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Do PA proggers have the right prog balance?
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Snow Dog View Drop Down
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    Posted: March 24 2012 at 07:53
Originally posted by DaveyByTheSea

At the risk of offending Flower Kings fans ( of which i am one) would any of their albums exist without experimention and filler? The same could be said of Yes's "Tales from...." But I love all the work from both of these artists regardless!

From my point of view " Tales" has no filler. To me it would be like saying that Beethoven's ninth suffers from filler.
Coldness doth get away with the badness.
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The T View Drop Down
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No but you have the right to remain silent.
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Fair point Snow i acknowledge that....probably filler is not the right word. I would also miss any second exorcised from "Tales"
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Posts: 32939 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Snow Dog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2012 at 08:08
Originally posted by DaveyByTheSea

Fair point Snow i acknowledge that....probably filler is not the right word. I would also miss any second exorcised from "Tales"

No...you are right. many people here have a problem with "Tales" and think it would be better as a shorter album. Even a single  album has been suggested. Not  for me though.
Coldness doth get away with the badness.
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Originally posted by dr prog

Too often I'm finding the albums here to be rated low other albums rated high.


There, much better. Tongue
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Posts: 32939 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Snow Dog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2012 at 08:18
Originally posted by Slartibartfast

Originally posted by dr prog

Too often I'm finding the albums here to be rated low other albums rated high.


There, much better. Tongue

That is now a very tight post without flab.
Coldness doth get away with the badness.
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Posts: 22837 		Post Options Post Options   Quote colorofmoney91 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2012 at 08:31
Originally posted by Slartibartfast

Originally posted by dr prog

Too often I'm finding the albums here to be rated low other albums rated high.


There, much better. Tongue

But it's an atrocity Shocked
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Posts: 15463 		Post Options Post Options   Quote The T Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2012 at 08:32
Originally posted by Slartibartfast


Originally posted by dr prog



Too often I'm finding the albums here to be rated low other albums rated high.



There, much better. Tongue
There's a lot of one rated right in the middle too!
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Posts: 32939 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Snow Dog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2012 at 08:33
Originally posted by colorofmoney91

Originally posted by Slartibartfast

Originally posted by dr prog

Too often I'm finding the albums here to be rated low other albums rated high.


There, much better. Tongue

But it's an atrocity Shocked

No. no! Now we have the essentials of the post with all the clutter and crap cut out! Now it is a five star post while before it was dragged down to a two or three at most. There were words that ruined an otherwise perfect post!
Coldness doth get away with the badness.
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Posts: 26021 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Slartibartfast Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2012 at 08:34
I question the need for "balance" in the first place when it comes to opinions. Objectivity is really unachievable.
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I like my progressive music to be absolutely stagnant.
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Pig 
What does that smiley mean ......What is this tread........why did I hit respond....... 


Edited by tamijo - March 24 2012 at 08:48
New JoKe Inc album, Download at www.jokeinc.bandcamp.com
more about JoKe Inc at www.jokeinc.webs.com/


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Posts: 604 		Post Options Post Options   Quote progresssaurus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2012 at 08:48
Originally posted by Slartibartfast

I question the need for "balance" in the first place when it comes to opinions. Objectivity is really unachievable.
But we can search intersubjective objectivity using new progressive method. We can made special poll for election so called Right Balanced Rater (RBR), which will rate albums instead us other.
 
My nomination for RBR: dr prog.
 
And your?
 
p.s.
It is not joke, it is experiment LOL


Edited by progresssaurus - March 24 2012 at 09:16
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Posts: 1325 		Post Options Post Options   Quote dtguitarfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2012 at 09:00
Originally posted by dr prog

Too often I'm finding the best composed albums here to be rated low and the least well composed albums rated high. Most of us like the same bands of the era between the late 60s and early 80s but do prog listeners continually choose the most experimental/least composed stuff over the most well composed? I've always believed the best music came from the best composers and the more great compositions you can put in an album the better. Experimenting is ok, but when it's long passages of non melodic music, I believe this is filler and proof the band lacks strong composition to fill an album. Experimenting and Improvising should be saved for concerts. Albums should be packed with genius Tongue. Do proggers listen to band catalogues extensively? Do they give all albums enough spins or do they buy so many albums from different bands than they don't get time to enjoy albums over many listens? I'm finding several albums by bands that rate low here to be close to the best albums. Full of quality compositions. Quality compositions will always come out on top. I'm past that overdone prog and fusion which tries to get over complex. Just sounds a bit of a mess. Or you get the amatuer composers who rely on technicality and experimenting. That doesn't go far with me either. It's time we all matured and gave the right albums the high ratings in here Big smile



I feel you man, although I might like the technicality stuff more than you do.  But I have a couple buddies who are prog heads as well, and they're always telling me they bought some album because it was in the top ten on the PA Top 100 of the year list, and they didn't like it, and I keep telling them just because it's high up on that list doesn't make it good!  I think usually the best albums make the list, but are way down the list because they're given just as many 1 and 2 star ratings as 4 and 5.  For some reason the best albums are always hated as much as they're loved around here.  Wink
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Posts: 14512 		Post Options Post Options   Quote sleeper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2012 at 09:18
Originally posted by progresssaurus

Originally posted by Slartibartfast


The original post is full of filler.
 
Small-minded Smile The original post is EXPERIMENT !!! Big smile

I dont know about Experiment, but its definitely improvised.
Spending more than I should on Prog since 2005

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Posts: 713 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Manuel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2012 at 10:06
My thought on this matter is that most people go for their personal taste (nothing wrong with that), not only on this forum, but everywhere you look, and therefore, you'll find things that you love and find amazing, with lower rating  than others you would not care much for, and viceversa.

 
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Posts: 26021 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Slartibartfast Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 24 2012 at 10:28
Originally posted by progresssaurus

Originally posted by Slartibartfast

I question the need for "balance" in the first place when it comes to opinions. Objectivity is really unachievable.
But we can search intersubjective objectivity using new progressive method. We can made special poll for election so called Right Balanced Rater (RBR), which will rate albums instead us other.

That was really good. Thumbs Up
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wat
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Originally posted by dr prog

but do prog listeners continually choose the most experimental/least composed stuff over the most well composed?
 
I don't think being experimental necessarily means that the music is built on a minor degree of composing. You can construct elaborate stuff and still be experimental and still retain a sense of purpose and intent behind it. But of course there is music which you might say is entirely experimental, just for the sake of it, and it's up to each person to decide if it is and what quality it may have. But experimentalism is a relative thing. It's not the antithesis to "good composing". You can include experimentation to different degrees. 100% experimental would mean that it would be an "experiment", and no one would be sure what was going on.
 
 
Originally posted by dr prog

Experimenting is ok, but when it's long passages of non melodic music, I believe this is filler and proof the band lacks strong composition to fill an album. 
 
Maybe I could agree with you in specific cases, but I don't think you really mean that in general all passages without melodies are filler material. "filler" is a specific word. It would only be so if there was a lack of true intent and inspiration behind the music, but how could you know?
 
Originally posted by dr prog

amatuer composers who rely on technicality and experimenting.
 
I don't think in terms of amateur and professional, because its not such levels that determine the quality of the music. But to be strongly attached to virtuosity and experimenting and technical , any aspect really , won't produce the best music, I believe the focus should be all of the music, the sum of all parts.
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