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laplace View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: prog priority
    Posted: March 02 2009 at 12:56
put these terms in the order you find them important in prog rock:

compositional skill
originality
peculiarity
KEYBOARDS
performance skill
song length
far-out-ness (spaciness?)
GUITAR
conceptuality (or lyrical weight)
heaviness

and then explain why you chose to put the first and last entries where you did. I've already put them in the order I find them important, heaviness being least so since I no longer find any joy in metal and composition being most important to me since I've found most of my favourite bands and albums cover new ground. now you.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 02 2009 at 13:00
Compositional skill
Everything else


I really don't care what goes on in a prog song. As long as it sounds good, I'm happy.
Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 02 2009 at 13:02
compositional skill (though it doesn't mean, I demand complex stuff however)
originality
BASS
perfomance skill
KEYBOARDS
song length
heaviness
GUITAR
spaceiness
conceptuality

This is not really when I'm looking for Prog, though. Because sometimes I do want heavy stuff, and sometimes I really don't, so, spaciness, heaviness and compositional skill in the complex side, varies a lot.....

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 02 2009 at 13:05
I'm not going to rank them but composition is first for me.  Either the music moves me or it doesn't.  The other stuff is all a distant second.  And I do have  a special fondness for the strange, for artists who find their own way to say things, and for those who reject the mainstream/commercial aspects of music.  
oh yeah




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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 02 2009 at 13:08
Originally posted by TheCaptain TheCaptain wrote:

Compositional skill
Everything else


I really don't care what goes on in a prog song. As long as it sounds good, I'm happy.


Yup.
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laplace View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 02 2009 at 13:19
everyone has composition first and instrumentation less important. So, if you heard that someone wrote an entirely computer-based album - using no identifiable rock samples - using a songwriting technique highly influenced by classical, jazz and prog rock music, would you want to listen to it?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 02 2009 at 13:21
Originally posted by laplace laplace wrote:

everyone has composition first and instrumentation less important. So, if you heard that someone wrote an entirely computer-based album - using no identifiable rock samples - using a songwriting technique highly influenced by classical, jazz and prog rock music, would you want to listen to it?


Nope. It's the soulllllllllll man!Big smile


In Lazland, life is transient. Prog is permanent.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 02 2009 at 14:16
Very Important:
originality
peculiarity
far-out-ness (spaciness?)

Important:
performance skill
compositional skill

Less Important, but could be interesting when added:
heaviness
conceptuality (or lyrical weight)
I would also add three things in this category which were not mentioned, and on the same level:
dissonance, melody, unusual instruments

Not important at all:
song length
GUITAR  KEYBOARDS (same level for both; I don't care at all what instruments are being used)


BaldJean and I; I am the one in blue.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 02 2009 at 14:19
Creativity
Vehemence
Energy


Edited by Grimfurg - March 02 2009 at 14:21

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 02 2009 at 15:35
I don't see how everybody can demand certain instruments.  I think thats apretty close minded view on music.  Obviously the wrong instruments can be picked, but if anything I'd like to hear more instruments I don't hear very often.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 02 2009 at 16:02
I'd say passion and keyes.
obviously their are some great prog tracks without any keyboards, but for me its pretty essential.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 02 2009 at 16:30
Originally posted by laplace laplace wrote:

everyone has composition first and instrumentation less important. So, if you heard that someone wrote an entirely computer-based album - using no identifiable rock samples - using a songwriting technique highly influenced by classical, jazz and prog rock music, would you want to listen to it?
Yeah dude! People have already done this! Ever heard of electronica?

Edited by DJPuffyLemon - March 02 2009 at 16:32
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 02 2009 at 17:19
Originally posted by laplace laplace wrote:

everyone has composition first and instrumentation less important. So, if you heard that someone wrote an entirely computer-based album - using no identifiable rock samples - using a songwriting technique highly influenced by classical, jazz and prog rock music, would you want to listen to it?


I know where you getting at dude...

...and guess what- some of my favorite music is from the Mega Man series.  NES style.  Smile

That doesn't mean that the versions at Overclocked Remix aren't better...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2009 at 03:39
Originally posted by laplace laplace wrote:

everyone has composition first and instrumentation less important. So, if you heard that someone wrote an entirely computer-based album - using no identifiable rock samples - using a songwriting technique highly influenced by classical, jazz and prog rock music, would you want to listen to it?


Sure.

I've got pretty much the same priority as you.

1. (quite Important):

compositional skill
peculiarity
originality

2. (Not always important):

performance skill
far-out-ness (spaciness?)

3. (Embarrassing lyrics/concepts are a turnoff, but a lot I listen to is instrumental):

conceptuality (or lyrical weight)

4. (Unimportant, overlong and too short is equally bad)

song length

5. (Irrelevant)

GUITAR, KEYBOARDS, heaviness
Over land and under ashes
In the sunlight, see - it flashes
Find a fly and eat his eye
But don't believe in me
Don't believe in me
Don't believe in me
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2009 at 03:53
The way I understood the question was "what do you think is required to make an album good?" And that's how I gave my priorities.
I also think something else which is very important is missing: Improvisational skill. Would be in the second category for me, together with performance skill and compositional skill.
As to instrumentation: We have albums with the oddest of instrumentations; on one ("Embryo's Reise" by Embryo) even a bleating goat contributes to the music on one track.


Edited by BaldFriede - March 03 2009 at 03:56

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Mr ProgFreak View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2009 at 06:07
SONGWRITING
compositional skill
performance skill
conceptuality (or lyrical weight)
far-out-ness (spaciness?)
peculiarity
originality
GUITAR
KEYBOARDS
heaviness
song length


I think you forgot to mention songwriting ... that's what's most important to me. Many people make no distinction between songwriting and compositional skill, but I do ... songwriting is about finding good melodies/tunes, composition is about turning them into well crafted songs (adding instruments, extending/elaborating sections, adding more instruments/orchestration etc.). Together with musicianship (what you call performance skill) that's my holy trinity of objectively judging music. Of course there's always the subjective component too ... sometimes an album has great songwriting, composition and musicianship but you simply don't like it.

The least important is song length ... I don't think that songs improve with duration, it always depends on the song. Some melodies call for elaboration or additional sections with counter-melodies, some don't. It also depends on the concept of the song or album.

EDIT: Moved guitar and keyboard further down ... I thought the entries meant musicianship in those departments and not just the mere presence of the instruments.


Edited by Mr ProgFreak - March 03 2009 at 06:16
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TheCaptain View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2009 at 08:47
Originally posted by laplace laplace wrote:

everyone has composition first and instrumentation less important. So, if you heard that someone wrote an entirely computer-based album - using no identifiable rock samples - using a songwriting technique highly influenced by classical, jazz and prog rock music, would you want to listen to it?


Wouldn't composition encompass everything else? If I composed a song, I would write which instruments would play each part. That's part of the composition.
Curse your sudden but inevitable betrayal.
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