tendency to bring out the worst in me).
Maybe it'll get better with age.
“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”

- Douglas Adams
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 06 2014 at 11:59
Ah. I have to admit I have zero respect and zero tolerance for nationalism - they should be denied the oxygen of publicity and the only way I can do that as an individual is by not engaging with them in debate of any kind.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 00:42
This isn't really one of those loud, aggressive rants. This is where I plead people to help me understand something: the ALS Ice Bucket Challenge.

Look, if you want to take a shower, take a shower. There's no need for this meaningless ritual. Don't just go on Facebook and brag about being aware of something. (Want to call me a cynic, fine, that's alright.) Just donate. A donation is enough. I believe if you want to encourage someone to donate, why not show them a video of people who are having a tough time with ALS, see what they are going through exactly? And why does it have to be only ALS? What about other forms of palsy and scleroses, or something else that's health-related?

Am I really missing something here?


Edited by Dayvenkirq - August 30 2014 at 00:47
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 00:56
There's a social aspect to it. If you see a bunch of people participating in the ritual, you might want to fit in and do it as well. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 00:57
^ And the purpose of that is ... ?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 01:06
More people feel pressured to participate -> more people participate -> more donations -> yay
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 01:11
^ It's not that simple. What does the participation in taking a bucket have to do with donating? They are two different ideas. How does one affect the other? There has to be a more rational, effective way of promoting the idea of donating. "Wow, this is funny watching that guy taking a shower; I'm going to donate." - Who thinks like that? It's almost an insult to our collective intelligence.

Edited by Dayvenkirq - August 30 2014 at 01:16
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 01:20
Why the f**k is rationality so great and the solution to everything? Can't people just feel good and do what their feelings say? The only things that all humans share is anatomy, and that's most of the time.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 01:25
^ Is the expletive really that necessary? Reason is great for what it is, yet it's not a solution to everything, though I do feel this IBC trend could be handled in a better thought-out fashion.
Originally posted by Luna Luna wrote:

Can't people just feel good and do what their feelings say? The only things that all humans share is anatomy, and that's most of the time.
I really don't know what that has to do with the issue on hand. All I'm saying is: we don't need buckets to raise awareness, nor the appearance of our favorite celebrities who use them. It just looks ridiculous. There has to be a more intelligent way of handling it. You can just talk about how people handle ALS, at the very least.

Edited by Dayvenkirq - August 30 2014 at 01:29
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 01:29
It's the ranting room, so I figured if it would fit anywhere, it would be here.Sorry if you were offended. Issue? I thought the issue you had was those participating weren't doing the most efficient thing by simply donating and therefore making it a waste of time. ie, doing something irrational. I argued that they're people having fun for a good cause and in doing so inspire others to do the same.  
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 01:33
Originally posted by Dayvenkirq Dayvenkirq wrote:

^ Is the expletive really that necessary? Reason is great for what it is, yet it's not a solution to everything, though I do feel this IBC trend could be handled in a better thought-out fashion.
Originally posted by Luna Luna wrote:

Can't people just feel good and do what their feelings say? The only things that all humans share is anatomy, and that's most of the time.
I really don't know what that has to do with the issue on hand. All I'm saying is: we don't need buckets to raise awareness, nor the appearance of celebrities to use them. You can just talk about how people handle ALS, at the very least.
This ice bucket challenge was not meant as a gift to the people to raise their awareness and knowledge, it was a commercial concept, created by some ALS fund, to gather money to help ALS patients(and themselves a little but that's irrelevant here). Other funds have tried to use different ways to raise funds, but this one just happened to have hit on. Sure, there are probably more moral ways to raise funds or awareness, but people don't care about that so much
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 01:34
Ok, I also agree with Luna, you're totally free to rant here
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 01:36
Ture, it's perfectly rational to use unnecessary expletives when talking about the virtues of irrationality
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 01:39
^ and ^^ - both of you - interesting points. I understand what you are trying to say about how the IBC works. My concern is about something different: how we, the humans, look at things, how we treat them. That's the direction of my rant - about a thing that none of us can do anything about - fun as the sole stimulation in some of us.
Originally posted by twseel twseel wrote:

Ok, I also agree with Luna, you're totally free to rant here
You are, but free rant is really a notion on this thread, nothing more. I thought the purpose of this "room" was to b$%ch about issues, not for individuals to s$%t-sling each other.
Originally posted by Luna Luna wrote:

Ture, it's perfectly rational to use unnecessary expletives when talking about the virtues of irrationality
Debatable.


Edited by Dayvenkirq - August 30 2014 at 07:43
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 01:41
oh. That's a much broader topic and it makes more sense why you're ranting about it. Yeah, we can't do much about human perception and the cognitive process.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 04:51
Originally posted by Dayvenkirq Dayvenkirq wrote:

This isn't really one of those loud, aggressive rants. This is where I plead people to help me understand something: the ALS Ice Bucket Challenge.

Look, if you want to take a shower, take a shower. There's no need for this meaningless ritual. Don't just go on Facebook and brag about being aware of something. (Want to call me a cynic, fine, that's alright.) Just donate. A donation is enough. I believe if you want to encourage someone to donate, why not show them a video of people who are having a tough time with ALS, see what they are going through exactly? And why does it have to be only ALS? What about other forms of palsy and scleroses, or something else that's health-related?

Am I really missing something here?
It is Social Network Emotional Blackmail. At its lowest level it's insidious and it's not nice. 

The basic message is "do this stupid thing or your friends will think you are selfish". Those that decline will be subjected to mild forms of internet bullying, regardless of how mild and how humorous this emotional blackmail is, it is still bullying.

The challenge itself is a form of chain-letter with a worthy cause attached and that doesn't stop it being wrong. Using peer-pressure and emotional blackmail to raise awareness and gain funds is exactly the same mechanism that propagates chain-letters. Nominating 3 other people for each nomination is perpetuating the chain that in 22 days can nominate every member of the human race, the huge sums of money that have been generated by this challenge are a testament to how effective this form of chain-letter can be. It may seem churlish to criticise a campaign that raises money for a worthy cause such as ALS/MND in this manner but I believe the end does not justify the means.

It has been criticised as an up-market wet T-Shirt contest but frankly from what I've seen that's more wishful thinking than any reality. If watching over-weight men running around a lawn squealing like teenage girls who've seen spider gets you off then go for it.

The ALSA funds stem-cell research - I make no moral judgement on that but some people do. If the message had been "pour a bucket of ice water over your head to raise money for stem-cell research" I suspect considerably fewer people would have participated and certainly none of the c-list celebrities eager for free publicity would have associated themselves with it quite so eagerly. 

The research the ALSA funds inevitably involves vivisection, animal experimentation and animal testing, again I make no moral judgement here, it is impossible to research motor neuron diseases without having a functioning nervous system to experiment on. It is an unpleasant reality for some people but a reality just the same. Pamela Anderson has famously declined the challenge on these grounds and good for her. Animal rights supporter Ricky Gervais was criticised for not taking the challenge, then criticised again when he did - damned if you do and damned if you don't.

The ALSA has countered both these claims by stating that donors can stipulate that their money is not to be used for either of these areas of research but that is an empty promise, if you pay money into a central fund that spends 10% of that on stem-cell research and animal experimentation then 10% of every donation is used for that purpose, it is impossible for it not to. By the same logic it is impossible to donate money to a large charity without paying for the administration costs involved in running it, this includes the salaries of the directors and CEOs of these charities some of whom are paid comparable salaries to the directors and CEOs of any large corporation. However, the major portion of the funds raised go to the care of people suffering from this horrible disease, the importance of this cannot be stressed enough.

Professor Stephen Hawking has suffered with ALS/MND for the past 51 years, I doubt that any able-bodied person can fully comprehend the challenges facing ALS/MND sufferers and the challenges their carers face every day. He supports the Ice Bucket Challenge, he was unable to partake of the challenge because of his health so his children took the challenge for him. 

My view is this:
If you want to get cold, wet and uncomfortable then go stand in the rain for 10 minutes.
If you want to donate money to charity then do so, quietly and without making a big deal out of it.
Don't subject your "friends" to emotional blackmail.


Edited by Dean - August 30 2014 at 05:52
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 30 2014 at 05:36
The videos on FB are getting really boring now.
This sums up the whole thing for me very nicely.


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