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CPicard View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CPicard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2013 at 08:48
Originally posted by Jim Garten Jim Garten wrote:

Originally posted by CPicard CPicard wrote:

Didn't Thatcher end a strike by sending the army and ordering the soldiers to open the fire?


No


My bad, I have mistaken the Wales for the Falkland islands.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2013 at 09:22
Originally posted by CPicard CPicard wrote:

Originally posted by Jim Garten Jim Garten wrote:

Originally posted by CPicard CPicard wrote:

Didn't Thatcher end a strike by sending the army and ordering the soldiers to open the fire?


No


My bad, I have mistaken the Wales for the Falkland islands.
Easy mistake, they both have sheep.
What?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blacksword Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2013 at 09:26
Originally posted by King of Loss King of Loss wrote:


Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

Originally posted by Jim Garten Jim Garten wrote:

Originally posted by CPicard CPicard wrote:

Didn't Thatcher end a strike by sending the army and ordering the soldiers to open the fire?


No


One Thatcher documentary - it may have been the one on last night, I didn't see it - showed the police battering miners with truncheons and dragging men by the legs across tarmac. Over the top of this was Thatcher making a speech about how the country would not be held to ransom by 'thugs'

She was of course referring to the NUM and it's members, but it was funny - perhaps unintentionally so - how it went with the images of police brutality.
It wasn't like they were striking for exorbitant amounts of money either...


Yeah, it wasn't really about money in terms of wages and working conditions, IIRC. It was about dismantling socialism by taking down the unions.



Edited by Blacksword - April 09 2013 at 09:58
Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bosh66 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2013 at 09:40
Would never wish anyone's demise and I'm glad she appears to have died peacefully with her loved ones around her. She was a woman of some strong conviction who had a view of "society"  and the conviction to make her vision reality. That said, politically she was horrible, and many of the ills we face these days from deindustrialisation, breakdown of community, banking crises, housing crises, income disparity and long-term unemployment all have their origins in the Thatcher era.
She famously declared that society did not exist, just a collective of individuals and their families. Her view appeared to be that it was down to everyone to look after themselves. The poor would benefit by allowing the rich to grow richer (trickle down) and policy was all around rolling back the state, to the detriment of those less able to cope. There was certainly a view around the "deserving poor" that accompanied this. For all her talk about giving power back to the individuals, local control of services was undermined where councils / municipalities were forced to offer their previously in-house services to tender and to take the lowest price for the services to be outsourced (a quality clause was only allowed by later governments). Industry was sold wholesale to the benefit of political supporters in the name of popular capitalism. Her hatred of the unions (who even Labour to be fair were having problems accomodating) led to her closing down coal mines across the country where it was cheaper (and socially more sensible) to support them as going concerns. This hatred was even manifested in her insistence that no new industry was to be allowed to locate to some of the pit villages of the North East and some of these small towns even today suffer devastating social problems going back to those days. She was a populist who championed such policies as allowing people to buy the council owned social housing they lived in at hugely discounted prices, which certainly empowered a lot of folks. Her refusal to allow councils to replace these didn't help. Those in need of shelter were often not in a position to take advantage of new builds, and private landlords had to pick up some of the demand (not all landlords were known to be ethical and many found themselves living again in overpriced slums).
So I sympathise with her family, respect the fact that what she did she believed was right, and won't miss her one iota!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vibrationbaby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2013 at 09:42
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Originally posted by Vibrationbaby Vibrationbaby wrote:

Canada new leader in 5th generation combat aircraft Official anouncement from Ottawa. Canada to kick ass. Eurofighter, Gripen, F-35 & F-22 eat your hearts out.


http://www.flickr.com/photos/78215847@N00/8611200598/


Ermm April the 1st was a week ago.


I know that. But it was more a fit of nostalgia I had during a dream. Canadians were on top of the world in advanced aerospace technology back in the late 50s. After the Arrow programme was axed in Feb '59 our engineers and technicians went on to work on the Mercury, Gemini and Apollo programs and literally saved the Gemini program when it was in deep sh*t. Guys like Fred Matthews and Jim Chamberlin were among the best brains NASA ever had. Had our technology been allowed to develop we would be frontrunners by light years today in many high tech fields. Even today the Arrow outperforms  hardware that is still in service. It's Iroquois engines were rated at 25,000 lbs of thrust identical to engines that power aircraft like the F-15 and Mig 31. Too bad it was cancelled just days before it was installed in place of the American J75s. Even with the J75s it was exceeding expectations and it performed flawlessly on it's initial flight thanks to prior advanced testing methods and technology. The only thing on test pilot Jan Zurakowski's ''snag''  list was the positioning of a couple of electrical switches and the absence of a clock. On it's third flight it went supersonic and was routinely flown at supersonic speeds during subsequent tests. It's cancellation was purely political. It was performing above all expectations and meeting all guarantees to the Government. As Sir Sydney Camm, designer of the Hawker Huricaine, Tempest Typhoon, Hunter and involvement with the Harrier once said : " All modern aircraft have four dimensions, span, length,wiidth and politics."

The F-35 is in deep piles of sh*t these days and the American Government is on the verge of cancelling it. Just read the updates in Fight International or Aviation Week The only place it will perform well in is the local airshow.





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TGM: Orb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2013 at 13:41

"If Margaret Thatcher is re-elected as prime minister on Thursday, I warn you.

I warn you that you will have pain–when healing and relief depend upon payment.

I warn you that you will have ignorance–when talents are untended and wits are wasted, when learning is a privilege and not a right.

I warn you that you will have poverty–when pensions slip and benefits are whittled away by a government that won’t pay in an economy that can’t pay.

I warn you that you will be cold–when fuel charges are used as a tax system that the rich don’t notice and the poor can’t afford.

I warn you that you must not expect work–when many cannot spend, more will not be able to earn. When they don’t earn, they don’t spend. When they don’t spend, work dies.

I warn you not to go into the streets alone after dark or into the streets in large crowds of protest in the light.

I warn you that you will be quiet–when the curfew of fear and the gibbet of unemployment make you obedient.

I warn you that you will have defence of a sort–with a risk and at a price that passes all understanding.

I warn you that you will be home-bound–when fares and transport bills kill leisure and lock you up.

I warn you that you will borrow less–when credit, loans, mortgages and easy payments are refused to people on your melting income.

If Margaret Thatcher wins on Thursday–

- I warn you not to be ordinary

- I warn you not to be young

- I warn you not to fall ill

- I warn you not to get old."

Neil Kinnock, 1983...

Happened, innit Ouch

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Padraic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2013 at 14:01
Don't be young, but don't get old?  Is there a magic age I need to stay at?  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2013 at 14:09
Originally posted by Padraic Padraic wrote:

Don't be young, but don't get old?  Is there a magic age I need to stay at?  
The age where a rock meets a hard-place.
What?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jim Garten Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2013 at 02:42
OK here's a little prediction for you.

In about 7/8 days this thread's main subject will be the public order disturbances around St.Paul's Cathedral in London.

I also predict many of these masks will be seen:



Just a thought...

Jon Lord 1941 - 2012
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blacksword Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2013 at 03:01
Originally posted by Jim Garten Jim Garten wrote:

OK here's a little prediction for you.

In about 7/8 days this thread's main subject will be the public order disturbances around St.Paul's Cathedral in London.

I also predict many of these masks will be seen:



Just a thought...


I think I'll stay away from the TV that day.

I'm not sure what will irritate me more, the gushing endless tributes or sight of tw&ts in Guy Fawkes masks.
Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bosh66 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2013 at 03:54

Just a thought...[/QUOTE]

I think I'll stay away from the TV that day.

I'm not sure what will irritate me more, the gushing endless tributes or sight of tw&ts in Guy Fawkes masks.[/QUOTE]
 
Sums my position up perfectly too!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jim Garten Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2013 at 04:07
Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

I'm not sure what will irritate me more, the gushing endless tributes or sight of tw&ts in Guy Fawkes masks.


At least we won't get Elton John singing 'Candle In The Wind'



...please, noooo...

Jon Lord 1941 - 2012
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blacksword Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2013 at 04:26
Originally posted by Jim Garten Jim Garten wrote:

Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

I'm not sure what will irritate me more, the gushing endless tributes or sight of tw&ts in Guy Fawkes masks.


At least we won't get Elton John singing 'Candle In The Wind'



...please, noooo...


Maybe Depeche Mode could do a performance of 'Everything counts'

The grabbing hands, grab all they can, all for themselves, after all...it's a competetive world..

Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jim Garten Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2013 at 04:38
I'm sure Billy Bragg wouldn't object to playing.

Interesting to note, incidentally, that BB's come under a lot of flak for refusing to celebrate Thatcher's death - his post on FB re the news effectively said it's not a time for celebration, it's a time to remember the past & to continue the fight - a decent, sober reaction from one of her harshest critics in the music world. Mt respect for him has increased even more

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stool Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2013 at 04:48
Originally posted by Jim Garten Jim Garten wrote:

Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

I'm not sure what will irritate me more, the gushing endless tributes or sight of tw&ts in Guy Fawkes masks.


At least we won't get Elton John singing 'Candle In The Wind'



...please, noooo...
 
"Goodbye awful ****
**** **** **** **** ******* ****"
(etc)
 
rotten hound of the burnie crew
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerinski Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2013 at 05:28
Originally posted by Jim Garten Jim Garten wrote:

Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

I'm not sure what will irritate me more, the gushing endless tributes or sight of tw&ts in Guy Fawkes masks.


At least we won't get Elton John singing 'Candle In The Wind'



...please, noooo...

Let's have a Marillion reunion with Fish singing Margaret.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PROGMAN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2013 at 11:58
Where I lived many miner's striked and my family were part of the strike, I am from a mining town and won't be missed around here, Thacther 

Edited by PROGMAN - April 10 2013 at 12:01
CYMRU AM BYTH
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote markosherrera Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2013 at 12:35

The death, at the age of 83, of Margaret Thatcher on April 8 has generated a host of disputes in England and throughout the world. For the working class, and also for the rest of the society of the United Kingdom, her name brings the worst memories and is not for less, countless workers in the mining of coal in this country not only lost their jobs but it also with them disappeared the strength of their unions, their villages and their community. Memory, however, they and their descendants at all was blank. It was enough that the news of the death of the cause of their misery and misfortunes appeared in all media in the country so it has outbreaked until a popular celebration of the fact, something that contradicts in many the traditional British phlegm.

Ken Loach, is a television director and film director from the United Kingdom, known for his style of social realism and Socialist themes tied to his Trotskyist activism. His commentary for the final departure of the Iron Lady is therefore of extreme importance.

Ken Loach says goodbye to Margaret Thatcher

Margaret Thatcher was the most divisive and destructive Prime Minister of modern times.

Mass Unemployment, factory closures, communities destroyed – this is her legacy. She was a fighter and her enemy was the British working class. Her victories were aided by the politically corrupt leaders of the Labour Party and of many Trades Unions. It is because of policies begun by her that we are in this mess today.

Other prime ministers have followed her path, notably Tony Blair. She was the organ grinder, he was the monkey.

Remember she called Mandela a terrorist and took tea with the torturer and murderer Pinochet.

How should we honour her? Let’s privatise her funeral. Put it out to competitive tender and accept the cheapest bid. It’s what she would have wanted. (michaelrosenblog.blogspot.com)

--------------- o ---------------

While Loach makes so unquestionable epitaph, David Hopper´s, secretary general of the general secretary of the Durham Miners' Association, is crude as to what as working class, exploited and until it has been reduced to a minimum, it ends up resulting in the recovery of the memory after those terrible years of 1984-1985 of the general strike of coal miners. Is what for Hopper, the date of the death of Baroness Thatcher was a "great day" for the miners and explains the why.

“It looks like one of the best birthdays I have ever had”, after a 70 years birthday on the same day.

 "There's no sympathy from me for what she did to our community. She destroyed our community, our villages and our people”.

"For the union this could not come soon enough and I'm pleased that I have outlived her”.

"It's a great day for all the miners, I imagine we will have a counter demonstration when they have her funeral”.

"Our children have got no jobs and the community is full of problems. There's no work and no money and it's very sad the legacy she has left behind”.

"She absolutely hated working people and I have got very bitter memories of what she did. She turned all the nation against us and the violence that was meted out on us was terrible”.

"I would say to those people who want to mourn her that they're lucky she did not treat them like she treated us”. (Yahoo! News UK)

--------------- o ---------------

That the day of her death was organized so spontaneously in Windrush Square, Brixton, London, a street party celebrating the death of the Thatcher, the only thing that shows is the ambivalent social classes in struggle. As the city of London, the bourgeoisie and the British Crown cry her, the British proletariat celebrates it. There countless samples that banners and posters were there present with content that in other times would have been censored: “Rejoice, Thatcher is dead”; “f**k Thatcher, worm food now”; “Good riddance”; “Ding, dong, the witch is dead”; “RIP old woman but DEATH to your legacy”; “You snatched my milk & our hope” about the suppression of milk delivery to scholarship; “The bitch is dead”; “! Rejoice ¡ ! Rejoice ¡”.

The sequence of photos are taken from the web site www.brixtonbuzz.com
Hi progmaniacs of all the world
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The T Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2013 at 12:57
^Just like Venezuelans in Miami dancing and drinking celebrating Chavez' death.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote akamaisondufromage Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2013 at 13:31
^^ 'Suppression  of milk delivery to scholarship' lol
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