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Topic ClosedNew BBC2 series- 'Seven Ages Of Rock'

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Sean Trane View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 29 2007 at 08:37
I missed the first stage of this seven stage rocket to nowhere.Cry I got the second instalment on teape and will likely view next WE.Smile
 
What I'm wondering is how the Alternative and Indie chapters will differ.Confused This is the same bloody phenomena, REM being the first widely succesful band to record on an indie label.
 
This whole thing is/seems completely distorted by professional British press writer sof the NME and MM type.Dead
 
You want to construct a seven stage rocket:
 
1a) The original Rock an Roll >>> the 50's and how the establishment managed to kill the rebellion.
1b) The prefab "rock" stars >> how the establishment managed to change vicious sexual RnR into politically correct pop idols that were comlpletely controlled by the industry, including the Beatles debut , until say 63.
 
2) The awakening of Rock >> how the protest folk artist started revolutionizing songwriting and how they wrote their own rebellion thru the music , eventually leading to Folk Rock, Psych rock, Blues Rock and early Prog >> until 69.
 
3) The first apex: the 70's>> the industry losing control and trying to gain it back, with a first real halt with the 73 oil crisis plunging the Western world into depression. Prog , JR/F etc >> roughly stop at 77 with punk, but can go further with Heavy Metal
 
4) The punk era and its successors: (post punk, new wave etc....) >> the return of the record companies. The groups are often again manufactered. Until 87, roughly once REM and other indies are coming through.
 
5) The indie years: (from REM to Grunge and beyond). How the big labels are losing shares to the groups that can now develop without them an international career (this was mainly not the case with the 70's except for maybe Zeppelin)
 
6) the Dance thing: the story of rock as dancing music, how to exploit the girls with "rock" >> from American Bandstand to Motown, to disco and the 80's funk lead with Jackson (M and J), girls and boys bands and eventually touching the Techno scene >>> from 50's until now
 
7) the technological revolution and advent of electronics: how the first synths allowed more artistic freedom (Analogue) before limiting it seriously it by enticing kids not to learn music theory but become sampling machines. from 70 until now.
 
Now this makes sense!!!Smile


Edited by Sean Trane - May 29 2007 at 08:41
let's just stay above the moral melee
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 29 2007 at 20:27
Not  areal mention of prog rock...no ELP, Yes, or other great prog bands, rather a look up the middle classes a"""s on how art rock was so good. I won't be watching the next 5 episodes, only Led Zep will be worth watching, ain't gonna bother.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 29 2007 at 20:31
The first one was good but it focused too much on Hendrix, imo. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 30 2007 at 04:23
Originally posted by progismylife progismylife wrote:

The first one was good but it focused too much on Hendrix, imo. 


I agree. Hendrix was excellent, and important, but they could have covered more.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 30 2007 at 07:22
Originally posted by Sean Trane Sean Trane wrote:

I missed the first stage of this seven stage rocket to nowhere.Cry I got the second instalment on teape and will likely view next WE.Smile
 
What I'm wondering is how the Alternative and Indie chapters will differ.Confused This is the same bloody phenomena, REM being the first widely succesful band to record on an indie label.
 
This whole thing is/seems completely distorted by professional British press writer sof the NME and MM type.Dead
 
You want to construct a seven stage rocket:
 
1a) The original Rock an Roll >>> the 50's and how the establishment managed to kill the rebellion.
1b) The prefab "rock" stars >> how the establishment managed to change vicious sexual RnR into politically correct pop idols that were comlpletely controlled by the industry, including the Beatles debut , until say 63.
 
2) The awakening of Rock >> how the protest folk artist started revolutionizing songwriting and how they wrote their own rebellion thru the music , eventually leading to Folk Rock, Psych rock, Blues Rock and early Prog >> until 69.
 
3) The first apex: the 70's>> the industry losing control and trying to gain it back, with a first real halt with the 73 oil crisis plunging the Western world into depression. Prog , JR/F etc >> roughly stop at 77 with punk, but can go further with Heavy Metal
 
4) The punk era and its successors: (post punk, new wave etc....) >> the return of the record companies. The groups are often again manufactered. Until 87, roughly once REM and other indies are coming through.
 
5) The indie years: (from REM to Grunge and beyond). How the big labels are losing shares to the groups that can now develop without them an international career (this was mainly not the case with the 70's except for maybe Zeppelin)
 
6) the Dance thing: the story of rock as dancing music, how to exploit the girls with "rock" >> from American Bandstand to Motown, to disco and the 80's funk lead with Jackson (M and J), girls and boys bands and eventually touching the Techno scene >>> from 50's until now
 
7) the technological revolution and advent of electronics: how the first synths allowed more artistic freedom (Analogue) before limiting it seriously it by enticing kids not to learn music theory but become sampling machines. from 70 until now.
 
Now this makes sense!!!Smile
 
This version of events isn't so far away from 'Dancing In The Street', actually, which was a BBC series of 10 or so years ago. The drawbacks of that were prog was not mentioned once, that I recall, and heavy metal was glossed over entirely, save a one minute Led Zeppelin reference. At least in this series that has been rectified to a certain extent- Floyd dominated Saturday's show, whereas DITS didn't bother with Floyd after Syd's mental collapse. However, some of the episodes ARE excellent in that series- the blues one called 'Crossroads' featured a wealth of rare footage, genuinely new interviews (that first episode of this new series regurgitated a lot of them), the rock and roll one called 'Whole Lotta Shakin' had some nice footage and interviews with the rock pioneers and the psychedelic one (this too has been almost forgotten in this new series) featured Grateful Dead, Jefferson Airplane, Pink Floyd, Big Brother and The Holding Company etc. and interviewed most of them.
 
The rock and roll/prefab era is a fascinating area which these programmes seem to gloss over, imho, in favour of too many po-faced analyses of punk's 'importance'. This sort of stuff almost killed 'real' rock and roll- all the original 50s rockers like Chuck Berry, Gene Vincent, Jerry Lee Lewis, Eddie Cochran, Buddy Holly, Jerry Lee Lewis, Little Richard etc. were either dead, disgraced, imprisoned or had almost vanished. In their place came a whole host of teen idols that totally sanitised it, and imho were scarcely different in sound to the music from the crooners that rock and roll had threatened to wipe out...Even Elvis, who was the only one of this era to survive in commercial terms (probably sold more than he did in the 50s), was a very different animal to the person who recorded in the 1950s. I believe his non-soundtrack albums sold far less than the soundtracks, and those soundtracks (and the films themselves) are incredibly lightweight. As you might have guessed, this is an area of rock music I do take a keen interest in.Big%20smile
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 30 2007 at 19:38
James, you're 19, how have you seen "Dancing in the Street"?  I'm just curious, as I was 16 then and don't remember it.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 31 2007 at 05:53
Well I do actually remember it when it aired, but I have some of the VHS of the series- found them down a local boot sale around a year ago.Wink
 
And amusingly, the feedback here is plastered with annoyed prog fans...http://www.bbc.co.uk/music/sevenages/programmes/white-light-white-heat/


Edited by salmacis - May 31 2007 at 06:20
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 03 2007 at 07:53
The third episode on the development of punk was good - and no prog-bashing nor the mention of the word dinosaur! However, I wondering with episode 4 next week, being about heavy rock then they have things out of order? And as I see this series develop, I'm curious to know whether the writers/producers have gone for slicing up the period circa 1965 to about now, into 7 approximately time frames? Personally I would have thought there had been 3 or even 4 stages of rock evolution in the first 8 years....
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2007 at 06:20

I watched episodes 2 & 3 and I was impressed with how much was crammed into them. Let's face it, an hour isn't a long time to spend on any genre. The series can't offer anything more than an overview and I'd imagine that nothing was said about prog that most forum members didn't already know.

But it was more successful than previous TV attempts in that it did acknowledge the world of progressive rock (and I agree with Dick Heath, it was good that the punk episode wasn't used as an excuse for progbashing).
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2007 at 06:32
Has anybody else noted that when the Beeb have a nostalgia thing for the early 70's we get the Bowie footage and Ziggie soundtrack - I can think of three example within 7 days (even the Today programme on Radio 4 this morning!).  But in the early 70's Bowie was one of many emerging artists, and paying his dues playing at 2nd and 3rd level venues - it was amusing that footage last night on the Andrew Mar's History of Britain since WW 2 showing Bowie besieged by teenie boopers, who less than a decade before would have been screaming their bladders empty at the Beatles. If Mar wanted a better illustration of a country out of control, then perhaps footage of ELP touring at the the height of their fame and excess would have been more relevant to his polical themes. Nostalgia tends to mist the truth of time.

Edited by Dick Heath - June 07 2007 at 08:21
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2007 at 06:37
Dick, you're right. There's been a lot of Bowie on TV recently. There was a clip of him playing "Heroes" at the Isle of Wight on Channel 4 last night too.
 
I wondered why I felt the need to buy Hunky Dory and The Man Who Sold the World the other day...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 09 2007 at 12:41
Today's London Times' TV listings has a little article about tonight episode on heavy rock. However, what do you make of the first sentence:
"There is no area within rock that is more mocked or maligned than heavy rock. Yet....."

And I thought prog rock was the whipping boy?

I have to assume, as ever, these journalist have very little knowledge of the subjects they write, worst incredibly short memories.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 09 2007 at 12:48
That reminds me of something Gabby Logan said in this months Mojo... she said she was brought up having to listen to her father playing rubbish bands like Chicago!

I was a bit annoyed with that!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 09 2007 at 18:47
Episode 6 is called Left Of The Dial: Alternative Rock 1980 -1994

Nirvana are one of the groups featured and on the Seven Ages Of Rock mini-site at the BBC they feature an interview with drummer Dave Grohl. During this interview (link below) Grohl describes how he learnt to drum, without the aid of drums, by banging along to Rush's 2112 and trying to emulate Neil Peart. There is also a short clip of Tom Sawyer:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/mediaselector/check/music/sevenages/video/nirvana?size=16x9&bgc=C0C0C0&nbram=1&bbram=1&nbwm=1&bbwm=1




Edited by Tony R - June 09 2007 at 19:12
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 09 2007 at 19:14
Tonight's episode reinforces my suspicion that the title of the series is inaccurate.
In many respects, I felt tonight's  didn't give a full picture of the early days of heavy rock/heavy metal rock. Personally I would have thought some further mention of early heavy drumming might have had some relevance. However,  I note Led Zeppelin are saved for a miscellany of rock groups in Stadium Rock - and yet another Birmingham link. In many respects, I felt there were too few bands represented and was/is Deep Purple a heavy rock or a heavy metal act?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 09 2007 at 19:16
Heavy Progressive, Dick Wink ! By the way, Atomic Rooster is an often hailed band by Eighties Heavy Metal groups, where were they this evening?

Edited by erik neuteboom - June 09 2007 at 19:18
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 10 2007 at 05:27
Where was the ubiquitious Lemmy/Motorhead?

Do 'The Stanley' otherwise I'll thrash you with some rhubarb.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 10 2007 at 05:38
i enjoyed watching the show, but as usual raised more questions by what they left out than what they kept in...Wink
 
the obvious bands were there of course, but Motorhead and G'n'R were huge omissions.
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 10 2007 at 06:42
Originally posted by Dick Heath Dick Heath wrote:

The third episode on the development of punk was good - and no prog-bashing nor the mention of the word dinosaur! However, I wondering with episode 4 next week, being about heavy rock then they have things out of order? And as I see this series develop, I'm curious to know whether the writers/producers have gone for slicing up the period circa 1965 to about now, into 7 approximately time frames? Personally I would have thought there had been 3 or even 4 stages of rock evolution in the first 8 years....
 
Yeah, I also found the punk era episode quite respectful, instructive (especially the Patti Smith stuff, which I'll keep). I was happy to have seen it. However I will use the tape space for tonight's fouth instalment, which is likely to be kept along with the second episode (sadly I missed the first one)


Edited by Sean Trane - June 10 2007 at 06:43
let's just stay above the moral melee
prefer the sink to the gutter
keep our sand-castle virtues
content to be a doer
as well as a thinker,
prefer lifting our pen
rather than un-sheath our sword
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 10 2007 at 06:46
I'm amazed Metalica didn't site Motorhead as an influence. I've heard them state this many times before, but I suppose it didn't fit the the programme maker's somewhat revisionist view of the history of rock.
 
On another note, it wuz cowin' mogic  to ear all them Brummie accents, war it? Ah day arf feel at um. Yow cor beat it man.


Edited by emdiar - June 10 2007 at 06:47
Perception is truth, ergo opinion is fact.
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