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The Dark Elf View Drop Down
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Points: 12656 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 10 2014 at 21:34
Originally posted by mariner14 mariner14 wrote:

Really...go through history...and the most important scientific breakthroughs have been male scientists....apart from Marie Curie......whom?

Here's a fact that will blow perception out of the water....more women abuse children than men......and I don't mean sexual.


Go through history and you will find women subjugated, degraded and blamed for Original Sin -- a huge swathe of history that predates the written word and includes most of the 20th century. Your "science" claim utterly lacks historical context. In fact, in typing it, you have made the world dumber.

As far as your "fact" about women and child abuse, please supply it. This is the second time I've asked you to supply evidence for your fabrications. Either back up what you say, or quit the discussion. It is quite clear you are a misogynist in any case. That requires no further proofs.
...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined
to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology...
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Kati View Drop Down
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Points: 6253 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 01:20
Originally posted by mariner14 mariner14 wrote:

To Kati...surely cheaper car insurance for women is sexist regardless? However in a modern grown up community that is the EU. They have made it illegal to give cheaper insurance to women........because it was SEXIST.


Mariner14, I was honestly not having a go at you at first.
Building a demographic profile to benefit your target prospect/audience is not racist, it’s called common business practice. I am not here to give you sermons nor am I interested to go into further detail or give you a sales course, we differ so much in opinion, this I will accept and understand that we all differ, I do not want to go further in discussion with you. I am happy that some here highlighted the facts and also have the point of view as me, however I will not be the mean girl to highlight that and quote all what was said here contrary to what you said nor dwell any further into this, some agree others disagree and those who spoke here with similar believes as me, thank you, this was so much appreciated! Being open minded certainly seems to play no role here between you and me, anyway it has become irrelevant.
P.S. Insurane Companies base their quotes on KAP studies (Knowledge, Attitude, practice) where demographic profiles too play a major role and this includes age and gender.

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Dean View Drop Down
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 03:02
Originally posted by mariner14 mariner14 wrote:

Really...go through history...and the most important scientific breakthroughs have been male scientists....apart from Marie Curie......whom? 

Here's a fact that will blow perception out of the water....more women abuse children than men......and I don't mean sexual.
You're not very bright are you... 

If you buy more raffle tickets you have more chance of winning. If (through history) more men have pursued scientific discovery then more men will have made scientific discoveries. As more women are permitted and encouraged pursue scientific discovery we will see more breakthroughs being made by women scientists. If you want names (really... go through history...) try Rosalind Franklin, Ada Lovelace, Joy Adamson, Jane Goodall, Dian Fossey, Mary Leakey, Mary Anning, Mary Somerville, Caroline Herschel. If you want a non-scientist then consider actress Hedy Lamarr (inventor of Frequency-hopping Spread-spectrum radio communication).

If you have 4 times more cherries than strawberries then if 10% of each are bad then you will have more bad cherries than strawberries. If more women than men are the primary carers of children and if women spend more time with their children than men then if an equal percentage of each are bad then you will have more abusing women than men.

The actual statistics of primary carers is 80% women compared to 20% men (NSPCC 2010), so when you look at the resulting physical abuse statistics: "mothers were more likely than fathers to be responsible for physical abuse (49% of incidents compared to 40%). However, part of the difference may be explained by the greater time children spend with their mothers than fathers. " [May-Chahal and Cawson 2005], then it is evident that the percentages of each who are bad is not equal and statistically men are worse.

The other thing to consider is what constitutes physical abuse - all forms of physical punishment, physical admonishment and physical restraint are now counted as physical abuse in these studies and no distinction is made regarding the degree of abuse - a slap or smack counts the same as a severe beating.
What?
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Kati View Drop Down
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Points: 6253 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 03:18
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

Originally posted by mariner14 mariner14 wrote:

Really...go through history...and the most important scientific breakthroughs have been male scientists....apart from Marie Curie......whom? Here's a fact that will blow perception out of the water....more women abuse children than men......and I don't mean sexual.
You're not very bright are you... 
If you buy more raffle tickets you have more chance of winning. If (through history) more men have pursued scientific discovery then more men will have made scientific discoveries. As more women are permitted and encouraged pursue scientific discovery we will see more breakthroughs being made by women scientists. If you want names (really... go through history...) try Rosalind Franklin, Ada Lovelace, Joy Adamson, <span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;">Jane Goodall,</span><span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;"> Dian Fossey, </span><span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;">Mary Leakey, Mary Anning, Mary Somerville, Caroline Herschel. If you want a non-scientist then consider actress Hedy Lamarr (inventor of Frequency-hopping Spread-spectrum radio communication).</span>
If you have 4 times more cherries than strawberries then if 10% of each are bad then you will have more bad cherries than strawberries. If more women than men are the primary carers of children and if women spend more time with their children than men then if an equal percentage of each are bad then you will have more abusing women than men.
The actual statistics of primary carers is 80% women compared to 20% men (NSPCC 2010), so when you look at the resulting physical abuse statistics: <span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;">"</span><span style="color: rgb68, 68, 68; font-family: helvetica, arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 18.719999313354492px;">mothers were more likely than fathers to be responsible for physical abuse (49% of incidents compared to 40%). </span><span style="color: rgb68, 68, 68; font-family: helvetica, arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 18.719999313354492px;">However, part of the difference may be explained by the greater time children spend with their mothers than fathers.</span><span style="color: rgb68, 68, 68; font-family: helvetica, arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; line-height: 18.719999313354492px;"> </span><span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;">" [</span><span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;">May-Chahal and Cawson 2005], then it is evident that the percentages of each who are bad is not equal and</span><span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;"> </span><span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;">statistically</span><span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;"> men are worse.</span>
<span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;"></span>
<span style="font-size: 12px; line-height: 1.2;">The other thing to consider is what constitutes physical abuse - all forms of physical punishment, physical admonishment and physical restraint are now counted as physical abuse in these studies and no distinction is made regarding the degree of abuse - a slap or smack counts the same as a severe beating.</span>



I must add Marie Curie to Dean's list above, Curie was a Polish/French physicist and chemist who was a pioneer in research on radioactivity. She was the first woman to win a Nobel Prize, the only woman to win in two fields, and the only person to win in multiple sciences.
There have been women to abuse their own children but this is very rare, some children even ended in deaths, this is a reality and makes me sick, most of them that I know where diagnosed with Münchausen syndrome or to be more specific Munchausen by proxy syndrome (MBPS), either way no excuse for that and a waste of taxpayers money to keep them breathing (I am against death penalty but in over proven cases I see no reason why others should pay for their up keep to be honest)Also women can be very deadly and nasty, women scorned can be more evil than men too, however this seems to be a minority a minority that is most evil at times more so than men even.
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ExittheLemming View Drop Down
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Points: 11415 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 04:13
^ I'm not defending mariner14 here but he did at least include Marie Curie in his post
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Kati View Drop Down
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Points: 6253 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 04:34
Originally posted by ExittheLemming ExittheLemming wrote:

^ I'm not defending mariner14 here but he did at least include Marie Curie in his post


This is true ExittheLeming, however I am not sure he understood why besides knowing she played a role in modern science,I quote his words here:   
Originally posted by mariner14 mariner14 wrote:

Really...go through history...and the most important scientific breakthroughs have been male scientists....apart from Marie Curie......whom?

Here's a fact that will blow perception out of the water....more women abuse children than men......and I don't mean sexual.


He left many grey areas above as in here what he said and I quote "apart from Marie Curie......whom?" ???? Really was that his best input? To be honest I have had enough of mentioning his name, unless something constructed comes out of him, I must say this "HIS IGNORANCE" nothing up to now convincing me I should not spend anymore time in regards to him really! No idea why I am even discussing this or defending myself here!???? This is silly!

Edited by Kati - July 11 2014 at 04:36
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Kati View Drop Down
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Points: 6253 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 05:33
Originally posted by ExittheLemming ExittheLemming wrote:

Hugs from an old balding cranky Scottish rodentHug



ExittheLemming (that last name I bet you love bass yay!!), you my new fav Braveheart Scott, this is for you, they are great fun and incredible good too, all bagpipes except for drums    hugs have a listen here is the band name and link: Red Hot Chilli Pipers Smoke On The Water and Thunderstruck https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YdkolAEHj4
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Kati View Drop Down
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Points: 6253 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 05:36
Originally posted by Kati Kati wrote:

Originally posted by ExittheLemming ExittheLemming wrote:

Hugs from an old balding cranky Scottish rodentHug



ExittheLemming (that last name I bet you love bass yay!!), you my new fav Braveheart Scott, this is for you, they are great fun and incredible good too, all bagpipes except for drums    hugs have a listen here is the band name and link: Red Hot Chilli Pipers Smoke On The Water and Thunderstruck https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YdkolAEHj4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YdkolAEHj4
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Gerinski View Drop Down
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Points: 5091 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 06:13
Astronomy has also had some remarkable female scientists, Henrietta Swan Leavitt discovered the relationship between the luminosity and the period of cepheid stars which became the main method for estimating cosmic distances and allowed Hubble to confirm the expansion of the universe. Vera Rubin discovered the galaxy rotation anomaly which pointed to the existence of dark matter (incidentally she was the first woman allowed to use the Mount Palomar telescope in 1965, which is an example of how difficult it was for women to pursue scientific endeavour until recent times). And Carolyn Shoemaker holds the record of most comets discovered.
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Dean View Drop Down
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Points: 37575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 06:42
Originally posted by Gerinski Gerinski wrote:

Astronomy has also had some remarkable female scientists, Henrietta Swan Leavitt discovered the relationship between the luminosity and the period of cepheid stars which became the main method for estimating cosmic distances and allowed Hubble to confirm the expansion of the universe. Vera Rubin discovered the galaxy rotation anomaly which pointed to the existence of dark matter (incidentally she was the first woman allowed to use the Mount Palomar telescope in 1965, which is an example of how difficult it was for women to pursue scientific endeavour until recent times). And Carolyn Shoemaker holds the record of most comets discovered.
Some on my list were astronomers too, and that shoots the multi-tasking vs. task-orientation argument clean out of the water.
What?
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ExittheLemming View Drop Down
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Points: 11415 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 06:44
Originally posted by Kati Kati wrote:

Originally posted by Kati Kati wrote:

Originally posted by ExittheLemming ExittheLemming wrote:

Hugs from an old balding cranky Scottish rodentHug



ExittheLemming (that last name I bet you love bass yay!!), you my new fav Braveheart Scott, this is for you, they are great fun and incredible good too, all bagpipes except for drums    hugs have a listen here is the band name and link: Red Hot Chilli Pipers Smoke On The Water and Thunderstruck https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YdkolAEHj4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YdkolAEHj4


Oh Lordy those guys are good (I mean both the pipers and the rock musicians) Enjoyed that hugely so thanks Kati

To Gerinski: Yes you're right, so much social conditioning must be culpable for creating the sorts of patriarchal disciplines to which perfectly capable females feel alienated. Astronomers are the only people who get paid to stare into space. (That's a joke, don't go flaming on my ass y'all)
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Kati View Drop Down
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Points: 6253 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 06:46
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:


Originally posted by Gerinski Gerinski wrote:

Astronomy has also had some remarkable female scientists, Henrietta Swan Leavitt discovered the relationship between the luminosity and the period of cepheid stars which became the main method for estimating cosmic distances and allowed Hubble to confirm the expansion of the universe. Vera Rubin discovered the galaxy rotation anomaly which pointed to the existence of dark matter (incidentally she was the first woman allowed to use the Mount Palomar telescope in 1965, which is an example of how difficult it was for women to pursue scientific endeavour until recent times). And Carolyn Shoemaker holds the record of most comets discovered.

Some on my list were astronomers too, and that shoots the multi-tasking vs. task-orientation argument clean out of the water.


You two know more than me, well of course you do but in terms of this topic and the above yay kudos!
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Gerinski View Drop Down
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Points: 5091 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 06:49
Originally posted by ExittheLemming ExittheLemming wrote:

 
It could be, and I only say could, that historically males have been more dedicated to fighting tasks than females, and that could have resulted in natural selection favouring males with a certain tolerance to violent behaviour, something which was not so much a selection factor in females. And again I just say it could be, and if that happened to be the case we need not make a drama of it.

Anti-sexism needs to be about ensuring that women have the same rights, opportunities and are treated with equal fairness as men, not about denying that men and women are not identical in every respect.

The use of statistics by insurance companies resulting in different treatment for males and females is a typical example of the controversy which can arise from the seemingly simple principle of "equal rights, opportunities and fairness of treatment". One can argue that in this case the gender is no different that any other group trait, such as saying for example that the premium is also more expensive for drivers under 25 years old, so it does not imply sexism, but others may see it as an unfair discriminatory treatment because of gender.

In the near future the availability of detailed genetic information of each individual will complement statistics and more controversy will come because the science of genetics will continue evolving and more and more traits will be proven to have some genetic component, at least statistically if not deterministically.
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ExittheLemming View Drop Down
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Points: 11415 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 07:25
^ I'm clearly inscrutableWink
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Kati View Drop Down
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Points: 6253 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 07:30
Originally posted by ExittheLemming ExittheLemming wrote:

^ I'm clearly inscrutableWink



I differ to agree with you, I can understand why you would say that but you don't fool me :) plus men in kilts are hot!
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ExittheLemming View Drop Down
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Points: 11415 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 11 2014 at 07:32
^ I have never worn a kilt (but am ordering one now on-line with indecent haste)Embarrassed
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