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Topic Closed80's Genesis vs. 80's Yes

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yanch View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 04 2010 at 13:10
Originally posted by Tapfret Tapfret wrote:

Yes gets the credit for at least attempting to bring the prog/pop worlds together. 90125 had some very strong moments. Big Generator was revolting. Genesis had nothing for me once Hackett split.

This.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 04 2010 at 14:23

Its all good, all the 80's stuff....I have no problem with groups doing this. Since prog pop music pays them much more money than prog rock music will ever pay. This is their jobs of course and they have bills to pay also.....MTV made Genesis a lot of money...again no problem in my book. MTV probably made Yes a lot of money too.......good for them!!

90125 is a great album.....I can play it from start to finish and enjoy it all. I have Big Generator too.....but prefer 90125.
They both progressed from "prog rock" to "prog pop" to get some cushion money and establish a long chain of royalty checks with 90125 and Invisible Touch......
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 04 2010 at 14:33
Duke and Drama are really good albums IMO. Everything after that from both bands is completely awful, but the stuff from Genesis is even more disgusting. Mama, Abacab, and Invisible Touch are all unlistenable, but at least 90125 has some merit. 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 04 2010 at 14:38

Overall, I prefer 80s Genesis....Duke, Genesis, Invisible Touch are well-crafted albums.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 04 2010 at 14:48
Originally posted by J-Man J-Man wrote:

Duke and Drama are really good albums IMO. Everything after that from both bands is completely awful, but the stuff from Genesis is even more disgusting. Mama, Abacab, and Invisible Touch are all unlistenable, but at least 90125 has some merit. 
 
Without looking and comparing album sales...I feel safe to say those "unlistenable" albums made them gobs of money....It may not fit your taste or your feeling of what Genesis and Yes should have been recording in the 80's.......But I doubt Fragile or Foxtrot would have sold anything close to 90125 and Invisible Touch.
IMO its good to look at and understand why a group may have done what they did......For me I appreciate the 70's stuff they did more because of the 80s stuff.
But that is just me, I don't get stuck on a time period.....I usually listen to everything an artist records.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 04 2010 at 15:25
I think that generally the Genesis albums of this period are more true to their Prog roots and therefore a more rewarding listen, when comared to the Yes offerings of the same period - save for Drama where the playing is just awesome!
"I always say that it’s about breaking the rules. But the secret of breaking rules in a way that works is understanding what the rules are in the first place". Rick Wakeman
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 04 2010 at 21:17
Hi,
 
Personally, I thought that both bands were over rated by then and not worth the listen anymore ... and there was far better music out there than those two bands.
 
YES suffered badly from interpersonal garbage and I really feel that the music became an idea and not real anymore as it was at one time. GENESIS was just a pop band by that time with nice songs ... so what ... so does Kanye West and every other turkey out there today!
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 05 2010 at 03:27
In my mind, there isn't any doubt : Yes releases (from that era) are better than Genesis' ones.


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 05 2010 at 03:29
Originally posted by Catcher10 Catcher10 wrote:

Originally posted by J-Man J-Man wrote:

Duke and Drama are really good albums IMO. Everything after that from both bands is completely awful, but the stuff from Genesis is even more disgusting. Mama, Abacab, and Invisible Touch are all unlistenable, but at least 90125 has some merit. 
 
Without looking and comparing album sales...I feel safe to say those "unlistenable" albums made them gobs of money....It may not fit your taste or your feeling of what Genesis and Yes should have been recording in the 80's.......But I doubt Fragile or Foxtrot would have sold anything close to 90125 and Invisible Touch.
IMO its good to look at and understand why a group may have done what they did......For me I appreciate the 70's stuff they did more because of the 80s stuff.
But that is just me, I don't get stuck on a time period.....I usually listen to everything an artist records.


I agree with virtually every point you've made on this thread, Jose, but I would take small issue regarding album sales in the 70's. Don't forget that Yes were certainly one of the biggest bands on the planet, beaten only, I think, by the likes of Led Zep, The Stones, The Who. Fragile certainly would have shifted by the truckload. In terms of Genesis, though, you are absolutely spot on - Foxtrot was not a huge seller in the UK or US on its release, and the 80's output certainly shifted by the shedload.

The important point I think we would absolutely agree on is the fundamental one, that is that there was great merit in both bands post 1980 output.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 05 2010 at 12:25
^ I think there was amazing merit in both post 1980.......u are right, in the UK probably much better sales than I know of.
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2010 at 14:40
Originally posted by Lozlan Lozlan wrote:

Ug.  I just threw up in my mouth a little.

I'd have to say Yes.  My Phil Collins hate is too deep to permit the alternative.
 
You probably threw up in your mouth because of your generally bad taste.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 07 2010 at 05:42

Genesis were always my band, so of course I'm going to vote for all the Genesis albums. Wink

I think all of the 80's Genesis albums, barring Invisible Touch (maybe), were progressive. But even IT had Domino, which was a classic Genesis prog song.

So my vote goes to Genesis. 


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 08 2010 at 19:23

Complete 80s albums of them are good but I feel Yes more succesful in prog and experimental essence.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2010 at 19:54
None.

Except Drama

Iván


Edited by Ivan_Melgar_M - November 03 2010 at 19:55
            
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2010 at 20:19
Neither Drama nor Duke are 80s albums.  They are 70s albums.  Geek


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2010 at 22:09
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Neither Drama nor Duke are 80s albums.  They are 70s albums.  Geek



Maybe Duke, because it was recorded in 1979......But wasn't Drama recorded on April 1980 and released August 22, 1980?

Iván 
            
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2010 at 22:37
Originally posted by Ivan_Melgar_M Ivan_Melgar_M wrote:

Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Neither Drama nor Duke are 80s albums.  They are 70s albums.  Geek



Maybe Duke, because it was recorded in 1979......But wasn't Drama recorded on April 1980 and released August 22, 1980?

Iván 


I was being a geek about the dates.  The year1980 is a part of the 1970s.  That's because we don't start the epoch on "year zero," we start on year one.  So a decade is years 1-10 (or 1971-1980).

http://www.timeanddate.com/counters/mil2000.html

This was a calendar reformed by a Pope, anyway.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2010 at 23:25
LOL, I knew about that and was expecting your reply, but that's not exact IMO.

1980 is part of the same decade of 1971 (eight decade of the XX Century), but you can't call 1980 as part of the 70's, but any year that ends in eighty something (including 1980) is part of the 80's, no matter to what decade of the century they belong.

In other words, the XXI Century started in 2001, but the 00's started in 2000.

Iván.
            
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2010 at 23:34
I like 90125, haven't got around to Big Generator yet.  Pop Genesis is not my thing. As far as I am concerned, the life was sucked out of Genesis after Hackett left. Not for any sentimental reasons, simply because he was the only interesting player in the band, apart from Collins. And Collins would play less and less like his jazz-rock monster self and more and more like...Dead.   Banks is a great composer for sure, but mind I am talking about the playing, the things that Hackett does on guitar hold your attention even where the songs may be running out of steam a bit.   Rather than BAD, pop Genesis just sounds very bland and dull to me and I feel really unable to warm up to it for that reason. Good pop is supposed to be invigorating and irresistibly catchy, not bland.  
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 04 2010 at 06:42
It's a shame both bands went in a commercial direction and didn't stick to their progressive roots, but it really was an evolve or die era.  I think the Yes hits were more proggier though, but only by a slight margin.
Released date are often when it it impacted you but recorded dates are when it really happened...

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