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Roger Dean to sue James Cameron over Avatar

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Icarium View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Icarium Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2013 at 10:08
James Cameron is the Andrew Lloyd Webber of the movie industrie...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mrtortoise Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2013 at 10:18
Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

Ridiculous. Did Dean 'patent' the concept of floating islands?

Sounds like an ego attack to me, or maybe Dean just needs some cash..

Agreed. Artists used to feel complimented when their ideas or themes were used in other works. Classical composers would pay homage to others by quoting their work. Cameron has elaborated upon an idea that was already in use, he has done no wrong.
 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The T Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2013 at 10:33
Originally posted by mrtortoise mrtortoise wrote:


Originally posted by Blacksword Blacksword wrote:

Ridiculous. Did Dean 'patent' the concept of floating islands?

Sounds like an ego attack to me, or maybe Dean just needs some cash..
Agreed. Artists used to feel complimented when their ideas or themes were used in other works. Classical composers would pay homage to others by quoting their work. Cameron has elaborated upon an idea that was already in use, he has done no wrong.
 
100% agreed. R. Dean must be really suffering from a bout of irrelevance and like 4 years too late he wants to get something out of the success of Avatar. If Avatar had been a total flop, I'm not sure he would be suing now. Also, floating islands are not his creation.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote manofmystery Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2013 at 11:31
Are Kevin Costner, the guys who did Fern Gully, and the Blue Man Group suing Cameron, as well, because I think they also have a case?

Even at that, he's still not as big a thief as that f**king tarantino

Edited by manofmystery - June 29 2013 at 11:31


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote marktheshark Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2013 at 12:43
Originally posted by manofmystery manofmystery wrote:

Are Kevin Costner, the guys who did Fern Gully, and the Blue Man Group suing Cameron, as well, because I think they also have a case?

Even at that, he's still not as big a thief as that f**king tarantino

I know what you mean about Tarantino, part of me sees his films as genre rip offs, but at the same time, I can view them as homages as well. In that sense, I can forgive him because they are entertaining in his qwerky way. Kind of like when Jackson remade King Kong, it came across more as a homage to the original than anything else.

For Cameron's lawyer to claim him as original is ridiculous. What was Titanic but simply Romeo and Juliet on the high seas. The Abyss? 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea with extraterrestrials. And True Lies was more or less a James Bond parody.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sleeper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2013 at 14:16
I hope Roger Dean loses badly, what an idiotic case.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atavachron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2013 at 17:00
How does one lose a lawsuit badly?   I suspect most artists here are sympathetic to the plight of being one, and as an artist himself, Cameron should of course know this.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CPicard Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2013 at 19:14
Huh... Isn't it an old story? I thought this whole "I'm gonne sue you" dated back from 2012, no?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AEProgman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2013 at 21:18
My first remembrance of floating islands or I should say a City in the Clouds was from an old 1969 Star Trek episode called "The Cloud Miners".  Perhaps the writer of that episode should sue them all....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atavachron Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2013 at 21:35
^ Writers on ST and every other sci-fi medium took from all number of sources, usually from authors or pulp writers in the field (Heinlein,Verne,etc.).   Ellison probably took from as many writers as he has accused of poaching from him.  A Cloud City is probably as old as scripture, but it was Dean's vision of that myth that was used.   ST:TOS's 'The Cloud Minders' is nothing like Dean's work and much closer to George Lucas' Bespin in Star Wars Episode 5.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Luna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 29 2013 at 22:06
Originally posted by Atavachron Atavachron wrote:

Originally posted by The T The T wrote:

James Cameron's movies entertain me much more than Roger Dean's covers.

Maybe that's because Cameron's a thief.

not really k
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rogerthat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 30 2013 at 00:21
Some knee jerk reactions here.  It would be hasty to derive inferences about what Dean is suing for without accessing complete details of the lawsuit.  The question is not whether any and all floating islands are necessarily copied from Roger Dean (such a lawsuit would not even be admitted for hearing, imo) but whether the ones used in Avatar resemble RD's artwork.  There are some similarities in the colours and shapes used; a court of law will decide whether these similarities constitute a copyright infringement.  The paperwork apparently also mentions stone arches and markings and appendages on flying creatures.  We don't know what else it talks about and, therefore, what all Dean has alleged Cameron of borrowing from his artwork. 

By the way, .."Cameron's lawyer says the filmmaker doesn't need to steal Dean's concepts, since he's the "most original and creative person in the motion picture business today".  Yeah, because naming an island full of enormous natural resources Pandora is the most original idea ever to date.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thellama73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 30 2013 at 14:18
Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:


By the way, .."Cameron's lawyer says the filmmaker doesn't need to steal Dean's concepts, since he's the "most original and creative person in the motion picture business today".  Yeah, because naming an island full of enormous natural resources Pandora is the most original idea ever to date.


And let's not forget that brilliant name he thought up for his McGuffin: "Unobtainium."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dr wu23 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 30 2013 at 16:48
I can't help thinking this is about money or ego.  He's suing for 50 million....that's right 50 million.
Dean is 70 and probably well off financially.
To sue for that kind of money because someone  may or may not have been influenced by your old artwork seems over the top to me.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jorvik Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 01 2013 at 12:11
Just spotted news that Roger Dean is suing James Cameron & 20th Century Fox over the film Avatar:

Originally posted by The Register The Register wrote:

Dean's paintings of fantasy landscapes, which have included pictures of floating islands in the sky and fantastically huge trees, have featured on album covers from bands like Yes and Asia and been displayed in museums, private collections and books.

In his court filing, reproduced by Deadline: Hollywood, the UK artist claims that the floating mountains and stone arches of Pandora are copied from his works, and the Na'vi "Home Tree" and "Tree of Life" also feature in his paintings.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote silverpot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 01 2013 at 12:25
It was the first thing that came to my mind when I saw that movie. Surprised Dean hasn't reacted until now.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wanorak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 01 2013 at 12:32
A little late Roger! It probably would've been a more successful suit if it had been filed when Avatar was released.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Equality 7-2521 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 01 2013 at 14:31
You want to see how much money the movie makes before you sue. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tapfret Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 02 2013 at 04:00
Just have Squire kick Cameron out of the band.

There is no act more pretentious and self-indulgent than labeling another's art as pretentious and self-indulgent.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Surrealist Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 01 2013 at 00:12
My wife and I went to see Avatar like most people did.. and we were excited to see that Roger Dean had finally been put on the big screen.  When we watched the credits after the movie, we were both certain that Roger Dean would have been the art director or credited in many ways with the creative undertaking.  However, we were completely shocked that he was not even mentioned in the closing credits.

About 6 months later I spoke with Roger in San Francisco about this at his exhibit on Bush Street and he did seem a bit taken back by the film.  No mention of suing or anything at the time.. just more a roll of the eyes.

We were quite happy to hear that he has filed suit for 50 million against Cameron.  I think he should have asked for more... this is his movie.  Floating islands, the red dragons, just the way everything looked, I am sure Cameron told his artists to roll a few joints on classic Yes album covers like he did back in the 70's.

Looking at some of the message boards.. I was shocked to see how many people thought Roger is being completely out of line. 

Any thoughts?
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