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Late bloomers - Best success late in the career?

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Svetonio View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Svetonio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Late bloomers - Best success late in the career?
    Posted: September 19 2013 at 03:37
Big Big Train
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Post Options Post Options   Quote tamijo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 06:04
Originally posted by Moogtron III

Maybe Talk Talk is a good example too. They moved from commercial to more daring music, didn't they?
They did, but i think The Colour Of Spring is there best output, even though i agree the last two albums was more experimental, I think The Colour Of Spring is a great example of a commercial album of a very high quality.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote tamijo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 06:10
Originally posted by KingBarbarossa

Isn't that interesting? When I go through my collection almost every band has produced their strongest material in the beginning of their career. To find the opposite it actually takes some research effort.

So far I think Big Big Train seems to be among the suggestions that I find resonating as one of the most iconic examples.

I reckon this is not much different when we look beyond the boundaries of prog rock...
 
 
I dont agree, I belive I can come up with a lot of band having this curve :
2-3 albums not perfect but looking for the right thing
Some albums - find the "thing" the golden era
Later period gets weaker, hard to keep up the good work, and still not just copy what they did before.
 
So what you could say is rather, that most bands have the strongest period in the mid of their career, but some never top that first album.
 
 
And then there is those that have the ability to change a lot, making it hard to even decide when they did peak
(Crimson, Gabriel, Bowie, Zappa, and may be also Floyd)
 
 


Edited by tamijo - September 19 2013 at 06:15
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Moogtron III View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Moogtron III Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 06:14
Originally posted by tamijo

Originally posted by Moogtron III

Maybe Talk Talk is a good example too. They moved from commercial to more daring music, didn't they?
They did, but i think The Colour Of Spring is there best output, even though i agree the last two albums was more experimental, I think The Colour Of Spring is a great example of a commercial album of a very high quality.

Yes, you're right. Their best is not necessarily their most experimental album.
Maybe The Colour Of Spring was their best, yes.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guldbamsen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 07:17
Surprised to see that there's been no mentioning of Tangerine Dream. I'm very much a fan of the first era, but I've seen so many on this board refer to the 80s as the best TD output. Tangram, Exit, White Eagle, Hyperborea and the likes.

Also Miles Davis, at least for this site. I would imagine most folks here are into his fusion output over his bop period. Personally I believe he went from strength to strength up until the mid 70s. The same goes for Porcupine Tree, although I very much prefer the psychedelic years.

I've seen IQ mentioned as well in this thread. I feel quite the opposite. They haven't made anything as good as The Wake imo.

Oh almost forgot about Electric Orange. Their two albums Morbus and Krautrock from Hell are to me the pinnacle of their respective career, and by that time they'd been dishing out a good portion of albums. Seems like the curve has broken though. The two latest from them don't do as much for me. Netto and that Roman numeral album feel like they've hit the autopilot.


Edited by Guldbamsen - September 19 2013 at 07:18
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sagichim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 12:28
Originally posted by Guldbamsen

Also Miles Davis, at least for this site. I would imagine most folks here are into his fusion output over his bop period.

Actually I prefer his pure jazz style of the 50's.

For my taste Birth Control took a little time to really nail it.
Although I do like Manfred Mann's Earth Band early albums, I think they have released one of the strongest albums in progressive Rock - Solar Fire only after a few albums.

Hmmm...I thought I could think of some more...
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Post Options Post Options   Quote progbethyname Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 13:11
Well looking at the band VANDEN PLAS I see a major comeuppance in performance and refinement over the last 8 years, which actually yields only 2 albums during this time period, but it's there best!
Certainly, CHRIST O and SERAPHIC CLOCKWORK are by far, in my opinion, VANDEN PLAS's best and most advanced compositions to date. It is very clear to that VP are getting better with age and more refined at that.
I cannot wait till their next release, but I do not know when that may be. :(

Lots to love about the Prog Metal powerhouse band, 'Threshold.'
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Post Options Post Options   Quote progbethyname Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 13:19
Originally posted by Guldbamsen


Surprised to see that there's been no mentioning of Tangerine Dream. I'm very much a fan of the first era, but I've seen so many on this board refer to the 80s as the best TD output. Tangram, Exit, White Eagle, Hyperborea and the likes.
Also Miles Davis, at least for this site. I would imagine most folks here are into his fusion output over his bop period. Personally I believe he went from strength to strength up until the mid 70s. The same goes for Porcupine Tree, although I very much prefer the psychedelic years.
I've seen IQ mentioned as well in this thread. I feel quite the opposite. They haven't made anything as good as The Wake imo.
Oh almost forgot about Electric Orange. Their two albums Morbus and Krautrock from Hell are to me the pinnacle of their respective career, and by that time they'd been dishing out a good portion of albums. Seems like the curve has broken though. The two latest from them don't do as much for me. Netto and that Roman numeral album feel like they've hit the autopilot.



IQ have been incredible since 1993. I say this cause Nomzamo and Are You Sitting Comfortably are pretty Mediocre efforts, but missing a key fixture in the band (Peter Nichols) is a good reason why they kinda 'blew chunks' between 1987 to 1989. Although, i still feel wholeheartedly, that IQ are the very best Neo Prog Band of all time since 1993 and on.
The consistency of quality album output is ridiculously amazing. I've had many discussions here about IQ, and I don't think they would fit into this thread. Far too to good and for 20 years straight!
Lots to love about the Prog Metal powerhouse band, 'Threshold.'
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dr wu23 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 13:58
Originally posted by progbethyname

Originally posted by Guldbamsen


Surprised to see that there's been no mentioning of Tangerine Dream. I'm very much a fan of the first era, but I've seen so many on this board refer to the 80s as the best TD output. Tangram, Exit, White Eagle, Hyperborea and the likes.
Also Miles Davis, at least for this site. I would imagine most folks here are into his fusion output over his bop period. Personally I believe he went from strength to strength up until the mid 70s. The same goes for Porcupine Tree, although I very much prefer the psychedelic years.
I've seen IQ mentioned as well in this thread. I feel quite the opposite. They haven't made anything as good as The Wake imo.
Oh almost forgot about Electric Orange. Their two albums Morbus and Krautrock from Hell are to me the pinnacle of their respective career, and by that time they'd been dishing out a good portion of albums. Seems like the curve has broken though. The two latest from them don't do as much for me. Netto and that Roman numeral album feel like they've hit the autopilot.



IQ have been incredible since 1993. I say this cause Nomzamo and Are You Sitting Comfortably are pretty Mediocre efforts, but missing a key fixture in the band (Peter Nichols) is a good reason why they kinda 'blew chunks' between 1987 to 1989. Although, i still feel wholeheartedly, that IQ are the very best Neo Prog Band of all time since 1993 and on.
The consistency of quality album output is ridiculously amazing. I've had many discussions here about IQ, and I don't think they would fit into this thread. Far too to good and for 20 years straight!
 
I'm not sure they 'belong' in this thread either and I hinted at that in my post but imho their last 4 lp's are the best they have ever done and the last 2 the best . And I like the early ones quite a bit also so I'm not trying to say those aren't excellent. I simply like the 'newer' sound thay have developed the last 5-10 years.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote progbethyname Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 14:07
Originally posted by dr wu23

Originally posted by progbethyname

Originally posted by Guldbamsen

Surprised to see that there's been no mentioning of Tangerine Dream. I'm very much a fan of the first era, but I've seen so many on this board refer to the 80s as the best TD output. Tangram, Exit, White Eagle, Hyperborea and the likes.

Also Miles Davis, at least for this site. I would imagine most folks here are into his fusion output over his bop period. Personally I believe he went from strength to strength up until the mid 70s. The same goes for Porcupine Tree, although I very much prefer the psychedelic years.


I've seen IQ mentioned as well in this thread. I feel quite the opposite. They haven't made anything as good as The Wake imo.


Oh almost forgot about Electric Orange. Their two albums Morbus and Krautrock from Hell are to me the pinnacle of their respective career, and by that time they'd been dishing out a good portion of albums. Seems like the curve has broken though. The two latest from them don't do as much for me. Netto and that Roman numeral album feel like they've hit the autopilot.
IQ have been incredible since 1993. I say this cause Nomzamo and Are You Sitting Comfortably are pretty Mediocre efforts, but missing a key fixture in the band (Peter Nichols) is a good reason why they kinda 'blew chunks' between 1987 to 1989. Although, i still feel wholeheartedly, that IQ are the very best Neo Prog Band of all time since 1993 and on. The consistency of quality album output is ridiculously amazing. I've had many discussions here about IQ, and I don't think they would fit into this thread. Far too to good and for 20 years straight!

 

I'm not sure they 'belong' in this thread either and I hinted at that in my post but imho their last 4 lp's are the best they have ever done and the last 2 the best . And I like the early ones quite a bit also so I'm not trying to say those aren't excellent. I simply like the 'newer' sound thay have developed the last 5-10 years.

Oh yes. I totally understand and see your point very clearly and I must say your opinion is a lovely one at. IQ's last 2 efforts are incredible pieces of music, but for my Tastes THE WAKE and EVER I'd put ahead of those 2.
I still feel that THE WAKE was the best conceptual album of the 80's...well second best cause Queensryche's Mindcrime is #1....my goodness now their is a band that got worse as time went on...sadly. :(
Lots to love about the Prog Metal powerhouse band, 'Threshold.'
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Post Options Post Options   Quote elbownut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 14:23
Originally posted by ScorchedFirth

Big Big Train
 
This band and I would also add Anathema IMO
 
"Music was my first love and it will be my last" - John Miles "Music"
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Post Options Post Options   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 14:36
Just realised that I forgot the most obvious one:

Anathema

The last two albums have been brilliant. I have about 4 albums prior to those and they are nothing special to my ears.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 14:38
Originally posted by elbownut

Originally posted by ScorchedFirth

Big Big Train
 
This band and I would also add Anathema IMO
 

sorry I posted and then saw your postSmile
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Post Options Post Options   Quote dr wu23 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 19 2013 at 23:12
Originally posted by progbethyname

Originally posted by dr wu23

Originally posted by progbethyname

Originally posted by Guldbamsen

Surprised to see that there's been no mentioning of Tangerine Dream. I'm very much a fan of the first era, but I've seen so many on this board refer to the 80s as the best TD output. Tangram, Exit, White Eagle, Hyperborea and the likes.

Also Miles Davis, at least for this site. I would imagine most folks here are into his fusion output over his bop period. Personally I believe he went from strength to strength up until the mid 70s. The same goes for Porcupine Tree, although I very much prefer the psychedelic years.


I've seen IQ mentioned as well in this thread. I feel quite the opposite. They haven't made anything as good as The Wake imo.


Oh almost forgot about Electric Orange. Their two albums Morbus and Krautrock from Hell are to me the pinnacle of their respective career, and by that time they'd been dishing out a good portion of albums. Seems like the curve has broken though. The two latest from them don't do as much for me. Netto and that Roman numeral album feel like they've hit the autopilot.
IQ have been incredible since 1993. I say this cause Nomzamo and Are You Sitting Comfortably are pretty Mediocre efforts, but missing a key fixture in the band (Peter Nichols) is a good reason why they kinda 'blew chunks' between 1987 to 1989. Although, i still feel wholeheartedly, that IQ are the very best Neo Prog Band of all time since 1993 and on. The consistency of quality album output is ridiculously amazing. I've had many discussions here about IQ, and I don't think they would fit into this thread. Far too to good and for 20 years straight!

 

I'm not sure they 'belong' in this thread either and I hinted at that in my post but imho their last 4 lp's are the best they have ever done and the last 2 the best . And I like the early ones quite a bit also so I'm not trying to say those aren't excellent. I simply like the 'newer' sound thay have developed the last 5-10 years.

Oh yes. I totally understand and see your point very clearly and I must say your opinion is a lovely one at. IQ's last 2 efforts are incredible pieces of music, but for my Tastes THE WAKE and EVER I'd put ahead of those 2.
I still feel that THE WAKE was the best conceptual album of the 80's...well second best cause Queensryche's Mindcrime is #1....my goodness now their is a band that got worse as time went on...sadly. :(
Fair enough and I guess it's a matter of personal taste. I think IQ are even better on the last 2 even though Ever and The Wake are excellent.
It would be interesting to ask the band itself what they think is their best work.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote richardh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2013 at 02:35
Personally I would also throw Rush into the discussion. I have never been such a big fan of their seventies albums as others are. Seemed to be a metal band trying to be a prog band. Then the eighties saw them develop their own brand of heavy techno based rock. Would that make them late bloomers? Possibly not as its more personal taste I suppose but for me they were. I also like the mature rock style of their 90's albums and the excellent and underrated Vapor Trails.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote someone_else Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2013 at 03:38
Originally posted by Metalmarsh89


Originally posted by ScorchedFirth

Big Big Train

Yeah, that's the only one I can think of off the top of my head.Rush has obviously continued a great run of success, but most would argue their best work came early on. So they wouldn't really be late bloomers, just consistent.


Consistent? Not really. After "Signals" they made three albums which did not reach the level of their 1977-1982 output. Herafter the decline proceeded for some time: "Presto" was disappointing and "Roll the Bones" does not even reach the two star level in my book. But it is hard to be consistent for some 38 years and I think they came as close to such an achievement as one might expect.

Edited by someone_else - September 20 2013 at 03:41
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2013 at 04:04
Rush - Just got better and better in the 80-90's and even up to mid 00's
Talk Talk - Colour Of Spring is incredible and the next two minimalist releases ( Try see the Montraux gig on YT)
TD IMO peaked with Tangram in 1980
Just cannot see the Big Big Train thang, personal taste I guess
Porcupine Tree anyone- Deadwing, In Absentia and FOABP
I agree about Vangelis in the 90's - El Greco and Voices were incredible but China, Direct, Heaven & Hell, La Fete etc in the 70's....
Oldfield's - Songs From Distant Earth from 94//? Not sure of date
Caravan - Battle of Hastings from the 90's - very underrated ( cringe) album
and as mentioned earllier Pineapple Thief - Someone Here Is Missing 00's- excellent stuff from Bruce S.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2013 at 04:06
Originally posted by someone_else

Originally posted by Metalmarsh89


Originally posted by ScorchedFirth

Big Big Train

Yeah, that's the only one I can think of off the top of my head.Rush has obviously continued a great run of success, but most would argue their best work came early on. So they wouldn't really be late bloomers, just consistent.


Consistent? Not really. After "Signals" they made three albums which did not reach the level of their 1977-1982 output. Herafter the decline proceeded for some time: "Presto" was disappointing and "Roll the Bones" does not even reach the two star level in my book. But it is hard to be consistent for some 38 years and I think they came as close to such an achievement as one might expect.
I thought Roll The Bones was a strong album, as was Counterparts, Vapor Trails and last but not least Power Windows. Again it is all subjectiveSmile
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Post Options Post Options   Quote someone_else Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2013 at 04:19
Originally posted by Chris S


Originally posted by someone_else

Originally posted by Metalmarsh89


Originally posted by ScorchedFirth

Big Big Train

Yeah, that's the only one I can think of off the top of my head.Rush has obviously continued a great run of success, but most would argue their best work came early on. So they wouldn't really be late bloomers, just consistent.


Consistent? Not really. After "Signals" they made three albums which did not reach the level of their 1977-1982 output. Herafter the decline proceeded for some time: "Presto" was disappointing and "Roll the Bones" does not even reach the two star level in my book. But it is hard to be consistent for some 38 years and I think they came as close to such an achievement as one might expect.

I thought Roll The Bones was a strong album, as was Counterparts, Vapor Trails and last but not least Power Windows. Again it is all subjectiveSmile


It surely is. And I see that the two albums I find disappointing are both rated between 3.0 and 3.2, so most listeners have another opinion here.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guldbamsen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September 20 2013 at 06:40
Originally posted by progbethyname

Originally posted by Guldbamsen


Surprised to see that there's been no mentioning of Tangerine Dream. I'm very much a fan of the first era, but I've seen so many on this board refer to the 80s as the best TD output. Tangram, Exit, White Eagle, Hyperborea and the likes.
Also Miles Davis, at least for this site. I would imagine most folks here are into his fusion output over his bop period. Personally I believe he went from strength to strength up until the mid 70s. The same goes for Porcupine Tree, although I very much prefer the psychedelic years.
I've seen IQ mentioned as well in this thread. I feel quite the opposite. They haven't made anything as good as The Wake imo.
Oh almost forgot about Electric Orange. Their two albums Morbus and Krautrock from Hell are to me the pinnacle of their respective career, and by that time they'd been dishing out a good portion of albums. Seems like the curve has broken though. The two latest from them don't do as much for me. Netto and that Roman numeral album feel like they've hit the autopilot.



IQ have been incredible since 1993. I say this cause Nomzamo and Are You Sitting Comfortably are pretty Mediocre efforts, but missing a key fixture in the band (Peter Nichols) is a good reason why they kinda 'blew chunks' between 1987 to 1989. Although, i still feel wholeheartedly, that IQ are the very best Neo Prog Band of all time since 1993 and on.
The consistency of quality album output is ridiculously amazing. I've had many discussions here about IQ, and I don't think they would fit into this thread. Far too to good and for 20 years straight!

I haven't yet heard the two Nichols free albums. Maybe that's not such a bad thing after all...
I do have Frequency which in my humble opinion is the best album they've released ever (pun intended) since The WakeSmile 
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