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Frasse View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 05:31

To be honest, that text is almost impossible to read, no matter how well thought out it is.

Then again, almost anything can be unreadable when considering the design of this forum.
 
 
Some nice thoughts. Here are some comments:

"I would have been a much happier person had my fellow peers grown up loving Jethro Tull and Yes as opposed to Brittany Spears and Fallout Boy--but what can I do about it?"
 
The 70s had their share of commercial pop music too; The Archies, Olivia Newton John etc. to name a few.
 
 
 
"My last stand in the defense of modern music exists in the form that we’ve just begun. Listen to the music of the Seventies and you’ll hear a relative unifying sound that goes with almost everything of the age. Now, go listen to a Fantomas album. Next up is Kayo Dot. Take a listen to Porcupine Tree. Then The Mars Volta. Listen to a 65 Days of Static album. Go take a peek at the new Secret Chiefs 3 album. It’s hardly ever the same. This variation is a huge strength of our current musical era. Essentially, anything you’d ever want to hear is there somewhere--you just have to find it."
 
That's because the 70s are 30 years behind by now, wait 30 years more and see what they'll say about todays music then. Probably something like 'Kayo Dot sounds so 00s'.
 
This has more to do whith available technologies and different ways to record.


Edited by Frasse - January 23 2007 at 05:54
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 05:35
Very good essay.

I'm fan of the 70's and 70's are my favourite, but I won't say that I don't like music from the 00's, I'm just not too familiar with it; I have many bands to discover. There is so many good music around!

Anyway, if I understood well, you mentioned something about the music of the 70's (regardless of how diverse it is) is got some common factor, a link for all the bands of the era; and that is not the case with the new bands, because they all sound different because of helping technology, am I right?

I understand your point of view, and maybe you're right, but nobody can't say; it's just too early. Perhaps in 10 on 20 years we will be able to trace that common factor, spirit of the 2000's , in all the today's bands no matter how diverse they are.

About a technology issue - it's true that computers are really helping tool for making (and discovering) music. But technology is offering a lot, musicians have to be very cautious. As far as they are able to control themselves of drowning into artificiality, things will be fine for music.

I actually discussed about something similar in one of my previous threads, but it seems that people weren't very interested in it.

http://www.progarchives.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=31391

this thread is nice, keep up the good work!Clap
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 05:36

THE AMBER LIGHT

OCEANSIZE

INFRONT

PORCUPINE TREE

TOOL

GY!BE

INDUKTI

OPETH

PAATOS

KAYO DOT

PURE REASON REVOLUTION

THE MARS VOLTA

RIVERSIDE




Modern Prog is fantastic. There MUST be a category of it for Archives!!!


    

Edited by Prog-jester - January 23 2007 at 05:37
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 08:08
Originally posted by fuxi fuxi wrote:

Originally posted by king volta king volta wrote:

We have reached the modern age of music, and it is just now beginning.


Well no, not exactly.
We've been in 'the modern age of music' for at least 400 years. In 1607 Monteverdi wrote his ORFEO (which is close in spirit to certain prog concept albums!) and since then there's been revolution upon revolution.

You're right in pointing out that (some) contemporary rock bands seem to have regained the spirit of adventure which characterised the 1970s. But you're in danger of generalising.

First of all, the 1970s were not the only 'golden age' of popular music. The 1960s produced just as much good music (even if it wasn't prog) and the 1950s were no laughing matter, either.

Secondly, you seem to think you're analysing 'Modern Music' in general. Well, you may call The Mars Volta or Porcupine Tree 'post-rock' as much as you like, but they're still only rock bands to me, i.e. bands operating with a 'rock music mentality' (albeit an experimental one) and aimed at a rock audience (even if it's an audience with a taste for adventure).

Don't forget that there are OTHER forces out there, e.g. superb jazz soloists such as Keith Jarrett and Tomasz Stanko, 'World Music' performers such as the Portuguese fado singer Cristina Branco, and symphonic composers such as John Adams and Qigang Chen. If you ignore people like these, you just can't pretend you're discussing 'Modern Music'.

P.S. Computers do not have an 'affect' on people. It's 'effects' you're after.
    

    
thanks man. constructive criticism is what moves us all along...

anyways, i'll go fix the grammar.

as for modern music's origins and whatnot, in my essay I was simply comparing the former powerhouses of the typical "Golden Age" this site focuses on--late sixties through the Seventies, to "modern" music of our current generation. I tried to keep classical music out simply because first of all, in my eyes, I see classical music as a much different by still very diverse form of the art--almsot a different sect.

But thanks for the points.
I'm a reasonable man, get off my case
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 10:29
The landscape has changed forever in my mind.  If Dark Side of the Moon or The Yes Album or Led Zep 4 or an number of hugely successful albums from the early 70's were released today, how would they be received by the mainstream?  Would they only be lauded by people like us and then fade away into obscurity?  Would they sell a fraction of what they sold back then?  With the number of bands being exponential to what it was back then, it is so hard to stand out without being a sell out.  There are visionaries today on par with the visionaries of yesteryear but history will not be as kind to our contemporaries, of that I am sure.
Biggles was in rehab last Saturday
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 10:40
Originally posted by king volta king volta wrote:

Originally posted by TheProgtologist TheProgtologist wrote:

Being a lover of modern prog music I really agree qith what KV wrote.Very nicely put,but I see no need to defend it right now because no one has really attacked it.

    Not here it isn't--but everywhere I go, my friends, my peers, my father...you name. They attack modern music, and it just got to me. So I wrote that for my school paper...


Yeah, I hear ya', a lot of my freinds are into the whole 80's hair metal thing, which they believe is the greatest, the others are into modern rock (Panic at the Disco, Hinder, etc.) I've given up trying to show them music.

But what I find odd is that whenever I show my friends a song, they hate it, but when I'm playing oh say Firth of Fifth on the guitar they'll love it, or they'll ask me to play it again, etc. That confuses me beyond belief.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 11:01
Hm, your essay in a school paper mentions Kayo Dot? Brave... and interesting.
sig
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 16:05
Originally posted by Floydian42 Floydian42 wrote:


Originally posted by king volta king volta wrote:

Originally posted by TheProgtologist TheProgtologist wrote:

Being a lover of modern prog music I really agree qith what KV wrote.Very nicely put,but I see no need to defend it right now because no one has really attacked it.

    Not here it isn't--but everywhere I go, my friends, my peers, my father...you name. They attack modern music, and it just got to me. So I wrote that for my school paper...
Yeah, I hear ya', a lot of my freinds are into the whole 80's hair metal thing, which they believe is the greatest, the others are into modern rock (Panic at the Disco, Hinder, etc.) I've given up trying to show them music.But what I find odd is that whenever I show my friends a song, they hate it, but when I'm playing oh say Firth of Fifth on the guitar they'll love it, or they'll ask me to play it again, etc. That confuses me beyond belief.


i know i get things like that also. i think it's jsut the quality of much of that music. if we didn't like genesis, in comparison to panic! at the disco, we would say genesis sounds really chessy because of something like the luster of the music or perhaps the lyrics--whereas we, as prog listeners love it. On the other hand most of us see Panic! as being uninteresting and chessy/cheap...

The thing is, the individual parts in progressive music in general are always going to be more interesting when played singuarly to these people--because they don't hear the luster of the song in general and how it shifts, and they don't hear the lyrics. They could like the lick from Temple of Syrinx but hate Geddy Lee and not have to worry about it if you were just playing the lick.

But if someone were to play the chords from that one Panic! single (something about 'Sins' I can't remember) we probably wouldn't be very interested.

Do you get what I'm saying?
    
I'm a reasonable man, get off my case
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 18:14
You rock BenHug
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 18:18
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

  I like my music melodic, thematic, ever-changing, dazzling me with thematic work rather than by noise and "avant-garde-ness".


I guess this is where our difference lies and why many of us don't agree with some of your reviews - I personally couldn't care less for melody, I love everything from minimalistic electronics to hardcore avant garde/noise(Merzbow, Wolf Eyes, etc...) Perhaps it will grow n you someday...

BTW I suggest you listen to The Mantle a couple more times - I thought it was boring at first tooWink
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 18:52
Originally posted by The Bard The Bard wrote:

Modern Music is crazy today.  At my school all the kids are getting into some crappy stuff.  I, however, try to stay with modern music that isn't.  crappy that is.  Mickey(a.k.a. the wizard) influences the bands I listen to more than anyone.  He's about the only peer I listen to concerning modern bands.
 
With everything there is good and bad.  With love there is pain.  With The Mars Volta there is...ugh...Fall Out Boy...NukeCry
Why yes Mr. Lowen, I am quite the influence when it comes to modern music. You gotta look pretty hard to seperate the sh*t from the good stuff nowadays.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 19:22
Originally posted by The Miracle The Miracle wrote:

You rock Ben

    
Danke sehr!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 20:33
"Some people like cupcakes better. I, for one, care less for them."

Speaking as one who became mutant pod person progressive freak in 1978, I am so happy to find out the reports of prog being dead are wrong. It's alive and well and mutating even as we speak! Punk? where's your punk now?
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 21:20
Originally posted by king volta king volta wrote:

Originally posted by Floydian42 Floydian42 wrote:


Originally posted by king volta king volta wrote:

Originally posted by TheProgtologist TheProgtologist wrote:

Being a lover of modern prog music I really agree qith what KV wrote.Very nicely put,but I see no need to defend it right now because no one has really attacked it.

    Not here it isn't--but everywhere I go, my friends, my peers, my father...you name. They attack modern music, and it just got to me. So I wrote that for my school paper...
Yeah, I hear ya', a lot of my freinds are into the whole 80's hair metal thing, which they believe is the greatest, the others are into modern rock (Panic at the Disco, Hinder, etc.) I've given up trying to show them music.But what I find odd is that whenever I show my friends a song, they hate it, but when I'm playing oh say Firth of Fifth on the guitar they'll love it, or they'll ask me to play it again, etc. That confuses me beyond belief.


i know i get things like that also. i think it's jsut the quality of much of that music. if we didn't like genesis, in comparison to panic! at the disco, we would say genesis sounds really chessy because of something like the luster of the music or perhaps the lyrics--whereas we, as prog listeners love it. On the other hand most of us see Panic! as being uninteresting and chessy/cheap...

The thing is, the individual parts in progressive music in general are always going to be more interesting when played singuarly to these people--because they don't hear the luster of the song in general and how it shifts, and they don't hear the lyrics. They could like the lick from Temple of Syrinx but hate Geddy Lee and not have to worry about it if you were just playing the lick.

But if someone were to play the chords from that one Panic! single (something about 'Sins' I can't remember) we probably wouldn't be very interested.

Do you get what I'm saying?
    


I see what your saying, but then that just makes me wonder about modern Prog, why don't they like it as much? I mean, the quality of Porcupine Tree I think is very good. I can understand dislikes on odd bands such as Radiohead, thats so eccentric I hated it at first, but when you have a seriously good band I don't get it.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 23 2007 at 21:28
Originally posted by Slartibartfast Slartibartfast wrote:

"Some people like cupcakes better. I, for one, care less for them."

Speaking as one who became mutant pod person progressive freak in 1978, I am so happy to find out the reports of prog being dead are wrong. It's alive and well and mutating even as we speak! Punk? where's your punk now?


well, what's good to us is sh*t to others. One man's trash is another's treasure, it's a big cycle. And general people probably don't listen to music closely enough to care that a Rush song is better written than a Taking Back Sunday song. They just think, "this is on the radio, and it sounds neat I guess, I'll listen to it." Those that willingly think that these bands are the greatest thing ever and that bands like the aforementioned Porcupine Tree is sh*t are the ones with the problems...
    
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2007 at 05:29
Wish it could be prosperity
That's waiting around the corner
All I can see is more agony
I don't believe things are better
Want it for you - want it for me
Let's do it and keep our sanity
Always a fight - we both may be right
too stubborn to see

Cause our finest hour is our darkest day
To admit we are human
that there's more to life than we dare to say
In our test of wills did we turn to man ?
Did we look for the answers -
from a higher source than we understand?
Gotta second chance if we come clean now
or it's all over ........ 



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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 25 2007 at 03:31
Moved to the Blogs section, with the agreement of King Volta.
 
(Great post!Clap)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 27 2007 at 16:19
Mr. Bungle is post rock?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 29 2007 at 17:12
I have no prejudices against modern music, and I don't dislike anything less than 20 years old. All of my favourite bands are generally from the 70s (or that time period), but this is only because all of today's modern artistic bands are not popular at all. Because our society is increasingly commercial, all of these experimental, aesthetic bands with musical integrity (by that I mean they create music for the further developement of music, or for the art of creating music, et cetera, not for their personal interests such as fame, fortune, popularity, et cetera.) are being shunned by the business folk.

In short,nearly all the good bands of today are shoved out of the limelight. That is why the majority of my favourite bands are from the 70s, when musical experimentation and artistic music was (not overly) welcomed (but certainly more so than today).

Does that sound accurate?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 29 2007 at 17:23
Of course we're going to say that 'our' music (i.e., PROG) is lightyears ahead, much more developped, complex, and simply better than 'theirs' (i.e. radio friendly, commercial, pop snuff). Of course we're going to say that.

But to say that we're better than them, and they have problems or issues or that their ignorant (maybe a little...) or that they are persons of a lesser calibre, they aren't as sophisticated as us - to say that is simply absurd and increadibly pompous. Of course we will always say our music is better than theirs, but to say that WE are better than THEM for that reason is wrong.

Feel free to argue with me, I'd like to see all the angles of this.
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