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horza
Prog Reviewer
Joined: August 31 2005
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 2530
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 17:43 |
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Originally posted by darkshade: Calling Mike Portnoy a bad drummer is like calling Stephen Hawking an idiot.
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The Wizard
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 18 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7341
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 17:46 |
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Certif1ed
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: April 08 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 7559
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 17:51 |
Teaflax wrote:
Certif1ed wrote:
Music doesn't have to be clever or cleverly written to be great - and there's nothing inherently lazy about this approach.
| I don't know, stupidity - especially when enforced as an artistic ideal - seems to me to be pointless. If anyone can do it, why bother with it?
| That's a different question.
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The important thing is not to stop questioning.
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Teaflax
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 26 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 1225
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 17:58 |
The Wizard wrote:
That's a shame. |
I
don't think so. Very early on in my life, I sided with the cerebral
against the thoughtless, and few Rock'n'Roll heroes qualify for the
former, whereas all too many are firmly in the latter camp.
Intelligence is a valuable commodity, and I really don't see why one
should praise those who seem hell-bent on not exercising theirs.
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The Wizard
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 18 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7341
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 18:06 |
So your saying that rock music is unintelligent? I guess you think that the only good music is prog.
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Teaflax
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 26 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 1225
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 18:09 |
The Wizard wrote:
So your saying that rock music is unintelligent? I guess you think that the only good music is prog. |
Not
at all. Just like any other genre, 80-90% of all Prog is crap, and
intelligent doesn't have to necessarily mean complex, but it does
generally mean thought through and worked on.
There are absolutely clever ways of being simple and stripped-down (and
innovation and breaking new ground counts for a lot), I just don't
think that what Jack White does qualifies in any way.
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The Wizard
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 18 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7341
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 18:10 |
May I ask, have you ever listened an entire White Stripes album?
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Teaflax
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 26 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 1225
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 18:15 |
The Wizard wrote:
May I ask, have you ever listened an entire White
Stripes album? |
Nope, the wilfully dumb singles have been enough
to scare me off, for fear of getting even more catchy, incessantly
repeated simlpe melodies stuck in my head. I'm really not much of a
self-flagellant (although you'd be hard-pressed to know it from my
posting career here...).
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The Wizard
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 18 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7341
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 18:17 |
If would listen to ther albums you would some well crafted rock'n'roll that may be simple, but certainly isn't dumb.
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Teaflax
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 26 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 1225
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 18:21 |
Are you saying that the singles are really that much catchier and
repetitititive than the album tracks? And that the sloppy playing and
singing is suddenly much improved? Because if not, I really don't see
the point.
I have not yet heard a single TWS song that didn't stick in my head
right away, and I don't understand why that would have any kind of
appeal at all. No point in listening to the tune if you can conjure it
up just by thinking about the song title.
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The Wizard
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 18 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7341
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 18:26 |
So your saying that if a song is catchy is in not artistic and therefore dumb? How incredibly prentetious. I guess you don't like The Kinks either, all of there songs are catchy. Your basically saying that all music thats accessible to a mainstream audience is dumb.
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laplace
Prog Reviewer
Joined: October 06 2005
Location: popupControl();
Status: Offline
Points: 7606
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 18:30 |
The Wizard wrote:
Your basically saying that all music thats accessible to a mainstream audience is dumb. |
I can dig it! joke Watching Teaflax's last.fm charts it's clear that he likes well-constructed POP songs so that argument is somewhat silly. I also share the view that espousing one's lack of musicianship doesn't make for good art, at least not since punk, but there's one guy who ruins that argument by professing his status as a "non-musician." Damnit Brian Eno, you're not helping ze intellectual angle.
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Teaflax
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 26 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 1225
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 18:30 |
The Wizard wrote:
So your saying that rock music is unintelligent? I guess you think that the only good music is prog.
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First of all, mine is not saying anything.
But no, not all of it, just that which uses the very obvious and simple tricks
that anyone who has played an instrument for a year or so can easily
figure out. That's called pandering, and it really is a pretty cheap
thing to do. I guess some acts do it without meaning to, but that
doesn't say much about their acumen.
And, yes, I do find the Kinks's biggest hits to be incessantly annyoing
and simplistic (but I respect Ray Davies for many less famous tunes and
for being a good lyricist - his recent solo album was pants, though).
Edited by Teaflax - June 26 2006 at 19:25
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The Wizard
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 18 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7341
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 19:26 |
Lets just face, TWS aren't your thing. You obviously can't see how well crafted and creative there songs are.
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Teaflax
Forum Senior Member
Joined: June 26 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 1225
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 19:52 |
Nope, can't see it.
Jack White seems to me to be about as sharp as sackful of slugs in the rain.
And where songs?
Edited by Teaflax - June 26 2006 at 19:53
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VanderGraafKommandöh
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 04 2005
Location: Malaria
Status: Offline
Points: 89372
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 22:06 |
Hmmm, well I find Pure Reason Revolution's choruses stick in my head pretty quick and you like them as a band. So you have just contradicted yourself with your flimflam ideas about you not liking music that is catchy!
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Mikerinos
Forum Senior Member
Joined: August 11 2005
Location: Planet Gong
Status: Offline
Points: 8890
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 22:11 |
It's weird, I find a lot of prog to be catchier than pop music which is intended to be catchy. At work the other day (while pushing carts in the rain... how fun), I had VdGG's Scorched Earth, Anglagard's Kung Bore, and a bunch of other random prog songs stuck in my head. I find these songs much more catchy than say, The Pina Colada song.
Edited by Bluesaga - June 26 2006 at 22:12
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VanderGraafKommandöh
Prog Reviewer
Joined: July 04 2005
Location: Malaria
Status: Offline
Points: 89372
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 22:36 |
Mike, you ! Thanks for bringing up The Pina Colada song! It's not as annoying as Joe Pasquale's "I know a song that'll get on your nerves"! But yes, I've had a lot of sections of Robert Wyatt's "Rock Bottom" album in my head for the past two days and also a bit of "Unfolded Like Staircase" by Discipline. Kung-Bore is a cool tune, thanks for reminding me, Mike!
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kingofbizzare
Forum Senior Member
Joined: March 09 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 520
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 22:41 |
Bluesaga wrote:
It's weird, I find a lot of prog to be catchier than pop music which is intended to be catchy. At work the other day (while pushing carts in the rain... how fun), I had VdGG's Scorched Earth, Anglagard's Kung Bore, and a bunch of other random prog songs stuck in my head. I find these songs much more catchy than say, The Pina Colada song.
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Ack! The mere mention of that song immediately got it stuck in my head!
As for the Raconteurs, I got their album as soon as I could, and I found it very engaging, and yes, catchy (gasp!). As mentioned earlier, the song Store Bought Bones does have a bit of a prog edge, as does the title track.
The White Stripes are one of my favorite bands right now. Elephant is my overall favorite. It sounds more melodically advanced than their other ones. And if covering three Captian Beefheart songs makes a band mainstream, then by all means, The White Stripes are definately mainstream.
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Zac M
Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: July 03 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 3577
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Posted: June 26 2006 at 23:46 |
I like the Pina Colada Song, but the official song title is Escape (The
Pina Colada Song)...I'm such a dork. I went through a phase where I
listened to weird and somewhat random pop music quite frequently.
Genius lyrics:
Do you like Pina Coladas?
Gettin lost in the rain
And you don't care for yoga
Do you have half a brain?
Something along those lines
Haven't heard the Raconteurs album though, my brother probably owns it
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"Art is not imitation, nor is it something manufactured according to the wishes of instinct or good taste. It is a process of expression." -Merleau-Ponty
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