Santana vs Mahavishnu Orchestra

Comparing diamonds! Oh well! Mahavishnu is definitely more progressive and experimental (or just plain mental!) . But Santana deserves massive kudos for making magical music in a magical time (Caravanserai-Welcome-Borboletta) and seing him live 3 times only reinforces my choice but MO is really the more compact deal.

I can't stand Santana.  

Santana's style is a bit repetitive but he's a good guitarist. Whereas the Mahavishnu Orchestra is absolutely mindblowing and did so much for fusion jazz. So MO it is.

kibble_alex wrote: Hercules wrote: kibble_alex wrote: Hercules wrote: Santana by a mile. Mahavishnu Orchestra is often a total mess - like most jazz fusion. Great musicians, not great music.Abraxas and Caravanserai are far above any MO albums - and Santana is a brilliant guitarist.PS Actually I misread the poll - Santana isn't jazz rock anyway so there is no comparison!! Excuse me, but you ask any jazz-head around: Latin IS jazz. And Santana is Latin music crossed with rock music, making it Latin/Jazz Rock. get your facts straight mate I do not need to ask "any jazz-head", Latin is a completely separate area from Jazz though some forms use the improvisational styles common to Jazz, but by no means all - and Santana is one who normally doesn't. If you doubt this, consult any university music text on the subject ( I recommend Ed Morales' book "the Latin Beat") but please don't quote those who merely have an opinion as authorities. I have just consulted my nephew who lectures in Popular Music at Leeds College of Music and he nearly p**sed himself laughing at your comment. good for him, but I've played jazz all over the place: at college, jazz orchestras and small jazz groups, and we all play Latin as a style of jazz music. "Jazz" drummers play Latin as part of the "Jazz" sylibus, i know many jazz conductors and jazz musicians who state that Latin is the other side of jazz. Maynard Ferguson is a jazz-trumpeter and he specialises mainly in Latin composition, so I'm afraid I also have authoritative contacts as well. You are also disagreeing with the admins of this site as well, as they have categorised Santana under Jazz Rock/ Fusion. At the end of the day, who cares anyway. Can't it just be called "music"?

Dude, admit it; Latin is not necessarily jazz, you play Latin as a style of jazz music, Santana, and many others, don't. The admins aren't the final authority either. And of course it's music, but that doesn't give you an idea of what they sound like, does it. "What genre is Santana?" "Music." "Oh yeah, that's what Mahavishnu Orchestra plays too."

Hercules wrote: kibble_alex wrote: Hercules wrote: Santana by a mile. Mahavishnu Orchestra is often a total mess - like most jazz fusion. Great musicians, not great music.Abraxas and Caravanserai are far above any MO albums - and Santana is a brilliant guitarist.PS Actually I misread the poll - Santana isn't jazz rock anyway so there is no comparison!! Excuse me, but you ask any jazz-head around: Latin IS jazz. And Santana is Latin music crossed with rock music, making it Latin/Jazz Rock. get your facts straight mate I do not need to ask "any jazz-head", Latin is a completely separate area from Jazz though some forms use the improvisational styles common to Jazz, but by no means all - and Santana is one who normally doesn't. If you doubt this, consult any university music text on the subject ( I recommend Ed Morales' book "the Latin Beat") but please don't quote those who merely have an opinion as authorities. I have just consulted my nephew who lectures in Popular Music at Leeds College of Music and he nearly p**sed himself laughing at your comment.

good for him, but I've played jazz all over the place: at college, jazz orchestras and small jazz groups, and we all play Latin as a style of jazz music. "Jazz" drummers play Latin as part of the "Jazz" sylibus, i know many jazz conductors and jazz musicians who state that Latin is the other side of jazz. Maynard Ferguson is a jazz-trumpeter and he specialises mainly in Latin composition, so I'm afraid I also have authoritative contacts as well. You are also disagreeing with the admins of this site as well, as they have categorised Santana under Jazz Rock/ Fusion. At the end of the day, who cares anyway. Can't it just be called "music"?

kibble_alex wrote: Hercules wrote: Santana by a mile. Mahavishnu Orchestra is often a total mess - like most jazz fusion. Great musicians, not great music.Abraxas and Caravanserai are far above any MO albums - and Santana is a brilliant guitarist.PS Actually I misread the poll - Santana isn't jazz rock anyway so there is no comparison!! Excuse me, but you ask any jazz-head around: Latin IS jazz. And Santana is Latin music crossed with rock music, making it Latin/Jazz Rock. get your facts straight mate

I do not need to ask "any jazz-head", Latin is a completely separate area from Jazz though some forms use the improvisational styles common to Jazz, but by no means all - and Santana is one who normally doesn't. If you doubt this, consult any university music text on the subject ( I recommend Ed Morales' book "the Latin Beat") but please don't quote those who merely have an opinion as authorities. I have just consulted my nephew who lectures in Popular Music at Leeds College of Music and he nearly p**sed himself laughing at your comment.

Hercules wrote: Santana by a mile. Mahavishnu Orchestra is often a total mess - like most jazz fusion. Great musicians, not great music.Abraxas and Caravanserai are far above any MO albums - and Santana is a brilliant guitarist.PS Actually I misread the poll - Santana isn't jazz rock anyway so there is no comparison!!

Excuse me, but you ask any jazz-head around: Latin IS jazz. And Santana is Latin music crossed with rock music, making it Latin/Jazz Rock. get your facts straight mate

Tough call!

Santana for me...but not really because of his guitar playing--I am a huge fan of Mingo on congas and the overall songwriting.

Mahavishnu John got a bit too big for his britches.

Santana by a mile. Mahavishnu Orchestra is often a total mess - like most jazz fusion. Great musicians, not great music.

Abraxas and Caravanserai are far above any MO albums - and Santana is a brilliant guitarist.

PS Actually I misread the poll - Santana isn't jazz rock anyway so there is no comparison!!


Edited by Hercules - January 12 2008 at 18:51

I went with Mahavishnu for pretty much what has been stated on here. I did like the Santana/McLaughlin CD in '73.