High Tide

Buy Sea Shanties & High Tide (1st and 2nd album), other discs are mainly out-takes and unreleased tracks not even good (I have 8 cds of them, IMO The Flood is not actually the better...)

eugene wrote: Thanks,abyssyinfinity, - shall try to find first two albums by them Apparently not many people are familiar with this band, or maybe the lack of replies to this topic is directly related to the fact that it was moved to non-prog music section I want to know WHY topic about band which is enlisted in ProgArchives is getting moved to Non-prog Music section??????????????????????????

I can't be as helpful as abyssyinfinity, since I have only heard the two first albums, but I agree that both of them, and especially Sea Shanties, are masterpieces of prog...

It seems as if the busy thread mover was too fast with this one. I'd PM Maani to ask him to return this to the proper section...

Man Overboard wrote: There seems to be a certain admin who derives great joy from moving topics from a place where they can be properly discussed to a place where they have no relavence...  I was once scared that prog bands not in the archives would be taken out of the general forum, but now even bands that ARE in the archives are getting moved!  W.T.F.

f**king absurd. Much more of this and I might throw in the towel and look for somewhere a little more accepting. The GEPR entry makes these chaps sound good, btw, so I'll probably be checking them out too!

Trouserpress wrote: Man Overboard wrote: There seems to be a certain admin who derives great joy from moving topics from a place where they can be properly discussed to a place where they have no relavence...  I was once scared that prog bands not in the archives would be taken out of the general forum, but now even bands that ARE in the archives are getting moved!  W.T.F.  f**king absurd. Much more of this and I might throw in the towel and look for somewhere a little more accepting. The GEPR entry makes these chaps sound good, btw, so I'll probably be checking them out too!

Shouldn't you wait for Maani's response? The thread was moved to the wrong category ... it can be moved to the right one as easily, no harm done. Geez.

Man Overboard wrote: The right catagory was the one it was in.  I'm curious as to why he's seemingly got such a knee-jerk reaction, moving any band that he doesn't consider prog himself, or doesn't know, out of Prog Music Lounge and into obscurity.

A while ago he posted the "I HOPE YOU ALL PRINT THIS OUT" topic, and it says that discussions about prog bands and albums should be done in the Recommendations/Listening To category, and only prog music discussions not related to specific bands and albums are for the prog music lounge.

And THAT is why I made the suggestion to change the categories, as obviously either we are all too stupid, or the present concept sucks.

Man Overboard wrote: The I HOPE YOU ALL PRINT THIS OUT topic says: Want to talk about a specific album? It goes in "Recommendations/Currently Listening" ---- Note: Unless and until an artist is included in Prog Archives, they are considered "non-prog."  In other words, discussions in "Prog Music Lounge" should only be about groups/music currently included in Prog Archives, or about progressive rock music in general. This thread isn't about a specific album, though he did *mention* a specific album; the thread is asking for more info on the band. Maani's mentioned in the past that he hopes to get ALL discussion on other catagories, and delete the PML.  THAT is what upsets me, and every time I see a topic moved, I see us moving closer to that, and I can't stand the thought of it.

You're right, I didn't recall his distinction between bands and albums. But IMO you can't separate this discussions. IMHO the category "Prog Music Lounge" could simply be renamed to "Bands And Albums listed in the archives", and "Bands And Albums" should be renamed to "Prog Bands And Albums not currently listed in the archives" and moved to the top group of categories. Recommendations/Listening to would become obsolete.

I do think we're in dire need of a reform...  the current system, as outlined in the aforementioned thread, is overbearing, awkward, and a bit subdividing.  I think it's backwards to have one forum where it's okay to ask about the music of the Flower Kings in general, but another one entirely if I'm inclined to ask about a specific album.  And another where I can talk about the DVD, and a fourth still if I feel the desire to talk about a concert of theirs I went to.  

...you remember the previous attempted reform, with a catagory for each subforum?  They were gonna enforce it by how it's listed in the archives...  so PT would be only discussed in Space Rock, though they haven't been such in ages.

Sea Shanties is okay but a little repetitive for me in many areas of the cd.

Trousy:  Maani sent me a PM, and I wrote a lengthy reply.  I hope he doesn't get upset with me posting it, but I'd like to see what people think of what I had to say. 

Maani's original PM:

M.O.:

Whoa!  Sounds like someone is holding a serious grudge!

Re High Tide, I had thought from the nature of the thread that the poster was asking why the group was not in the archives.  It simply never occurred to me to look.  I made a mistake.  So sure me...  But that's hardly a reason to post a thread with a vulgar title and get your back up!

Better would simply have been to PM me (since I see that quicker than I see a newly posted thread) and ask me why I moved it since HT is in the archives.  Had you done so, I would have moved the thread back to PML right away, obviating the need for you to create a thread...

Peace.

My response:

Hey man...  sorry 'bout that.  I get riled up easily...  no grudge, trust me.  Instead of a "this sucks" rant, let me explain myself.  And if I'm wrong with any of my assumptions, please tell me.

I've been an internet forum veteran since '95.  Possibly not as long as yourself, I'm still a child in comparison.  I've been posting on this forum in particular since November of last year...  not long at all.  It's been a place I love; the people are great, the arguments are fun, and there is tons and tons of information, everywhere you look.

I do not understand the need for strict subdivision.  As I said in another thread:

I think it's backwards to have one forum where it's okay to ask about the music of the Flower Kings in general, but another one entirely if I'm inclined to ask about a specific album.  And another where I can talk about the DVD, and a fourth still if I feel the desire to talk about a concert of theirs I went to.  

Wanting to keep a general forum where just about anything prog is alright has nothing to do with laziness, as you said in a post last month.  We've developed a wonderful community here.  To force each topic to be filtered into a very specific forum kills a bit of that community.  I love the feeling of coming into Prog Music Lounge and seeing a thread I wasn't expecting to see that gets my mind wandering in a new direction.  With such specific standards for where threads can be posted, that element is gone.  New ideas will rarely be heard.  Everyone will know exactly what to expect everywhere they go, and that will stifle a lot of discussion. 

Chalk it up to laziness if you want, but I'm sure a quick check of server traffic will show exponentially more traffic in Prog Music Lounge than other forums, possibly even combined.  Why can't we work in making Prog Music Lounge a better place for, well, prog discussion? 

It confuses me to no end that bands not in the archived end up in Non-Prog Music.  A few months ago, I asked why a certain band was not in the archives, and it was suggested I submit info to M@X.  Dutifully, I submitted everything possible in its proper format:  bio, pictures, discography, MP3, and more.  Still, the band is not in the archives, and I've received no word whether it's been rejected or just not gotten around to when I ask, despite it being unquestionably prog.  There are many, many other bands that fall in that same catagory.  The idea of making another forum for Prog Not In The Archives is a step in the right direction in theory, but it seems to be yet another subdivision of our community. 

Why all this banter about "community"?  Because ours is a great one.  Sadly, when forums become subdivided, most people pick a forum they like most, and post there more than other places, where with a more general forum they'd be more likely to discuss in a greater variety of topics.  This seems...  self-defeating.

Please...  don't write me up as a stupid, quick-to-upset hothead.  I mean, I *am* a quick-to-upset hothead, but I feel that I've got respectable input regarding the issues I get hot over.  Please consider what I have to say.

--Aaron

Jean and I volunteered to work as collaborators; we were asked to write five reviews and send the permanent links in an e-mail, which we did. No reaction yet, although we did it ten days ago. I must say we feel "verarscht", to use a German expression (which could best be translated as "being pissed off because one had one's leg pulled needlessly").