Prog Definition

dtguitarfan wrote: .....in THIS genre, it IS important to know the difference between crap and good music.

Snow Dog wrote: dtguitarfan wrote: .....in THIS genre, it IS important to know the difference between crap and good music. Really? What is crap music? What is good?

Pretty much every artist that won a Grammy this year (that was televised) is crap music.

HolyMoly wrote: Personally, I find it interesting to understand WHY and HOW music works, and music theory makes it clearer to me. There is some method to it besides it just "sounding good". My appreciation comes from a balance of techncal knowledge and subjective "feel".

Horizons wrote: dtguitarfan wrote: Snow Dog wrote: dtguitarfan wrote: .....in THIS genre, it IS important to know the difference between crap and good music. Really? What is crap music? What is good? Pretty much every artist that won a Grammy this year (that was televised) is crap music. I quite enjoy Bon Iver.

I did say "pretty much" - here, THIS is crap music:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=llKlUBkEQAE&feature=youtube_gdata_player

The Bearded Bard wrote: HolyMoly wrote: Personally, I find it interesting to understand WHY and HOW music works, and music theory makes it clearer to me. There is some method to it besides it just "sounding good". My appreciation comes from a balance of techncal knowledge and subjective "feel". I really would like to know more about the WHYs and HOWs of music. Perhaps a book like 'Music Theory for Dummies' is just the thing for me?

Sounds like an interesting book Luca, I will check that out.

The Bearded Bard wrote: Thanks for explaining, Dean.     I'm not sure I completely understand it, then again, I'm not a musician and I've got VERY little music theory, so that might be the reason I don't, but I'm definetely wiser after reading your explanation then I was before.

It was my pleasure. Thing to remember is musicians can do it and they're not the sharpest knives in the drawer so even something like 7/4 or 7/8 meter, which we call complex time, is only counting to seven and it's only called complex because 7 doesn't divide by 2 or 3.

octopus-4 wrote: "Music for nerds" is a good definition for prog. It totally justifies what's happening on this thread.

dtguitarfan wrote: Dayvenkirq wrote: octopus-4 wrote: "Music for nerds" is a good definition for prog. It totally justifies what's happening on this thread.                                                                                                                   ... and it totally explains why chicks don't dig it  . I wouldn't really consider prog "greats" illiterate ... sorry for bugging you with the intro to Firth of Fifth again, but you have to acknowledge Banks' weird talent.  I never expected them to - I know the Grammy's are a big popularity contest that has nothing to do with musical value.  But that doesn't change the fact that the Foo Fighters suck.  I mean, they played a song and the only thing their drummer did the whole time was "Dum-Pa-Dum-Pa-Dum-Pa-Dum-Pa-Dum-Pa-Dum-Pa..."

Edited by Dayvenkirq - March 10 2012 at 13:42

Decades ago when I was surrounded by fine musicians , there was a lot of talk about developing a "feel" for a certain style of music. Every musician I traveled with studied with some sort of master. Being great at sight reading, scales, theory yet still asking me if I thought they had the right "feel". It happens when you are young musician with great technique, but haven't reached the level of expressing your own voice. You can be a schooled reader and not know how to express through an instrument ...the true expression of the composition. The composition is complex, but has a lot of feeling. It is not evident to the majority of people in the world. It's America's pathetic reaction to ethnic music. They cringe and let off a nervous stare. They have always been afraid of Arabic music ..which was easier for them to except through a Warner Bros. cartoon or a 3 Stooges episode. Take Gong's "A Sprinkling of Clouds" for an example. The drummer enters in around 4:30. You can count along and tap your foot to 1,2,3,4,5, 1,2,3,4,5, 1,2,3,4,5, 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9, and repeat. This has a lot of feeling ..as it is like dance with a jazz mentality. Gymnastics in prog are meant to be felt and instead they are summed up to be noodling. What? Musicians work up a huge sweat performing prog and many in the audience are actually discouraged by notes. A common reaction in the U.S. when playing fast note passages at the time was only excepted in Jazz, Country, Bluegrass, Swinging Blues, and Surf music. Prog was such a simple idea when musicians decided to take the influence of Classical, European Folk , American Jazz and work those influences into "Rock music". It's so strange when I talk with musicians on the phone from Europe and they will understand a musical concept as if they sat in the room and wrote it with me. I find it rare meeting someone like that in America. Prog is all about "feel" for the musician , yet sometimes the audience is feeling nothing. Prog is like Gnosis. Gnosis is a feeling one will get and not knowing how to descibe it and feeling shock will run from it or surpress it through logic.    

Edited by TODDLER - March 10 2012 at 14:15