Forum Home Forum Home > Other music related lounges > Tech Talk
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - How do you listen to music in the home?
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

How do you listen to music in the home?

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123 10>
Author
Message Reverse Sort Order
progbethyname View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: July 30 2012
Location: DAC LAND
Status: Offline
Points: 5106
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote progbethyname Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: How do you listen to music in the home?
    Posted: October 14 2014 at 23:43
Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:

^ I'll try not to LOL


I am happy to hear that you are taking a more serious approach to your music listening situation.
Speaker position is very important. Flutter echo is nasty.
Threshold still have all the goods that makes them one of the best classic rock/Prog metal bands in the world. 2014's For The Journey is worth a serious listen.
Back to Top
Catcher10 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December 23 2009
Location: Emerald City
Status: Offline
Points: 6801
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 12 2014 at 11:50
Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:

I did some tests yesterday by lifting the speakers, moving them apart and tilting them and the sound definitely improved. The stereo effects are really clear and it echoes less. Time to buy some speaker stands Wink
 
Now sit back and enjoy.......
      
Back to Top
Meltdowner View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June 25 2013
Location: Portugal
Status: Offline
Points: 612
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Meltdowner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 12 2014 at 08:46
^ I'll try not to LOL
Back to Top
Argonaught View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June 04 2012
Location: Virginia
Status: Offline
Points: 515
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Argonaught Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 12 2014 at 08:04
^^ good stuff .. just do not drive yourself crazy over these. Many good people have sleepwalked into S.A.D. (Self-inflicted Audiophilia Disorder) .. and it's all downhill from there Tongue 
Back to Top
Dean View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout

Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Albion
Status: Offline
Points: 33153
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 12 2014 at 07:31
Thumbs Up


If you cannot be wise, pretend to be someone who is wise and then just behave like they would - Neil Gaiman
Back to Top
Meltdowner View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June 25 2013
Location: Portugal
Status: Offline
Points: 612
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Meltdowner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 12 2014 at 07:06
I did some tests yesterday by lifting the speakers, moving them apart and tilting them and the sound definitely improved. The stereo effects are really clear and it echoes less. Time to buy some speaker stands Wink
Back to Top
Catcher10 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December 23 2009
Location: Emerald City
Status: Offline
Points: 6801
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 03 2014 at 21:12
Originally posted by progbethyname progbethyname wrote:

Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:


Thanks for checking it Thumbs UpI asked this to know what cartridge I should get if something appened to it or if I couldn't find other stylus to replace. In that case, if I understand correctly, I should get a light-weighted P-mount cartridge (since there's no counter weight), right?I listened to The Yes Album yesterday to test the changes I made and the sound was incredible compared to how it was: no crackles, no noises and it all sounded crystal clear. I still have a problem I don't know what it is: sometimes between two songs I can hear an echo of the first song and I don't know if it's a problem of the record or the turntable Ermm




Interesting. Could be the speed at which the record is playing at?
The Stylus is getting too much of a workout and there is a residual or echo decay as you mentioned.
Sounds frustrating.


Nope its a common occurrence, one sign his system is revealing and his cart/arm combo is good.
      
Back to Top
progbethyname View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: July 30 2012
Location: DAC LAND
Status: Offline
Points: 5106
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote progbethyname Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 03 2014 at 20:30
Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:


Thanks for checking it Thumbs UpI asked this to know what cartridge I should get if something appened to it or if I couldn't find other stylus to replace. In that case, if I understand correctly, I should get a light-weighted P-mount cartridge (since there's no counter weight), right?I listened to The Yes Album yesterday to test the changes I made and the sound was incredible compared to how it was: no crackles, no noises and it all sounded crystal clear. I still have a problem I don't know what it is: sometimes between two songs I can hear an echo of the first song and I don't know if it's a problem of the record or the turntable Ermm




Interesting. Could be the speed at which the record is playing at?
The Stylus is getting too much of a workout and there is a residual or echo decay as you mentioned.
Sounds frustrating.
Threshold still have all the goods that makes them one of the best classic rock/Prog metal bands in the world. 2014's For The Journey is worth a serious listen.
Back to Top
Meltdowner View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June 25 2013
Location: Portugal
Status: Offline
Points: 612
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Meltdowner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 03 2014 at 18:21
Originally posted by Catcher10 Catcher10 wrote:

This is common, I am guessing what you hear is a faint sound of the start of the next song? What you hear is the true essence of analog recording LOL Usually comes from the tape bleed thru on the master reels, it is pressed in your LP you cannot remove it. The good thing is if you hear it well it is one sign of a good revealing analog deck, especially if the next song starts with a loud crescendo or something. Can also be due to thinner groove walls and your stylus is picking up the ripples in the next groove......I would say nothing is wrong with your table and cart.
 
The no crackles, noise, crystal clear means your arm/cart is well aligned and tracking the groove nicely. For a new stylus you can also upgrade to a JICO stylus from Japan, you will have to check their website if they make one for your cart.
 
Have fun and keep spinnin' them records!
 
Cheers!

I found some stylus on the website that are compatible with my cartridge Smile

Originally posted by Argonaught Argonaught wrote:

I addition to what Catcher10 said: 

Eventually, you'll need a new needle (stylus) even if nothing dramatic happens to the one you have; most of them have to be replaced after 500 hours of playing time; some are said to last for 1,000 hours or longer. 

There aren't too many p-mount cartridges on the market, and, since your turntable doesn't have any adjustments, your choice is even more limited. Depending on your budget, you may want to consider investing into a turntable that has with a regular 1/2" mount  and an adjustable counter-weight. This way you'd be able to select cartridges to please your taste and suit your budget, not only based on the "will it fit into my p-mount and is it light enough?" criteria. I have seen hundreds of $100-$200 turntables on eBay that looked pretty good and were advertised as fully functional. 

The echo: This phenomenon is also described here under "Shortcomings", towards the end of the article

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gramophone_record

You're probably right. I guess I'll make the decision between buying a new TT or a new stylus when the current needle worns out. It's good to know my options before though. Smile

The post-echo describes exactly what's happening. I didn't count the time but it seems like it's accurate.

Thanks everyone for all the great advices! I don't personally know anyone who understands about these things, so this has been very enlightening for me Thumbs Up
Back to Top
Argonaught View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June 04 2012
Location: Virginia
Status: Offline
Points: 515
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Argonaught Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 03 2014 at 17:32
Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:



I asked this to know what cartridge I should get if something appened to it or if I couldn't find other stylus to replace. In that case, if I understand correctly, I should get a light-weighted P-mount cartridge (since there's no counter weight), right?

I can hear an echo of the first song and I don't know if it's a problem of the record or the turntable Ermm


I addition to what Catcher10 said: 

Eventually, you'll need a new needle (stylus) even if nothing dramatic happens to the one you have; most of them have to be replaced after 500 hours of playing time; some are said to last for 1,000 hours or longer. 

There aren't too many p-mount cartridges on the market, and, since your turntable doesn't have any adjustments, your choice is even more limited. Depending on your budget, you may want to consider investing into a turntable that has with a regular 1/2" mount  and an adjustable counter-weight. This way you'd be able to select cartridges to please your taste and suit your budget, not only based on the "will it fit into my p-mount and is it light enough?" criteria. I have seen hundreds of $100-$200 turntables on eBay that looked pretty good and were advertised as fully functional. 

The echo: This phenomenon is also described here under "Shortcomings", towards the end of the article

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gramophone_record



Back to Top
Catcher10 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December 23 2009
Location: Emerald City
Status: Offline
Points: 6801
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 03 2014 at 16:06
Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:

Thanks for checking it Thumbs Up

I asked this to know what cartridge I should get if something appened to it or if I couldn't find other stylus to replace. In that case, if I understand correctly, I should get a light-weighted P-mount cartridge (since there's no counter weight), right?

I listened to The Yes Album yesterday to test the changes I made and the sound was incredible compared to how it was: no crackles, no noises and it all sounded crystal clear. I still have a problem I don't know what it is: sometimes between two songs I can hear an echo of the first song and I don't know if it's a problem of the record or the turntable Ermm
 
This is common, I am guessing what you hear is a faint sound of the start of the next song? What you hear is the true essence of analog recording LOL Usually comes from the tape bleed thru on the master reels, it is pressed in your LP you cannot remove it. The good thing is if you hear it well it is one sign of a good revealing analog deck, especially if the next song starts with a loud crescendo or something. Can also be due to thinner groove walls and your stylus is picking up the ripples in the next groove......I would say nothing is wrong with your table and cart.
 
The no crackles, noise, crystal clear means your arm/cart is well aligned and tracking the groove nicely. For a new stylus you can also upgrade to a JICO stylus from Japan, you will have to check their website if they make one for your cart.
 
Have fun and keep spinnin' them records!
 
Cheers!
      
Back to Top
Meltdowner View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June 25 2013
Location: Portugal
Status: Offline
Points: 612
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Meltdowner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 03 2014 at 12:17
Thanks for checking it Thumbs Up

I asked this to know what cartridge I should get if something appened to it or if I couldn't find other stylus to replace. In that case, if I understand correctly, I should get a light-weighted P-mount cartridge (since there's no counter weight), right?

I listened to The Yes Album yesterday to test the changes I made and the sound was incredible compared to how it was: no crackles, no noises and it all sounded crystal clear. I still have a problem I don't know what it is: sometimes between two songs I can hear an echo of the first song and I don't know if it's a problem of the record or the turntable Ermm


Edited by Meltdowner - October 03 2014 at 12:42
Back to Top
Catcher10 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December 23 2009
Location: Emerald City
Status: Offline
Points: 6801
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 03 2014 at 11:34
Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:

If you don't mind SmileTT: Technics SL-BD20Cartridge: Technics P24 (it's the original, I changed the needle not the cartridge)Thanks Wink



So your SL-BD20 table according to VE has an effective arm mass of 13.5g including cartridge, since it is a P-mount system and also your VTF (tracking force) is fixed at 1.25g, you do not have a counter weight. Your overhang says 15mm but that should also be fixed again since this is a P-mount, but you can verify that. Overhang is the distance from the spindle to the stylus tip, if your arm will move that far.

Cartridge shows a dynamic compliance of 12x10*6 cm/dyne at 100Hz, since it is Japanese cart need to convert to 10Hz to get 21.6 dynamic, as that is what the VE calculator uses.

Those figures give you a 9.3112 resonance frequency, so your combo is good but not surprised since it is all Technics combo. You want to be in the 8Hz to 12Hz range, now this is just an estimate but usually pretty good. The best measurement is with a test record...I would only recommend one if you had a super high end TT/Cart/Arm combo and needed to match for different mfg.

You are in good shape!
Enjoy
      
Back to Top
SteveG View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: April 11 2014
Location: usa
Status: Offline
Points: 1526
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SteveG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 02 2014 at 17:53
^Checky Devil!  Evil Smile
"Even a broken watch is right twice a day" -Man too lazy to wind a watch.
Back to Top
Argonaught View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June 04 2012
Location: Virginia
Status: Offline
Points: 515
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Argonaught Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 02 2014 at 17:51
[QUOTE=Catcher10]

A common problem with cassette decks is the belt will need changing, it will gum up and stretch out too far to operate correctly, just open it up and look for it. That is a cheap easy fix to change the belt. [QUOTE]


What fixes the belt problem really well in cassette decks (and turntables) is DD.  


Edited by Argonaught - October 02 2014 at 17:58
Back to Top
Meltdowner View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June 25 2013
Location: Portugal
Status: Offline
Points: 612
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Meltdowner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 02 2014 at 17:11
If you don't mind Smile

TT: Technics SL-BD20
Cartridge: Technics P24 (it's the original, I changed the needle not the cartridge)

Thanks Wink
Back to Top
Catcher10 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December 23 2009
Location: Emerald City
Status: Offline
Points: 6801
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 02 2014 at 17:01
Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:

^ I got it on Vinyl Engine; I didn't find anywhere else.I'll check the VTA and I didn't know what sibilance was until now, but I don't think a have this problem.By the way, how do I know if a cartridge is compatible with my turntable? Is there a standard reference for the format?



Yes on VE there is a cartridge resonance evaluator under Tools. Input your tonearm effective mass in grams and it will give you a chart where you can find the RF (resonant frequency) your combination falls in.
You need to know the total weight of your cartridge and mounting screws and the dynamic compliance of your cart.

The top row is the total cartridge weight. The left side is the dynamic compliance of the cartridge, which you need to find out from the mfg website or in the VE database.
Cross reference the two and as long as you are in the green you should be good. Better if you are in the middle of the range, keep in mind this is an estimate, but should be close as long as your input data is good.
I have an excel sheet I use also if you tell me the following I can also check it for you.

Effective Arm Mass
Cartridge Mass with screws, washers, nuts
Dynamic Compliance of your cartridge

Or just tell me what make/model of TT and cartridge you have and I can find myself.
      
Back to Top
Meltdowner View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June 25 2013
Location: Portugal
Status: Offline
Points: 612
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Meltdowner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 02 2014 at 16:23
^ I got it on Vinyl Engine; I didn't find anywhere else.
I'll check the VTA and I didn't know what sibilance was until now, but I don't think a have this problem.
By the way, how do I know if a cartridge is compatible with my turntable? Is there a standard reference for the format?
Back to Top
Catcher10 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December 23 2009
Location: Emerald City
Status: Offline
Points: 6801
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Catcher10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 02 2014 at 14:07
Originally posted by Meltdowner Meltdowner wrote:


It's sounds like a stone being dragged and it comes from the speakers.EDIT: I solved the problem. I downloaded the service manual and noticed that the tonearm was lower than it should be: the distance between the stylus and the disc should be between 5 to 7 mm and mine was at 4 mm


Ok I was gonna say check out Vinyl Engine website, they have almost all manuals and great information on turntables.

Your tonearm should be parallel to the vinyl, this is your VTA (Vertical Tracking Angle). From there you can make adjustments based on your ears of either tail up or down slightly. Also to adjust for sibilance if that is an issue.....Sssss should sound as natural as possible. Of course a hot recording cannot be adjusted for

Glad you fixed it! Enjoy...
      
Back to Top
Meltdowner View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June 25 2013
Location: Portugal
Status: Offline
Points: 612
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Meltdowner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 02 2014 at 09:34
It's sounds like a stone being dragged and it comes from the speakers.

EDIT: I solved the problem. I downloaded the service manual and noticed that the tonearm was lower than it should be: the distance between the stylus and the disc should be between 5 to 7 mm and mine was at 4 mm


Edited by Meltdowner - October 02 2014 at 10:35
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123 10>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 11.01
Copyright ©2001-2014 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.070 seconds.