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Another Facet of Prog - Change

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Earendil View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Earendil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Another Facet of Prog - Change
    Posted: April 07 2013 at 19:51
I totally agree! My brother hates most progressive music and described it as "Hey-everybody-let's-go-on-an-adventure-music".   This just made me smile because that's what I like about most of the music I love.  It takes you from one "place" to another with stops in between.  It's not just stuck in one location musically.

I don't think it's always true, and it's not necessarily correlated to if the music is progressive or not, but I do think progressive music in general has more room to take you on a journey.
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ProgMetaller2112 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ProgMetaller2112 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2013 at 18:22


That''s exactly what I'm looking for in a piece of music. This should be a classic example of it

Edited by ProgMetaller2112 - April 08 2013 at 18:22
“War is peace.
Freedom is slavery.
Ignorance is strength.”
― George Orwell, Nineteen Eighty-Four

"Ignorance and Prejudice and Fear walk Hand in Hand"- Neil Peart

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Post Options Post Options   Quote CoolJimmi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2013 at 22:32
^ Great song and band, ProgMetaller.

Thanks for all the great replies, everybody! This is something I really enjoy in music, and I'm glad people on here responded to it Smile

Let it be known that I, too, love Buddy Holly, but a 20 minute rendition of something as simple as "Everyday" would get rather annoying.

Perhaps there is someone out there who enjoys prog but not the changes the song can undergo? I know that I, on occasion, get a bit peeved when a particular part of the song I really enjoyed is stuck between two other parts I don't quite enjoy as much, and I wonder why they didn't turn that awesome phrase into a whole different song.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote CoolJimmi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 10 2013 at 22:35
Just as an example of what I meant, my favorite (current) song by National Health, "Tenemos Roads," exhibits an interesting and engaging beginning and end, but that middle section with the beautiful choral work is what I wish the entire song was based upon:


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King Crimson776 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote King Crimson776 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 12 2013 at 01:31
Originally posted by Earendil

My brother hates most progressive music and described it as "Hey-everybody-let's-go-on-an-adventure-music".

How anyone could mean that description negatively is beyond me.
"It's music, and I like it" - Miles Davis on Sketches of Spain
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axeman View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote axeman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 12 2013 at 16:28
Originally posted by moshkito

If there is some anger, and I don't think that his anger is that harsh or vindictive, unlike these types of comments about his nature appears to be, it is rather well founded!
Never, said anything about anger. See, you say "pretension" like only something a certain sort of people can be accused of. I don't think that way. 

Originally posted by moshkito

 ... to someone where concentration is important in a piece, it is his very foundation, but nooooo ... you interrupt him for an autograph ... or sto scream "rock'n'roll", and ignore the man on his trip ... and then you get upset that he got touchy with your interruption to his concentration
I've never met the man let alone, molested his concentration. 

Concentration doesn't have anything to do with it. I think he probably concentrated in his symphonic period and his trio period (Starless, Red), and the various parts of the Belew period. But the amount of concentration doesn't make them, in his mind "valid". If seriousness and concentration mattered, then each period should remain valid for the period it was. If it's like a painting, is it really that much like a painter to devalue his prior works or periods? 

I mean if he expects us to dishonor his previous works in the way he does, wouldn't have be closer to denigrating what I cannot do myself? I can't write Lizard, or Fallen Angel or Frame by Frame. So my inability is a constant across his body of work, just like his concentration on his music. 

I'm not trying to condemn a person as much as think about the whole subject of pretense and music. There's a certain point where punk is pretentious. A person who writes "songs like Genesis" because they love 70s Genesis is in a punk-fashion less pretentious than a person who has to make stuff that doesn't sound like anybody else because they want to prove what a original genius they are. (No, that's not a slam at Fripp, either.)

In one sense you can say "prog is pretentious" in another sense you can say pretending to like music that is current when I just love the soundscapes of the prog era was a stigma that a lot of us 90s prog fans shook off. On the other hand, I often find myself pretentious when I reject pop bands because they're pop and later end up finding their tunes infectious. I tried not to like INXS, for example. I just couldn't win that battle over defining my own image. 

I guess you get so used to like-dislike discussion on these forums that it's hard to tell when somebody likes to go beyond that, call it pretension if you will. Smile
-John
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Post Options Post Options   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 13 2013 at 16:11
Originally posted by axeman

...
 I think he probably concentrated in his symphonic period and his trio period (Starless, Red), and the various parts of the Belew period. But the amount of concentration doesn't make them, in his mind "valid". If seriousness and concentration mattered, then each period should remain valid for the period it was. If it's like a painting, is it really that much like a painter to devalue his prior works or periods? 
...
 
Robert has been, from day one, about his concentration level and dedication to that concentration that would help him do the things that he did. We can't see the movie in his head ... but no one will sit here and argue ... how did you find that? ... because we know he did!
 
You HAVE to let go and "devalue" (your word) the works of the past ... if you are an artist, or you become just another middle class hero (John Lennon words), and not an artist, simply repeating the same beat --- which is what a lot of bands today are doing since they can not do anything else!
 
And since you might not know this, it was very much the tradition of the 50s and 60's in film and theater and painting and music and literature to "devalue" (your word!) the previous material and work, in order to find something else, new and exciting ... please check out the "krautrock" special by the BBC, and pay particular attention to Edgar Froese's comments ... which in the end, is not just about "krautrock" but a whole generation around the world! They really are important words that define more about you and I ... than anything else we do or say ... !!!! Or, if it is your "bend" get "The Trip" and listen to Ken's words in the end ... about our ability to learn ... and even he thinks that we cop'd out in our excuses and did not learn! These are/were major artists of our time and the ones that we remember ... and they are not exactly perfect my words, but their sentiment is perfect!
 
Originally posted by axeman


...
I guess you get so used to like-dislike discussion on these forums that it's hard to tell when somebody likes to go beyond that, call it pretension if you will. Smile
 
Sometimes ... but like the words below in my tag line, I hope that you have the taste and feeling inside, so you know what the words are ... instead of just farts in the wind!


Edited by moshkito - April 13 2013 at 16:20
... none of the hits, none of the time ... you might actually find your own art, or self, and forego lousy heroes or Guru's!

www.pedrosena.com
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