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Topic ClosedProg albums recorded in the sixties
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Prog_Traveller View Drop Down
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Points: 1474 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 20:44
[Sigh......here we go again with the first prog album debate, something which, in truth, has been worn to death, surely?]

Nope. That wasn't my intent when I started this thread. What others discuss on here is up to them though but I didn't say to myself "ooh let me start another thread where we can all argue about what the first prog album is." Hey, why don't we instead argue about what the newest prog album is? What prog album was released yesterday? Or today for that matter? Big smile

No, I just wanted to find out what others thought were other contenders for the first prog album besides ITCOTCK or other obvious choices. A lot of people still seem to think "court" was the first but I think a lot of that is because it was pretty well known and did admittedly kick the genre into high gear but that doesn't mean it was the very first. For me at least it's not about arguing but just throwing album titles out there(which was done mostly on the first page).


Edited by Prog_Traveller - November 15 2013 at 21:23
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Points: 2755 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 18:02
Originally posted by maani maani wrote:

I am surprised that no on has mentioned the first Vanilla Fudge album (1967), which definitely applied some progressive elements (consciously or otherwise).

Yep.  If Vanilla Fudge had done original material instead of cover after cover, this would be a contender. 
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Points: 13240 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 16:24
Originally posted by Padraic Padraic wrote:

Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

 a bloody good wine drinking sessionEvil Smile

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There is actually a sad story behind this tonight.

On a Friday evening, I normally travel into Carmarthen (the local town) by bus to meet two friends, where we sit down, have a few pints and a couple of shorts, and generally make the world a better place by sorting it out. Friday is my treat, if you will, after a hard week's work.

However, this morning, there was an awful crash on the local main road. Two people were killed, and my wife and mother in law missed it by a matter of two minutes. Thank God! The road was closed for hours, so no bus into town.

So, this evening, I am sitting down in the sitting room. The family is watching Children In Need (the UK telethon). And I am listening to Rush Live, drinking far too much wine for my own good.

My intentions above, BTW, were not to resurrect the additions debate, but rather to point out the pointlessness of the first prog album debate.

Of course, neither will ever be settled Wink

EDIT. My comment "thank God" probably reads very poorly and disrespectfully. It was not meant to be. A loss of life like that is awful. I am, though, relieved that Glynis and her mother were not caught up in it.


Edited by lazland - November 15 2013 at 16:30
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Points: 31165 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 15:53
Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

 a bloody good wine drinking sessionEvil Smile

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Points: 13240 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 15:43
Originally posted by Padraic Padraic wrote:

Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

Sigh......here we go again with the first prog album debate, something which, in truth, has been worn to death, surely?Ouch

According to this grand site, it was, of course, a Miles Davis album from 1940-odd. Nonsense, but it is here.


Speaking of worn to death, we've been over the reason for this about a million times.

But not as many times as the first prog album.......I have a long way to go with this one yet, especially when I am in the middle of a bloody good wine drinking sessionEvil Smile
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Points: 31165 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 15:21
Originally posted by lazland lazland wrote:

Sigh......here we go again with the first prog album debate, something which, in truth, has been worn to death, surely?Ouch

According to this grand site, it was, of course, a Miles Davis album from 1940-odd. Nonsense, but it is here.


Speaking of worn to death, we've been over the reason for this about a million times.
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Points: 13240 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 15:10
Sigh......here we go again with the first prog album debate, something which, in truth, has been worn to death, surely?Ouch

According to this grand site, it was, of course, a Miles Davis album from 1940-odd. Nonsense, but it is here.

However, seriously, when will people come to the realisation that there was no definitive first prog album? Progressive rock evolved from a whole host of influences and artists messing about.

If you have a difficulty with that, compare it to evolution in the animal kingdom. Can anyone state when the first cognitive human lived, where, and what he first said? No. He/she was the result of evolution, which developed over a number of years and different human geno types.

I know it is not the best analogy, but it is the only one I can think of this evening.

The point I am making is that you can point to a number of 1960's albums and say......that sounds like prog! The artists themselves never described it as such, because the phrase was not invented as a specific rock genre until the early 1970's. What the artists did was experiment and evolve. The end product of that was progressive rock.

It will never be possible to define the first prog rock album. Why do we keep on (and on...and on....and on...) trying to do so?
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Points: 2632 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 14:37
I am surprised that no on has mentioned the first Vanilla Fudge album (1967), which definitely applied some progressive elements (consciously or otherwise).
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Points: 4591 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 13:35
Originally posted by Padraic Padraic wrote:

Originally posted by Prog_Traveller Prog_Traveller wrote:

Originally posted by Padraic Padraic wrote:

Originally posted by verslibre verslibre wrote:

^^^Now THAT is the Masterlist! Wow...The Zombies are the first album listed? Anyone familiar with the album? I only know "She's Not There" because Santana covered it.

Somewhat...saying The Zombies are progressive rock is beyond a stretch, though.  Really cool band, but c'mon.


Have you ever actually heard "Odessey and Oracle?" It's a very, very good album and I'd say it fits into the proto prog category. No really long songs but very good arrangements and a bit of tron. Wink

I've not heard it, but the previous post was talking about their mid 60s "She's Not There" period (which was listed as the name of their album, which isn't true).  By 1968 we already had a number of "proto-prog" candidates.

Also according to wiki they used a tron because they couldn't afford session musicians.  LOL

Speaking of our beloved mellotron, after seeing the wiki prog list I began wondering when the 1st recorded use of the mellotron occurred.  I always thought it was the flute intro to Strawberry Fields but according to wiki:

British multi-instrumentalist Graham Bond is considered the first rock musician to record with a Mellotron, beginning in 1965. The first hit song to feature a Mellotron MKII was "Baby Can It Be True", and Bond performed live with the machine in televised performances, using solenoids to trigger the tapes from his Hammond organ.[31]
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Points: 31165 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 13:25
Originally posted by Prog_Traveller Prog_Traveller wrote:

Originally posted by Padraic Padraic wrote:

Originally posted by verslibre verslibre wrote:

^^^Now THAT is the Masterlist! Wow...The Zombies are the first album listed? Anyone familiar with the album? I only know "She's Not There" because Santana covered it.

Somewhat...saying The Zombies are progressive rock is beyond a stretch, though.  Really cool band, but c'mon.


Have you ever actually heard "Odessey and Oracle?" It's a very, very good album and I'd say it fits into the proto prog category. No really long songs but very good arrangements and a bit of tron. Wink

I've not heard it, but the previous post was talking about their mid 60s "She's Not There" period (which was listed as the name of their album, which isn't true).  By 1968 we already had a number of "proto-prog" candidates.

Also according to wiki they used a tron because they couldn't afford session musicians.  LOL


Edited by Padraic - November 15 2013 at 13:26
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Points: 32583 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 13:19
Sorry getting off topic, but the electric keyboard in Sun Ra's1956 album Supersonic Jazz gives it a very early JRF feel to me:
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Points: 26133 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 13:00
Odyssey and Oracle is another story. "She's Not There" is waaay before that.
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Points: 1474 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:56
Originally posted by Padraic Padraic wrote:

Originally posted by verslibre verslibre wrote:

^^^Now THAT is the Masterlist! Wow...The Zombies are the first album listed? Anyone familiar with the album? I only know "She's Not There" because Santana covered it.

Somewhat...saying The Zombies are progressive rock is beyond a stretch, though.  Really cool band, but c'mon.


Have you ever actually heard "Odessey and Oracle?" It's a very, very good album and I'd say it fits into the proto prog category. No really long songs but very good arrangements and a bit of tron. Wink
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Points: 26133 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:55
Originally posted by Padraic Padraic wrote:

Originally posted by verslibre verslibre wrote:

^^^Now THAT is the Masterlist! Wow...The Zombies are the first album listed? Anyone familiar with the album? I only know "She's Not There" because Santana covered it.

Somewhat...saying The Zombies are progressive rock is beyond a stretch, though.  Really cool band, but c'mon.
But they were using an organ... in 1964!  JS Bach wasn't even using an organ in 1964.
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Points: 350 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:44
Frank Zappa's albums Weasels Ripped My Flesh (recorded in several sessions during late '60's) en Burnt Weeny Sandwich (recorded around the time of the Hot Rats sessions) should be mentioned too.
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Points: 31165 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:38
Originally posted by verslibre verslibre wrote:

^^^Now THAT is the Masterlist! Wow...The Zombies are the first album listed? Anyone familiar with the album? I only know "She's Not There" because Santana covered it.

Somewhat...saying The Zombies are progressive rock is beyond a stretch, though.  Really cool band, but c'mon.
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Points: 32583 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:35
Probably because it has organ, but why didn't this make it?

  Guess she doesn't really  rock. 

^^ Yes, instead of writing the Advancement's self-titled, I should have said sole album to be clearer.  It's pretty obscure -- I discovered the LP selling at a neat collector's site some years ago, and then recommended it for PA inclusion. I actually think that there is a ton of fairly underground/ obscure music that could fit the Prog mold -- and didn't really influence the big names (part of it depends upon whether one considers Prog to be a movement, a genre, or more of  an approach to making music).  Popular enough to have 60 ratings at rateyourmusic, though. Some of the album, especially the longest track I think of as full blown prog; whereas other stuff is more groovy psychadelia (quite an eclectic mix which is what makes it as partiaulr proggy to my ears).  Family's album  is a good call, by the way, meant to mention that one myself.
1969 The Advancement 3 issues 11 6


Edited by Logan - November 15 2013 at 12:40
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Points: 26133 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:24
I'm pleased to see  Eric Burdon/Animals' "The Twain Shall Meet" on that Wikipedia timeline.  Quite a progressive album for its time, that doesn't get a lot of attention.  Though it does walk the tightrope between "progress" and "acid-inspired experimental overkill", but that's the price you pay for progress I guess.

I don't know how the heck the Zombies' "She's Not There" single made that list.  Because it has organ?
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Points: 1474 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:14
The Advancments? Do you mean The Advancement who were a US band who released one album in 1968? It's pretty obscure apparently.

Anyway, a lot of the above albums you mentioned could be considered psychedelic(maybe not all though). However, here's how I look at it. First off I don't really buy into the term "proto prog" too much although it is worth mentioning and it does have it's purpose and can even be helpful at times. However, something is either progressive or it isn't. If people want to say the first proggy prog rock album was King Crimson's debut fine they can think what they want. However, the rock based music of the sixties that was not deliberately trippy or psychedelic and had structure and diverse instrumentation was progressive no matter how you want to look at it. One album that hasn't been mentioned yet(although it is on that wikipedia list) is Family's "music in a doll's house." There's mellotron, saxophones and violins on there. Sorry but I can't think of too many psychedelic bands with saxophones. Smile It might not have been prog in the same way as YES and Genesis and maybe it was proto compared to what came later but it was still progressive and progressive plus rock equals progressive rock in my book. Obviously it wasn't the only album to be progressive back then though.


Edited by Prog_Traveller - November 15 2013 at 12:27
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Points: 14979 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 15 2013 at 12:05
^^^Now THAT is the Masterlist! Wow...The Zombies are the first album listed? Anyone familiar with the album? I only know "She's Not There" because Santana covered it.
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