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U.S. Supreme Court Considers Gay Marriage

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Poll Question: What is your opinion on this?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
55 [73.33%]
1 [1.33%]
0 [0.00%]
0 [0.00%]
8 [10.67%]
9 [12.00%]
2 [2.67%]
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Dean View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 07 2013 at 03:54
Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

you mean slow relative to its constitution and Bill of Rights
Probably. I was referring to emancipation and descrimination in general. I guess a specific example would be the 100 years between the Emancipation Proclamation and the Voting Rights Act.


If you cannot be wise, pretend to be someone who is wise and then just behave like they would - Neil Gaiman
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atavachron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 07 2013 at 04:02
ah yes, the bondage of emancipation

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The T Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 07 2013 at 11:43
That it might be legally accepted is much different to say that in other countries it will be culturally accepted.

In some things, yes, specially commerce-related. In others, the rest of the world doesn't really pay much attention to US (or UK's, or Europe) laws.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Triceratopsoil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 07 2013 at 12:37
I know it's like 4 pages later, but I'd just like to clarify since apparently people are arguing about me.

I didn't in any way mock Alex's beliefs, just his opinion that he has the responsibility to try and force them on other people.  Which is bullsh*t.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The T Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 07 2013 at 13:15
True
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Dark Elf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 07 2013 at 13:43
Originally posted by Triceratopsoil Triceratopsoil wrote:

I didn't in any way mock Alex's beliefs, just his opinion that he has the responsibility to try and force them on other people.  Which is bullsh*t.

I am sure he would be upset if he were in a land with a Muslim majority, and was accosted at every turn with Islamic fundamentalists forcibly foisting their beliefs on him. But at least he wouldn't have to worry about gay marriage there. I believe it is a beheading offense still, isn't it?
Please pay a visit to my blog...The Dark Elf File...a slighty skewed journal of music reviews, literary comment, fan-fiction and interminable essays.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 07 2013 at 13:46
Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

That it might be legally accepted is much different to say that in other countries it will be culturally accepted.

In some things, yes, specially commerce-related. In others, the rest of the world doesn't really pay much attention to US (or UK's, or Europe) laws.
*shrug* I stand corrected.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ambient Hurricanes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 07 2013 at 20:22
Hey Dean, forgot to mention yesterday that I replied to you in the atheist thread; didn't know if you had seen it as yet.  I don't really have time to spend on here tonight but I wanted to let you know I had replied.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ambient Hurricanes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 07 2013 at 20:32
Roger/Dark Elf:

First of all, nowhere in Scripture does it say that God hates homosexuals.  It says that He condemns their behavior.  There's a big difference.  God also condemns my own pride, lust, and selfishness, but I believe that I am forgiven because Jesus Christ died on my behalf.  All those who believe, homosexual or heterosexual, will also be forgiven:
"There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus." 

Secondly,

Originally posted by Dictionary Dictionary wrote:


Objective (adj): Having actual existence or reality.


Yes, I do know what the word means, I'm just using a different definition than the one you're thinking of.  I never said that everyone who makes a truth claim has an objective perspective.  I said that religious and moral truth claims are objective because they don't deal with subjective criteria that differ from person to person but with reality. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AlexDOM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 07 2013 at 22:46


/QUOTE]
I am sure he would be upset if he were in a land with a Muslim majority, and was accosted at every turn with Islamic fundamentalists forcibly foisting their beliefs on him. But at least he wouldn't have to worry about gay marriage there. I believe it is a beheading offense still, isn't it?
/QUOTE]

Very interesting...


Edited by AlexDOM - April 07 2013 at 23:07
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AlexDOM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 07 2013 at 22:48
[QUOTE=Ambient Hurricanes]Roger/Dark Elf:

First of all, nowhere in Scripture does it say that God hates homosexuals.  It says that He condemns their behavior.  There's a big difference.  God also condemns my own pride, lust, and selfishness, but I believe that I am forgiven because Jesus Christ died on my behalf.  All those who believe, homosexual or heterosexual, will also be forgiven:
"There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus." 


TRUE DAT!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2013 at 08:39
Originally posted by Ambient Hurricanes Ambient Hurricanes wrote:

Roger/Dark Elf:

First of all, nowhere in Scripture does it say that God hates homosexuals.  It says that He condemns their behavior.  There's a big difference.  God also condemns my own pride, lust, and selfishness, but I believe that I am forgiven because Jesus Christ died on my behalf.  All those who believe, homosexual or heterosexual, will also be forgiven:
"There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus." 

Secondly,

Originally posted by Dictionary Dictionary wrote:


Objective (adj): Having actual existence or reality.


Yes, I do know what the word means, I'm just using a different definition than the one you're thinking of.  I never said that everyone who makes a truth claim has an objective perspective.  I said that religious and moral truth claims are objective because they don't deal with subjective criteria that differ from person to person but with reality. 

That's the worse misused of "objective/subjective" I've seen for awhile. I assumed you would have been aware that you cannot mix the differing definitions of words on a whim because the various meanings are only applicable within the contexts they are being used. It seems I was wrong.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2013 at 08:41
Originally posted by AlexDOM AlexDOM wrote:

[QUOTE=Ambient Hurricanes]Roger/Dark Elf:

First of all, nowhere in Scripture does it say that God hates homosexuals.  It says that He condemns their behavior.  There's a big difference.  God also condemns my own pride, lust, and selfishness, but I believe that I am forgiven because Jesus Christ died on my behalf.  All those who believe, homosexual or heterosexual, will also be forgiven:
"There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus." 


TRUE DAT!!!
So let them marry under the eyes of god if that is their wish then. Approve


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Doctor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2013 at 10:37
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Originally posted by AlexDOM AlexDOM wrote:

[QUOTE=Ambient Hurricanes]Roger/Dark Elf:

First of all, nowhere in Scripture does it say that God hates homosexuals.  It says that He condemns their behavior.  There's a big difference.  God also condemns my own pride, lust, and selfishness, but I believe that I am forgiven because Jesus Christ died on my behalf.  All those who believe, homosexual or heterosexual, will also be forgiven:
"There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus." 


TRUE DAT!!!
So let them marry under the eyes of god if that is their wish then. Approve
 
Even if there is a god, (not dismissing it outright, but not a believer - I'm one of those fence-riders), the universe is pretty freaking huge and I would think any such god would have a lot of other issues to worry about than whether John and Bob are getting hitched or doing the nasty.  Even if the Earth was really the center of the universe (a rather egocentric view in my perspective) there are still a lot of other problems here on Earth that should concern god more than homosexuality, e.g. war, murder, disease, poverty, etc., etc.  If any god were so homophobic (I would hope a god would be advanced enough to be beyond such bigotry) that it was more concerned about homosexual marriage than say war and poverty, then that's not a god that I want any part of. 
I can understand your anger at me, but what did the horse I rode in on ever do to you?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rogerthat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2013 at 11:05
Originally posted by Ambient Hurricanes Ambient Hurricanes wrote:

  It says that He condemns their behavior.  There's a big difference.  God also condemns my own pride, lust, and selfishness, but I believe that I am forgiven because Jesus Christ died on my behalf. 



But what is there to condemn about it if that's just the way the guy is?  Sorry, but to me, that sounds very regressive and it would have to be coming from a text written thousands of years back.    If one side can take shelter under religion to judge others in a very prejudiced way, the other side is entitled to take shelter under freedom of expression to pay right back in the same coin.   I cannot and will not accept religious belief as a sound reason to judge another person.   Religious belief is for the person himself to judge his own actions as to whether he has or hasn't incurred the wrath of his God, not impose on others and pooh pooh their choices.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ExittheLemming Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2013 at 11:29
Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:

Originally posted by Ambient Hurricanes Ambient Hurricanes wrote:

  It says that He condemns their behavior.  There's a big difference.  God also condemns my own pride, lust, and selfishness, but I believe that I am forgiven because Jesus Christ died on my behalf. 



But what is there to condemn about it if that's just the way the guy is?  Sorry, but to me, that sounds very regressive and it would have to be coming from a text written thousands of years back.    If one side can take shelter under religion to judge others in a very prejudiced way, the other side is entitled to take shelter under freedom of expression to pay right back in the same coin.   I cannot and will not accept religious belief as a sound reason to judge another person.   Religious belief is for the person himself to judge his own actions as to whether he has or hasn't incurred the wrath of his God, not impose on others and pooh pooh their choices.


Interesting point that raises an issue I've always been puzzled by i.e. assuming that sexual orientation is a given, and not a choice, wouldn't the idea of homosexuality as a sin become a spurious one? There is clearly a choice involved in secular crimes like murder, rape, arson, stealing etc and also religious sins like greed, gluttony, lust etc but can the same be true for homosexuality? Listening to religious types I often get the impression they have judged people guilty of nothing more than being sincere without any chance of a fair trial: Imagine being a defense lawyer for that poor Devil:

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerinski Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2013 at 12:01
Oeps, is this twisting towards another freewill thread? Shocked
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dtguitarfan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2013 at 15:02
Gay affirming Christian here, and proud of it!  It is NOT unbiblical, regardless of what the false prophets say! Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Larree Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2013 at 16:18
Condemning a form of behavior based on religious beliefs does not give the condemner the right to stop someone from engaging in the condemned behavior.  

Instead of thumping on a bible thump on some bass and drums.  Live and let live!  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DisgruntledPorcupine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 09 2013 at 23:12
Originally posted by Larree Larree wrote:

Condemning a form of behavior based on religious beliefs does not give the condemner the right to stop someone from engaging in the condemned behavior.  

Instead of thumping on a bible thump on some bass and drums.  Live and let live!  

Indeed. Can never understand why people want to force others to abide by their belief system. Quite selfish if you ask me.
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