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Happy 40th! "Tales From Topographic Oceans"!

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Chris S View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chris S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 20:04
Originally posted by Blart Blart wrote:

Thank you for this great discussion on TFTO!  I think I'll revisit it in coming days.  Haven't heard it in a decade or so, but all these glowing comments make me want to yank it out again.

BTW, I'm a newb here (obviously), though I was pretty active on a.m.p. back in the 90s.  Thanks for creating / maintaining this space!

Great to be discussing this fine work..Yep!  I still prefer my vinyl to the digital format so gonna spin the Maya Fish Space astral traveller  jewel shortly. See even though Wakeman was pissed off with this albums direction his contributions are priceless as is Alan White's foray into the Yes drum world. Lennon's loss was Yes's gain.

BTW what is a.m.p? All Music?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The.Crimson.King Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 23:14
Originally posted by Chris S Chris S wrote:

Great to be discussing this fine work..Yep!  I still prefer my vinyl to the digital format so gonna spin the Maya Fish Space astral traveller  jewel shortly. See even though Wakeman was pissed off with this albums direction his contributions are priceless as is Alan White's foray into the Yes drum world. Lennon's loss was Yes's gain.

I always thought that was quite a leap of faith on the part of Yes...replacing Bill Bruford with the drummer from the Plastic Ono Band Wacko
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2013 at 04:12
Originally posted by Chris S Chris S wrote:


BTW what is a.m.p? All Music?
The usenet newsgroup alt.music.progressive.
"You know what uranium is, right?
Itís this thing called nuclear weapons.
And other things.
Like lots of things are done with uranium.
Including some bad things.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The-Bullet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2013 at 11:24
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Originally posted by Chris S Chris S wrote:



BTW what is a.m.p? All Music?

The usenet newsgroup alt.music.progressive.


I was on the Alt.Music.Yes group for months before I realised why people had the sig. "leaving amy place"

"Why say it cannot be done.....they'd be better doing pop songs?"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dr wu23 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2013 at 13:07
Originally posted by The.Crimson.King The.Crimson.King wrote:

Originally posted by Chris S Chris S wrote:

Great to be discussing this fine work..Yep!  I still prefer my vinyl to the digital format so gonna spin the Maya Fish Space astral traveller  jewel shortly. See even though Wakeman was pissed off with this albums direction his contributions are priceless as is Alan White's foray into the Yes drum world. Lennon's loss was Yes's gain.

I always thought that was quite a leap of faith on the part of Yes...replacing Bill Bruford with the drummer from the Plastic Ono Band Wacko
 
According to Bruford, in his autobiography, he was the one who recommended White to Yes.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The.Crimson.King Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2013 at 14:08
Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Originally posted by The.Crimson.King The.Crimson.King wrote:

Originally posted by Chris S Chris S wrote:

Great to be discussing this fine work..Yep!  I still prefer my vinyl to the digital format so gonna spin the Maya Fish Space astral traveller  jewel shortly. See even though Wakeman was pissed off with this albums direction his contributions are priceless as is Alan White's foray into the Yes drum world. Lennon's loss was Yes's gain.

I always thought that was quite a leap of faith on the part of Yes...replacing Bill Bruford with the drummer from the Plastic Ono Band Wacko
 
According to Bruford, in his autobiography, he was the one who recommended White to Yes.

I had no idea...thanks for the info Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dr wu23 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2013 at 14:23
Originally posted by The.Crimson.King The.Crimson.King wrote:

Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Originally posted by The.Crimson.King The.Crimson.King wrote:

Originally posted by Chris S Chris S wrote:

Great to be discussing this fine work..Yep!  I still prefer my vinyl to the digital format so gonna spin the Maya Fish Space astral traveller  jewel shortly. See even though Wakeman was pissed off with this albums direction his contributions are priceless as is Alan White's foray into the Yes drum world. Lennon's loss was Yes's gain.

I always thought that was quite a leap of faith on the part of Yes...replacing Bill Bruford with the drummer from the Plastic Ono Band Wacko
 
According to Bruford, in his autobiography, he was the one who recommended White to Yes.

I had no idea...thanks for the info Wink
 
His book was an interesting read....talks about the music, other musicians, travelling and touring,  as well as the business side of things. In a nutshell he became disillusioned with rock and prog in general and wanted to just play jazz. until he retired.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The.Crimson.King Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2013 at 23:45
Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Originally posted by The.Crimson.King The.Crimson.King wrote:

Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Originally posted by The.Crimson.King The.Crimson.King wrote:

Originally posted by Chris S Chris S wrote:

Great to be discussing this fine work..Yep!  I still prefer my vinyl to the digital format so gonna spin the Maya Fish Space astral traveller  jewel shortly. See even though Wakeman was pissed off with this albums direction his contributions are priceless as is Alan White's foray into the Yes drum world. Lennon's loss was Yes's gain.

I always thought that was quite a leap of faith on the part of Yes...replacing Bill Bruford with the drummer from the Plastic Ono Band Wacko
 
According to Bruford, in his autobiography, he was the one who recommended White to Yes.

I had no idea...thanks for the info Wink
 
His book was an interesting read....talks about the music, other musicians, travelling and touring,  as well as the business side of things. In a nutshell he became disillusioned with rock and prog in general and wanted to just play jazz. until he retired.

Ya, I actually read it a few months ago but didn't recall the part about him recommending Alan White.  The main thing I remember about the book is I thought it was very sad.  Mr B is my fave drummer (I was even able to attend a Simmons electronic drum seminar he gave in 1988 at a local music store) and it was disheartening to read the latter part of the book.  So many great accomplishments and by the end of the book it seemed like he was so bitter and disillusioned.  I've honestly never read a musician biography before that made me feel so sad.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pekka Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 21 2013 at 00:59
Originally posted by The.Crimson.King The.Crimson.King wrote:

Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Originally posted by The.Crimson.King The.Crimson.King wrote:

Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

Originally posted by The.Crimson.King The.Crimson.King wrote:

Originally posted by Chris S Chris S wrote:

Great to be discussing this fine work..Yep!  I still prefer my vinyl to the digital format so gonna spin the Maya Fish Space astral traveller  jewel shortly. See even though Wakeman was pissed off with this albums direction his contributions are priceless as is Alan White's foray into the Yes drum world. Lennon's loss was Yes's gain.

I always thought that was quite a leap of faith on the part of Yes...replacing Bill Bruford with the drummer from the Plastic Ono Band Wacko
 
According to Bruford, in his autobiography, he was the one who recommended White to Yes.

I had no idea...thanks for the info Wink
 
His book was an interesting read....talks about the music, other musicians, travelling and touring,  as well as the business side of things. In a nutshell he became disillusioned with rock and prog in general and wanted to just play jazz. until he retired.

Ya, I actually read it a few months ago but didn't recall the part about him recommending Alan White.  The main thing I remember about the book is I thought it was very sad.  Mr B is my fave drummer (I was even able to attend a Simmons electronic drum seminar he gave in 1988 at a local music store) and it was disheartening to read the latter part of the book.  So many great accomplishments and by the end of the book it seemed like he was so bitter and disillusioned.  I've honestly never read a musician biography before that made me feel so sad.
I'm reading the book right now and nearing the end. It has been a very good read so far, definitely the best music book I've read in a long time. Made me think a little about my relationship with listening to and making music.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cstack3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 21 2013 at 08:55
Back to "Tales from Topographic Oceans" - which side is your favorite, and why? 

I go back & forth, and "The Revealing Science of God" always stirs me...however, I've also always loved side 2, "The Remembering!"  Squire plays fretless bass on this, and they really cook when they sing "Relayer....all the dying cried before you!" 

I used to not like "The Ancient" very much, but it grew on me after repeated listenings.  It is still my least favorite side.  

An amazing album!  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Epignosis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 21 2013 at 09:27
"The Revealing Science of God" is my favorite, and I waver between "The Remembering" and "Ritual" after that.  "The Ancient" is a lovely avant-garde shift amidst the symphonic splendor.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Epignosis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 21 2013 at 09:31
Another thing that many people might not have noticed is that Steve Howe plays riffs from Close to the Edge in "The Ancient."  During one of the cacophonies (ba-Dat, ba-Dat, ba--DA) he tosses in the main guitar theme from "Siberian Khatru" (the phrase he repeats right before his guitar solo at the end of the song).  And during the classical guitar part, he includes the very beginning of "Close to the Edge."

Howe also references the main theme of "The Revealing Science of God" at the end of "Ritual," but in a minor key.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Finnforest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 21 2013 at 10:21
I love all 4 sides almost equally.  Right now Ancient is my girlfriend, but I truly love them all.  Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 21 2013 at 11:50
Originally posted by dr wu23 dr wu23 wrote:

...
His book was an interesting read....talks about the music, other musicians, travelling and touring,  as well as the business side of things. In a nutshell he became disillusioned with rock and prog in general and wanted to just play jazz. until he retired.
 
I'm not even sure that "jazz" is what he wanted to play, because, just like rock music, jazz is also very restrictive, and I am willing to bet that Bill would prefer to not be tied down to one thing only. And the rock'n'roll like, is not for everyone ... playing the hits "every" night!
... none of the hits, none of the time ... now you know what the inner art is all about!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 21 2013 at 12:20
I think if Bill Brufford (or Mickey Mouse come to that) writes in his AUTObiography that he wanted to play Jazz then I too would assume he meant something entirely different.
 
 
 
 
 
 
...and still the hits keep coming.
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Like lots of things are done with uranium.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ronnie Pilgrim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 21 2013 at 14:47
Originally posted by Epignosis Epignosis wrote:

Another thing that many people might not have noticed is that Steve Howe plays riffs from Close to the Edge in "The Ancient."  During one of the cacophonies (ba-Dat, ba-Dat, ba--DA) he tosses in the main guitar theme from "Siberian Khatru" (the phrase he repeats right before his guitar solo at the end of the song).  And during the classical guitar part, he includes the very beginning of "Close to the Edge."

Howe also references the main theme of "The Revealing Science of God" at the end of "Ritual," but in a minor key.

I have always noticed those two revisited themes, and the one from the first track (or as I remember it, Side One)Wink


Edited by Ronnie Pilgrim - September 21 2013 at 14:48
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote elbownut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 21 2013 at 14:56
Originally posted by Moogtron III Moogtron III wrote:

^
I was going to say: enjoy, but their site http://www.therobin.co.uk/whats_on/ says the show has been cancelled
If this is true, I feel truly sorry for you Unhappy
yes I found out today. Not sure why exactly, but according to the band website it looks like their drummer is not well. Hopefully they will reschedule though
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The.Crimson.King Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 21 2013 at 22:43
Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:

Back to "Tales from Topographic Oceans" - which side is your favorite, and why? 

I go back & forth, and "The Revealing Science of God" always stirs me...however, I've also always loved side 2, "The Remembering!"  Squire plays fretless bass on this, and they really cook when they sing "Relayer....all the dying cried before you!" 

I used to not like "The Ancient" very much, but it grew on me after repeated listenings.  It is still my least favorite side.  

An amazing album!  

"The Revelaing Science" has always been my fave.  I love the opening chant and the "They move fast, they tell me" section is my favourite part on the entire album.  "The Ancient" comes next, Howe kills it in the opening wailing guitar solo then plays that beautiful classical guitar section to close it out.  "The Remembering" comes next with the "Relayer..." section a favourite and the great chord progression that ends it.  I've never liked "Ritual" especially the percussion ensemble part.  

Still, a brilliant album and saying what I don't like is kinda like criticizing the best dinner I ever had, "ya the Kobe steak and fresh Maine lobster were great, but I wish they would've put a slice of lemon in my ice water" LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kazza3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 22 2013 at 04:57
Thanks very much for linking the article, cstack, was very interesting! Love this album, even for its few flaws. It just has such a sense of wholeness and beauty. The Revealing is my favourite, as it is for many others, it's possibly the most well arranged Yes epic, the arrangement of themes & sections is sublime. The Remembering is fantastic, including the lengthy opening sections, I really enjoy it, and the keyboard breaks are one of the best keyboard moments in prog. The Ancient is my least favourite, it's very cool & percussive but kinda lacks that sense of cohesion. Ritual is pretty great as well, especially the end, but I don't like it as much as I used to.


Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Hi,

There was an article on The Oregonian almost a year ago, I think, that was upset that the Portland Symphony did not have enough attention and was not selling enough tickets. So I wrote a response to The Oregonian and the person who wrote that ... who gets free tickets to the Symphony, btw!!! ... and told him that the folks needed to get more modern and interesting ... and stop just doing shows with Pink Martini ... which appear to be the ones that get them the best money.
 
I even suggested, some Frank Zappa, Yes, Jethro Tull (TAAB or PP) ... and even Deep Purple's opus.
 
I never got a reply/suggestion, but the idea is pretty obvious ... they are not interested in the youngsters that don't care about yet another Bach recital this weekend to celebrate the death of his stepson ... PDQ! And no humor! That editorial was not well done and if I was an editor I would have gotten an opposing view by a rock reviewer, of which they have a lot of them ... that love that traditional jazz around here!
 
Even in Germany, they have done a day of Edgar Froese music with an orchestra ... it's coming ... but some of these folks are afraid of stepping aside from the stuff they know too much ... and learn from the stuff they don't know, which in the case of Portland is ... don't want to know because it's not music!


I don't know about the Portland Symphony, but the vast majority of orchestras these days certainly play plenty of non-classical concerts, from supporting popular artists (ie, like Gurrumul playing with the Sydney Symphony), or pops concerts, or the like. Players are certainly accustomed to playing that material- they're not afraid of it- but of course they like it less than playing the classical repertoire- to classical musicians, the kind of feeling that comes from playing those phenomenal works is incomparable, and though they usually enjoy playing the other stuff, it's never going to match most of the time.
As fantastic as a concert dedicated to Yes (or otherwise) arrangements would be, I also find it highly unlikely that such a concert would be sudden cash cow for them, as much as we prog fans might like to think, I'm not sure the support is quite there.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dr wu23 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 22 2013 at 11:05
Originally posted by cstack3 cstack3 wrote:

Back to "Tales from Topographic Oceans" - which side is your favorite, and why? 

I go back & forth, and "The Revealing Science of God" always stirs me...however, I've also always loved side 2, "The Remembering!"  Squire plays fretless bass on this, and they really cook when they sing "Relayer....all the dying cried before you!" 

I used to not like "The Ancient" very much, but it grew on me after repeated listenings.  It is still my least favorite side.  

An amazing album!  
Side 1 - Revealing Science is the only side I think that really works for me. I have always been somewhat disappointed in TFTO. I think it would have made a better single lp with the tracks cut down to 10 minutes each.
While I do like many of the sections within the other sides  imho there is quite a bit of  filler where they just seem to wander with nothing interesting happening at times in an avant garde manner .
I have always preferred more concrete song structures like on the Yes lp, Fragile, and Close. It seems like they create a decent 'melodic theme' on each side of TFTO but then they wander off into sections that just don't grab my attention and it just goes on too long for my tastes. As many have said Relayer was a return to a more 'classic'  sound and a better batch of songs....period.
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