The Atheist - Agnostic - Non religious thread

^ Very cordial.

Dean wrote: ...though some of them are cults, but perhaps not religions in the accepted sense of the word.

I guess my point was that to the non-religious, any religion at all could really be considered a cult. That's what the word means after all.


Edited by Equality 7-2521 - April 11 2012 at 13:40

There is a difference between a cult and a "religion" though it is based on their position in society - i.e. a sociological distinction. A cult may be based on a small group of isolated people, whose religion has no organized power expression, no extra group resonance.

On the other hand, it could be argued that as a type of embattled, emerging religion, a cult has different, more sectarianism and extreme beliefs than a powerful religion that is moderated by mass exposure, convention and bureaucratization.

But I agree religion and religious cult are in the same family - religion.

Research suggests that atheists are more moral than theists and in my experience this is true.

I rather think that if I were god, and I wanted to produce a holy text setting forth my intentions for the universe, it would be very lucid, crisp, literal, no nonsense. Because the whole thing would be entirely pointless if it confused people or was ambiguous. Things would become subjective and others would genuinely misunderstand what it was I was asking them to do. A mysterious, figurative text would mean that your potential to follow god's will and go to heaven was largely dependent on your ability to interpret poetic devices.

And this is why I call bullsh*t on any of this "Oh that was a metaphor" or "This is an allusion to such and such" or "This represents that" bible interpretation sh*t I see. Why would god not be clear? Because he's a dick? Because it's another test? But this isn't a test that morality or faith can get you through.

Do you know why Genesis uses the word firmament? Because the guy who wrote it was making it up and thought the world actually had a solid roof. Why would god describe things that aren't there? And don't get me started on that guy who was crapping on about how Noah's Ark is a metaphor for the human brain.

Bullsh*t I say, the whole industry around this "god as Allen Ginsberg" crap.

That has ALWAYS been code for "We haven't thought this through."

AND THEN THERE'S THIS JIMMY RUSTLER:

^ But a Jehovah "day" is a thousand years and we are currently in the day of rest.

Dean wrote: ^ the idea that "yom" as used in Genesis is not a literal 24-hour day isn't that compelling given that the sabbath has been recognised as a literal day since the time of Moses - it looks more like an attempt to fit the myth into known data rather than use the myth to explain known data.

Edited by Snow Dog - April 13 2012 at 05:46

Dean wrote: Snow Dog wrote: Dean wrote: ^ the idea that "yom" as used in Genesis is not a literal 24-hour day isn't that compelling given that the sabbath has been recognised as a literal day since the time of Moses - it looks more like an attempt to fit the myth into known data rather than use the myth to explain known data. That doesn't fit in to the Jewish adherence to the universe being 7000 years old. Actually it's 5772 in the Jewish calender so it isn't even the day of rest yet. That age doesn't fit with the creation myth either - that's counting from the end of creation not the start - 3,500 years ago (or 5772 or 7000 or 2012 or back to the time of Moses) all of the events of Genesis had already occurred - when you add up the ages of the patriarchs (even assuming many of them were contemporary and not consecutive) the whole of Genesis spans a few thousand years all by itself .

Edited by Snow Dog - April 13 2012 at 06:26

Textbook wrote: Research suggests that atheists are more moral than theists and in my experience this is true.   Please note: The above statement does not say all theists are immoral. What it means is that moral incentives founded in reality are more compelling than religious ones, as most theists will create excuses to convince themselves god will allow them into heaven whatever acts they end up comitting. http://holysmoke.org/icr-pri.htm http://www.positiveatheism.org/writ/passammo.htm

I'm not saying the research is wrong (I've seen the headline, but I haven't actually looked into the study), but I'm highly dubious of anything scientific that proclaims to have measured morality. It's kind of absurd on the face of it.