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Why listen to mediocre prog if you not a collector
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Dayvenkirq View Drop Down
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    Posted: November 03 2012 at 18:05
Originally posted by Guldbamsen

... but when you take it with you and start awarding music stars inside your head - conjuring up wild discussions about whether to rate something 3 or 4 stars, then you are really missing the point by a very large margin. Music should hopefully be more than that.
Maybe not here on PA. Music should be more than that, not reviews. I remember that about a couple of months back there was some sort of derision of founding reviews on the enjoyment factor. Can't remember what thread it was.
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Guldbamsen View Drop Down
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Posts: 7307 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Guldbamsen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2012 at 18:13
Originally posted by Dayvenkirq


Originally posted by Guldbamsen

... but when you take it with you and start awarding music stars inside your head - conjuring up wild discussions about whether to rate something 3 or 4 stars, then you are really missing the point by a very large margin. Music should hopefully be more than that.
Maybe not here on PA. Music should be more than that, not reviews. I remember that about a couple of months back there was some sort of derision of founding reviews on the enjoyment factor. Can't remember what thread it was.



I think I know what you mean, but it is entirely feasible to review something - and do it well without reducing the album to a number, or putting the rating on a pedestal.
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Posts: 422 		Post Options Post Options   Quote silverpot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2012 at 18:19
And what exactly is a masterpiece? Isn't that rather subjective? Just because a majority of the reviewers here rate an album just three or two stars doesn't mean it's not an album someone else considers to be a masterpiece.

It would be interesting to know what the OP thinks is mediocre prog. Might be something I absolutely love, and is a masterpiece in my taste . Wink
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Posts: 7299 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Dayvenkirq Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2012 at 18:27
Originally posted by Guldbamsen

Originally posted by Dayvenkirq


Originally posted by Guldbamsen

... but when you take it with you and start awarding music stars inside your head - conjuring up wild discussions about whether to rate something 3 or 4 stars, then you are really missing the point by a very large margin. Music should hopefully be more than that.
Maybe not here on PA. Music should be more than that, not reviews. I remember that about a couple of months back there was some sort of derision of founding reviews on the enjoyment factor. Can't remember what thread it was.

I think I know what you mean, but it is entirely feasible to review something - and do it well without reducing the album to a number, or putting the rating on a pedestal.
In other words, you are highly encouraging writing a review without just hanging a rating on an album. Well, ... nobody thought (to my certain knowledge, at least) that just giving a number would be a good idea.
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Guldbamsen View Drop Down
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Posts: 7307 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Guldbamsen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2012 at 18:36
Originally posted by Dayvenkirq


Originally posted by Guldbamsen

Originally posted by Dayvenkirq


Originally posted by Guldbamsen

... but when you take it with you and start awarding music stars inside your head - conjuring up wild discussions about whether to rate something 3 or 4 stars, then you are really missing the point by a very large margin. Music should hopefully be more than that.
Maybe not here on PA. Music should be more than that, not reviews. I remember that about a couple of months back there was some sort of derision of founding reviews on the enjoyment factor. Can't remember what thread it was.
I think I know what you mean, but it is entirely feasible to review something - and do it well without reducing the album to a number, or putting the rating on a pedestal.

In other words, you are highly encouraging writing a review without just hanging a rating on an album. Well, ... nobody thought (to my certain knowledge, at least) that just giving a number would be a good idea.


Nah, I don't think so either. But some emphasise the meaning of the rating to the extent of futility imho.
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Posts: 1151 		Post Options Post Options   Quote HarbouringTheSoul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2012 at 19:00
I don't know about you, but I always try to rate albums in my head. This has no real significance, it's just an attempt to express my enjoyment of an album in a number. And usually it works quite well.
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Posts: 26 		Post Options Post Options   Quote My Dreaming Hill Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2012 at 19:06
Just because A Momentary Lapse of Reason isn't the best Pink Floyd album that doesn't mean it can't be one of my favorites.

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Posts: 7940 		Post Options Post Options   Quote The Doctor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2012 at 19:33
If I only listened to flawless, masterpiece albums, my listening experience would be extremely limited and even the best albums get boring if you listen to them over and over and over again, ad nauseam.  I can still find enjoyment in a three or four star album, and even a lot of two star albums have some good stuff on them (Domino and Brazilian on Invisible Touch, Sorrow on Momentary Lapse, I'm Running and Shoot High, Aim Low on Big Generator, etc.)
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Posts: 43517 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Atavachron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2012 at 20:26
I'm an obscure & vintage Prog buff but I know what the OP means--  sometimes you realize why certain artists faded into obscurity, and the real 'lost gems' are far and few between.
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Posts: 12764 		Post Options Post Options   Quote AtomicCrimsonRush Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2012 at 20:44
I get sick of the same album over and over and will listen to others from same artist to get a fresh perspective on their other works. Also if I find out an album is really bad I will never return to it, but if it at least has 3 stars by my standards its worth a listen.


I like obscure prog as well as the popular albums as it helps to open my ears to what is out there.
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Posts: 4695 		Post Options Post Options   Quote rogerthat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2012 at 22:17
Originally posted by desistindo

I have a theory that only collectors listen to prog that arent a masterpiece (at least in personal taste perspective). If you can listen to a top star album, why would you listen a two star, for instance? Particularly speaking, I have many prog albums and I just linsten back to the tops. Does it occur with you too?

Well, you may not know that it IS a two star album the first time around.  It might be rated 4.5 on PA and might be worth only 2 to you, that's personal taste.    However, I get the point and I am also not very much interested in completism or in tracking down any and every prog rock band with a half decent rating.  I would much rather listen to some completely different music than prog rock instead of listening to the same old derivative by the numbers prog by a mediocre band.


Edited by rogerthat - November 03 2012 at 22:18
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Posts: 1182 		Post Options Post Options   Quote prog4evr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 03 2012 at 23:24
Originally posted by My Dreaming Hill

Just because A Momentary Lapse of Reason isn't the best Pink Floyd album that doesn't mean it can't be one of my favorites.
I would say the same thing about "Animals" by Floyd...
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Posts: 908 		Post Options Post Options   Quote trackstoni Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 04 2012 at 00:05
Originally posted by desistindo

I have a theory that only collectors listen to prog that arent a masterpiece (at least in personal taste perspective). If you can listen to a top star album, why would you listen a two star, for instance? Particularly speaking, I have many prog albums and I just linsten back to the tops. Does it occur with you too?

   yep !! all the time since 1968  !   really , i always skip so many great albums that i really appreciate but don't feel like listen to !  State of Mind   !   Cool
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Posts: 953 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Tom Ozric Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 04 2012 at 03:47
When is a masterpiece a masterpiece ?? Confused
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Posts: 7299 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Dayvenkirq Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 04 2012 at 08:57
^ If I remember correctly, there is a whole Reviews discussion thread, part of which is dedicated to exactly that.
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Posts: 3831 		Post Options Post Options   Quote desistindo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 04 2012 at 19:54
Originally posted by Atavachron

I'm an obscure & vintage Prog buff but I know what the OP means--  sometimes you realize why certain artists faded into obscurity, and the real 'lost gems' are far and few between.

Exactly. I noticed you focused the discussion around the "masterpiece" concept. Of course it is a subjective matter, but what I was trying to explain is that, naturally, the prog you consider "low" cant get your attention for very long. And generaly, when you have explored an artist/ genre you like to the exaustion you might Appeal to the obscurities. 


Originally posted by rogerthat

Originally posted by desistindo

I have a theory that only collectors listen to prog that arent a masterpiece (at least in personal taste perspective). If you can listen to a top star album, why would you listen a two star, for instance? Particularly speaking, I have many prog albums and I just linsten back to the tops. Does it occur with you too?

Well, you may not know that it IS a two star album the first time around.  It might be rated 4.5 on PA and might be worth only 2 to you, that's personal taste.    However, I get the point and I am also not very much interested in completism or in tracking down any and every prog rock band with a half decent rating.  I would much rather listen to some completely different music than prog rock instead of listening to the same old derivative by the numbers prog by a mediocre band.

True! The fact is: for me it is i portant not to waste the "magic" of the great prog albums by listen to them extensively! But when i comes about listen "not so great" prog albums, I do prefer listen to other kinds of music. But I found may lost gems in obscure prog and related music, but that doesnt mean I will listen the entire albm because of them. There aresome prog band from the "B class" - if we may call them as that - that has one or two really great songs, and i listen those, not the hole album. 
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Posts: 712 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Manuel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 04 2012 at 22:19
Originally posted by octopus-4

Originally posted by thellama73

No. I listen to dozens of albums that are not masterpieces. Just because something is not a masterpiece does not mean it is not enjoyable and satisfying, particularly if you are in a particular mood.

If we only listened to masterpieces, we would have very little to choose from and variety is the spice of life.
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Posts: 14185 		Post Options Post Options   Quote King of Loss Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 04 2012 at 22:23
There are some "mediocre" prog that are popular prog!


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Posts: 68 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Aquiring the Taste Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 06 2012 at 02:43
Life is too short to spend it listening to mediocre music of any kind.
Most of my favourite Prog. Groups had their mediocre moments, so while I love their best, I am not tempted to own every album.
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Posts: 7307 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Guldbamsen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 06 2012 at 02:51
^That I can understand, but as mentioned many times in this thread - sometimes those masterpieces don't instantly reveal themselves to you - plus tastes change and what may have sounded like sonic faeces when you first heard it, may just be a real humdinger now. Who knows?
If you don't risk listening to other music than what you deem safe and you already know to be great, then the possibilities for new discoveries will drastically decline.

Sorry for taking that further than what you probably meantEmbarrassed I too don't buy every release from my favourite acts - far too much mediocre stuff. I really don't get those collectors that keep buying material just because it's Genesis, Crimson, Floyd insert name with big discography hereBig smile
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