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Unitron View Drop Down
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Points: 56 		Direct Link To This Post Topic: Does Iron Maiden really belong in only 'related'?
    Posted: May 16 2014 at 10:26
I honestly think Iron Maiden belongs more in Prog Metal then just Related.

What do all of you think?
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Rick Robson View Drop Down
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Points: 1607 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 10:49
^Always loved that Genghis Khan atmosphere in the superb album 'Piece Of Mind, anyways I don't think so.


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Points: 178 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 10:53



I think they're labeled that way because they aren't really "Prog".  
Mostly just Metal.  

Calling them "Prog Metal" would kinda be false advertising.  Geek  

Granted, they do have a handful of tunes that fit the description. 
The second half of the song "Seventh Son of a Seventh Son" (1988) 
certainly introduced listeners to the direction that Dream Theater expanded on. 
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Points: 16130 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 11:10
^^ I agree.
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Points: 3167 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 12:01
Considering 95% of their stuff doesn't come off as prog to me at all, I would say no.

And sure Iron Maiden might have introduced many listeners to the direction that Dream Theater expanded on, but I feel like Watchtower had more of an influence than Iron Maiden on that sound.
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Points: 26133 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 12:03
Let metal be metal, that's what I say.  Why should prog steal away all the good ones?
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Points: 11415 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 12:07
Originally posted by HolyMoly HolyMoly wrote:

Let metal be metal, that's what I say.  Why should prog steal away all the good ones?


Perceptive but slyly disingenuous post certainly i.e. can we somehow assimilate all good metal into PA under the guise of progginess aforethought?
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Points: 31165 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 12:09
Originally posted by Rick Robson Rick Robson wrote:

^Always loved that Genghis Khan atmosphere in the superb album 'Piece Of Mind, anyways I don't think so.


What's a Genghis Khan atmosphere?  Confused

On second thought, I probably don't want to know. 
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Points: 1607 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 12:28
^I suggest you check out two songs of that album (one for sure is To Tame a Land) - listen to that guitar solo melody and read the lyrics (oh yes! in this case I didn't hesitate to read almost the whole album).
 
People who enjoy Piece Of Mind know what I'm talking about.


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Points: 26133 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 12:36
Originally posted by ExittheLemming ExittheLemming wrote:

Originally posted by HolyMoly HolyMoly wrote:

Let metal be metal, that's what I say.  Why should prog steal away all the good ones?


Perceptive but slyly disingenuous post certainly i.e. can we somehow assimilate all good metal into PA under the guise of progginess aforethought?
The sly part was intentional.  The disingenuous part was probably sarcasm.  My point was it's okay for a band to be really good, technically accomplished, and still just be "metal".  Give Metal itself some credit for its own traditions of virtuosity and ambition. 
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Points: 31165 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 12:39
Originally posted by Rick Robson Rick Robson wrote:

^I suggest you check out two songs of that album (one for sure is To Tame a Land) - listen to that guitar solo melody and read the lyrics (oh yes! in this case I didn't hesitate to read almost the whole album).
 
People who enjoy Piece Of Mind know what I'm talking about.


I know the album well.  To Tame a Land is based off of Dune, so I'm not sure what Genghis Khan has to do with it.
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Points: 28057 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 12:47
They're certainly about as far as a heavy metal band can go before they become prog. I'd probably say Queensryche isn't really very prog metal either. In fact Maiden doesn't shy away from it these days at all (see: Isle of Avalon and The Talisman from The Final Frontier)

I think In general Maiden makes longish songs with many parts and solos, but at their heart they are usually just long normal metal songs. Interesting all the way through with great solos, but not really prog.
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Points: 11415 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 13:13
Originally posted by HolyMoly HolyMoly wrote:

Originally posted by ExittheLemming ExittheLemming wrote:

Originally posted by HolyMoly HolyMoly wrote:

Let metal be metal, that's what I say.  Why should prog steal away all the good ones?


Perceptive but slyly disingenuous post certainly i.e. can we somehow assimilate all good metal into PA under the guise of progginess aforethought?
The sly part was intentional.  The disingenuous part was probably sarcasm.  My point was it's okay for a band to be really good, technically accomplished, and still just be "metal".  Give Metal itself some credit for its own traditions of virtuosity and ambition. 


I agree with you wholeheartedly but wondered why you felt the need to post such a notion using subtle camouflage. Yes, why can't a metal band be adventurous, inventive and prescient and still remain plain vanilla metal which pushes the boundaries of the genre i.e like any progressive artist in any chosen genre? It's a pity that our favorite pets sometines get mistaken for members of the family.
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Points: 56 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 13:15
I'm a metalhead,so of course I do give metal the credit it deserves; however, I just thought Iron Maiden would fit into Prog Metal just fine.

But Prog related is still fine I guess

Thank you for your time and responses
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Points: 17480 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 14:36
Lets add another level......

Prog Metal Related

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Points: 34 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 14:50

newbie alert:

where do we find
these musical categories
that are referenced in the OP?
 
thanks
 
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Points: 26133 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 14:56
Originally posted by LittleMilton LittleMilton wrote:

newbie alert:

where do we find
these musical categories
that are referenced in the OP?
 
thanks
 
http://www.progarchives.com/

Just below the main banner, there's a link for each of em. Gives a definition, numerous examples, etc.  Not all of them are used universally (i.e. outside of this site), but they came in handy somewhere along the way, so we use em.
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Points: 6446 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 15:05
Well they are proggier than some bands actually in PM (won't name any names). I also think it's fair to say that if Maiden never existed, then Prog Metal most likely would not either. 
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Points: 1607 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 17:16
Originally posted by Padraic Padraic wrote:

Originally posted by Rick Robson Rick Robson wrote:

^I suggest you check out two songs of that album (one for sure is To Tame a Land) - listen to that guitar solo melody and read the lyrics (oh yes! in this case I didn't hesitate to read almost the whole album).
 
People who enjoy Piece Of Mind know what I'm talking about.


I know the album well.  To Tame a Land is based off of Dune, so I'm not sure what Genghis Khan has to do with it.
 
Ghengis Khan and his troop invaded that lands and then they hailed him as 'The Trooper' hahahahahahaaa
Nah... I'm joking.
 
Right on Padraic ! Interesting observations you made about that track - based off of Dune, I never read that book, and only once watched the epic film some decades ago, but sure it must be an interesting book. I had to read again the lyrics - I mistook the correct king's name "Kwizatz Haderach" for "Genghis Khan" (the mongol emperor), not at all an arabian related hahahahh. My memory played me a funny joke when I wanted to mean that I felt an arabian atmosphere while listened to that guitar melody and all that arabian names (Arrakis, Muad Dib, Caladan and Gom Jabbar), btw the only part of the lyrics I still don't get is: ..."and (Kwizatz Haderach) will take the Gom Jabbar."


Edited by Rick Robson - May 16 2014 at 17:17


"Music is a higher revelation than all wisdom and philosophy." LvB
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Points: 15916 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2014 at 17:24
^ Epic, historic, fantasy lyrics right there. Go Harris. His bass on To Tame A Land is jaw-dropping.
Same with Alexander The Great from Somewhere In Time.
Maiden will always be a 'Metal' band, but one of the 'Proggier' sounding ones.
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