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Joined: January 04 2007
Location: Grok City
Status: Offline
Points: 16148
Posted: May 13 2013 at 12:00
ProgressiveMike wrote:
... MOSTLY: Prog was destroyed by Trevor Horn and Geoff Downes.
...
Such a pointless rant ... totally insane and disrespectful of people's artistry and work.
Now you know why they will be remembered far longer for their work than you. You are sounding like a sad, bitter, old fart that didn't make it, and you have to point a finger somewhere except your butt!
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told! www.pedrosena.com
Joined: February 18 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 26151
Posted: May 13 2013 at 13:32
Gerinski wrote:
Carl Palmer's 1973 rotating stainless steel drum kit was perceived by some as jumping the shark, I personally think it was cool as long as you were not a roadie
Documentary bit
Full Toccata solo
The problem was the weight of it ,on one occasion the stage they intended to play on couldn't take it and collapsed. Not sure if the gig was cancelled or not.
Bit of trivia - Ringo Starr owned it for a while although he sold it on. Not sure who to though.
Joined: February 10 2010
Location: Barcelona Spain
Status: Offline
Points: 5093
Posted: May 13 2013 at 16:09
richardh wrote:
Gerinski wrote:
Carl Palmer's 1973 rotating stainless steel drum kit was perceived by some as jumping the shark, I personally think it was cool as long as you were not a roadie
The problem was the weight of it ,on one occasion the stage they intended to play on couldn't take it and collapsed. Not sure if the gig was cancelled or not.
Bit of trivia - Ringo Starr owned it for a while although he sold it on. Not sure who to though.
I have read somewhere that some gigs had indeed to be cancelled because the stage could not cope with it, this being the main reason why he used it for a very short time and he quickly switched to a traditional (still very big) kit.
M27barney I severely object to your post regarding Mr.Wilson.
First, I submit that there are VERY few "whipper-snappers" listening to prog at all.
Secondly I find your underhanded remarks specifying that ones age has in anyway to do with ones awareness of prog instrumentation and techniques to be ill-advised and incorrect. It only serves as a suggestion to your own age, which I dare not comment on.
Thirdly, Steven Wilson is a fantastic artist and regarding him as "same old" is a discredit to your own character and a HUGE loss to your music library. Mr. Wilson has stated in at least one interview that his favorite albums were made in the 70s. The influence of the albums are obvious, and tastefully appreciated in his work. Just because I am a huge fan of the Prog Rock Caretaker and one of progs most successful perpetuators doesn't mean that I believe he is discovering brand new techniques or he is pioneering the use of certain instruments in the realm of rock and roll.
Furthermore, I am acutely aware and appreciative of the work Genesis did in the 70s. Anyone who isn't is likely not a member of this website so your complaint is ineffective, except to serve to piss me off. If you need to disparage Steven Wilson, please choose an appropriate thread.
Hmm, I think you mistook the cut-of-my-jib so to speak, the point of the joust was to take a singularly superlative contemporary CD...and make no mistake the latest Wilson effort is no less than "Genius" - and to speculate that a newcomer to progressive rock perhaps a thirteen year old (just an example of course) - will listen and be taken aback by Wilsons "Innovative" effort - However the person may be unaware of the wealth of progressive music which influenced Wilson.....And since I once stayed at Mr Wilson's house on an invite and when he was in Karma, I can say that he was always destined to become one of the movers-and-shakers in the progressive music scene......
I could have used Flower Kings, Banks of Eden, but I feel that the Wilson effort is far more feeling like Genesis 1972-75....
Joined: February 18 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 26151
Posted: May 14 2013 at 14:25
Another thread that could end up being a discussion about what is 'progressive music'. Anyway just thinking that 'jumping the shark' may have been essential for the future existence of prog. The media stopped taking an interest and that forced it back underground where true creativity flourishes. Music making should be for enjoyment not for money.
Joined: March 29 2013
Location: WA
Status: Offline
Points: 4591
Posted: May 14 2013 at 20:09
humor4u1959 wrote:
Prog "jumped the shark" by 1980, if not a bit sooner than that. It cracks me up when someone says that prog is going strong or is alive and kicking. No it's not! These folks are delusional.
Sure, some bands are still flogging the proverbial dead horse, but it's not a popular style of music with the masses and never will be again. Yet, the old prog bands, as well as the newer ones, have a devout following. I won't debate that. But, you don't hear new prog on the radio now like you did in the 1970's.
And, they don't play huge venues either. The exception to this would be Yes as in last summer's tour of open amphitheaters. Procol Harum opened for them. What a joke! Everyone said they were so much better than Yes, but even my faves, Procol Harum, have dropped to being an opening act. Many years ago, King Crimson and Yes opened for Procol on the same bill! It's sad.
So, let's just be thankful that we'll always have the recorded material to enjoy. That's enough for me.
Ya, I had a chance to go to the Procol/Yes show in San Jose last August. They had $250 3rd row "photo-meet-and-greet tix" and at 1st I was excited then I learned the "photo-meet-and-greet" was with Yes not Procol so I passed. I saw Yes many times in the late 70's and the Union show so didn't really care to meet them but $250 to meet Gary Brooker, that would have been worth it!
Another thread that could end up being a discussion about what is 'progressive music'. Anyway just thinking that 'jumping the shark' may have been essential for the future existence of prog. The media stopped taking an interest and that forced it back underground where true creativity flourishes. Music making should be for enjoyment not for money.
aye - I wholly endorse the last sentence - commerically viable music is not on the agenda for the average symphonic prog punter....
Joined: May 10 2013
Location: NJ, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 32
Posted: May 15 2013 at 06:50
The.Crimson.King wrote:
[QUOTE=humor4u1959] I had a chance to go to the Procol/Yes show in San Jose last August. They had $250 3rd row "photo-meet-and-greet tix" and at 1st I was excited then I learned the "photo-meet-and-greet" was with Yes not Procol ........them but $250 to meet Gary Brooker, that would have been worth it!
To me this is sad. Paying $250 to meet someone, chat with them for 4 minutes and get a photo with them. Hell, that's better than what a prostitute makes. I would never pay that amount or anything close to it to meet someone (including a prostitute), no matter who it is.
A few years back I saw JON ANDERSON solo and he stayed after to meet and greet people FOR FREE!! I got to talk to him for a few minutes, get his autograph, and get a photo with him. Did I mention this was FOR FREE? And I know a lot of other prog artists are as open. During the PORCUPINE TREE FoaBP tour me and my pals were hanging out right next to Mike Portnoy. We didn't want to "hound" him so we said "Hi" and told him how we appreciated his work - and he chatted with us for a few minutes on his own (which he didn't have to do).
I also see the point in certain artists doing this. The record industry has dried up, prog is a draw for only a certain eclectic group of music fans.... it's not like the artists we love are laughing all the way to the bank.
Joined: February 10 2010
Location: Barcelona Spain
Status: Offline
Points: 5093
Posted: May 15 2013 at 07:49
I find it also a bit pathetic... that a pop star arranges 'photo meet and greet' a part of the running business is one thing, but prog artists are not gonna get millionaire by these in any case.
Well, Greg Lake right now could do a 'photo meat and great'
Joined: March 29 2013
Location: WA
Status: Offline
Points: 4591
Posted: May 15 2013 at 10:40
Not trying to defend the $$$-for-autograph thing so prevalent in sports memorabilia (or last years Yes tour), but keep in mind it wasn't just $250 for the "meet and greet" it also included 3rd row seats and free parking at "The Shark Tank" (a venue that regularly charges $20 parking).
Joined: May 10 2013
Location: NJ, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 32
Posted: May 15 2013 at 11:37
Who remembers when concert tix were $12-17, parking $3-5, and if you were lucky enough to be at the right place at the right time you'd run into the artist as they entered or left the arena?
So much for those days - now bend over and hand over $250
Special Collaborator
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout
Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
Posted: May 15 2013 at 11:52
mageestout wrote:
Who remembers when concert tix were $12-17, parking $3-5, and if you were lucky enough to be at the right place at the right time you'd run into the artist as they entered or left the arena?
So much for those days - now bend over and hand over $250
... didn't own a car then so parking wasn't my problem
Joined: October 03 2008
Location: Lą, sui monti.
Status: Offline
Points: 10837
Posted: May 15 2013 at 12:49
mageestout wrote:
Who remembers when concert tix were $12-17, parking $3-5, and if you were lucky enough to be at the right place at the right time you'd run into the artist as they entered or left the arena?
So much for those days - now bend over and hand over $250
My, how expensive America is! I remember having paid some 50 euros to see Alice Cooper or Iron Maiden in Paris (okay, not in arenas, but in venues able to welcome 10 000 people or more) over these two last years.
Joined: May 10 2013
Location: NJ, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 32
Posted: May 15 2013 at 13:16
CPicard wrote:
mageestout wrote:
Who remembers when concert tix were $12-17, parking $3-5, and if you were lucky enough to be at the right place at the right time you'd run into the artist as they entered or left the arena?
So much for those days - now bend over and hand over $250
My, how expensive America is!
Yep. We're capitalist pigs. Just ask Roger Waters.
Joined: October 03 2008
Location: Lą, sui monti.
Status: Offline
Points: 10837
Posted: May 15 2013 at 13:22
mageestout wrote:
CPicard wrote:
mageestout wrote:
Who remembers when concert tix were $12-17, parking $3-5, and if you were lucky enough to be at the right place at the right time you'd run into the artist as they entered or left the arena?
So much for those days - now bend over and hand over $250
My, how expensive America is!
Yep. We're capitalist pigs.
Just ask Roger Waters.
I just checked the prices for his Wall concert in Paris, Stade de France: it ranges from 56 euros (in the grass of the Stadium) to 122 euros for the "Golden Square".
But, on the other hand, who in his/her right mind would like to see Grumpy Waters swindling people by playing the songs from an album released more than 30 years ago - without the other guys of Pink Floyd???
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When did Prog first "Jump the Shark"?
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chopper wrote:
... didn't own a car then so parking wasn't my problem