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Mike Rutherford's Living Years Autobiography

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genbanks View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote genbanks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Mike Rutherford's Living Years Autobiography
    Posted: May 23 2014 at 18:51
Hi, last week I finished the reading of Living Years, the autobiography of Mike Rutherford, which I bought from Amazon on Paperback, Geat reading, some new information, emotive really and with some humour and some sadness. I think it is a must for every Genesis fan. The book is in the vein of Nick Mason's Inside Out, which I read an year ago. Mike links his own history, and the the band one with the relationship with his father. Half of the book is centered in Genesis till Wind & Wuthering more or less. Once I started reading I could not stop till the end. The book shows many little but important things about Genesis, that we (unless me) don't know or think that were in another way. Highly recommended.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Chris S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 23 2014 at 22:52
^Thumbs Up sounds a must read
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...As I venture through the slipstream, between the viaducts in your dreams...
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mirror Image Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 24 2014 at 09:45
I'll have to check this Rutherford book out. I really admire his work with Genesis and think he's quite an underrated musician overall.

Edited by Mirror Image - May 24 2014 at 09:46
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Post Options Post Options   Quote genbanks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 28 2014 at 18:52
Originally posted by Chris S

^Thumbs Up sounds a must read

I could say that I'm almost sure you will enjoy it
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Post Options Post Options   Quote genbanks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 28 2014 at 18:53
Originally posted by Mirror Image

...and think he's quite an underrated musician overall...

absolutely agree with you
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mirror Image Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 28 2014 at 21:07
Originally posted by genbanks

Originally posted by Mirror Image

...and think he's quite an underrated musician overall...

absolutely agree with you

I thought you might. Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2014 at 12:40
Hi,
 
If I come across this, I will likely get it.
 
But honestly, I do not think that this would be any more than just a nice story about a pop music band from day one, with one or two pieces of music in the middle that broke the mold.
 
Artistically, I do not find this band any better, or more interesting than Banco or Ange. Not even close.
... none of the hits, none of the time ... you might actually find your own art, or self, and forego lousy heroes or Guru's!

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mirror Image Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 06 2014 at 21:35
Originally posted by moshkito

Hi,
 
If I come across this, I will likely get it.
 
But honestly, I do not think that this would be any more than just a nice story about a pop music band from day one, with one or two pieces of music in the middle that broke the mold.
 
Artistically, I do not find this band any better, or more interesting than Banco or Ange. Not even close.

And yet they continue to be regarded as one of the most influential and original progressive rock bands that ever existed. Before you make another ignorant post like this one, you may want to actually THINK about what you're going to post. Banco and Ange were NOTHING compared to Genesis. If anything, they lived in their shadow as did so many other bands.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Adams Bolero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2014 at 02:48
Originally posted by Mirror Image

Originally posted by moshkito

Hi,
 
If I come across this, I will likely get it.
 
But honestly, I do not think that this would be any more than just a nice story about a pop music band from day one, with one or two pieces of music in the middle that broke the mold.
 
Artistically, I do not find this band any better, or more interesting than Banco or Ange. Not even close.

And yet they continue to be regarded as one of the most influential and original progressive rock bands that ever existed. Before you make another ignorant post like this one, you may want to actually THINK about what you're going to post. Banco and Ange were NOTHING compared to Genesis. If anything, they lived in their shadow as did so many other bands.
No need to criticize Banco and Ange just because you disagree with Moshkito. They were nothing in terms of commercial success compared to Genesis but musically to my tastes they were very much equals. Your entitled to your opinion but albums like 'Darwin' by Banco and 'Au-Delà Du Délire' by Ange are right up there with Foxtrot in my book. 


Edited by Adams Bolero - June 07 2014 at 02:50
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Moogtron III Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2014 at 04:51
A Rutherford autobio?
How interesting, I didn't know about it. ShockedThumbs Up
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Post Options Post Options   Quote zravkapt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2014 at 06:11
Haven't read it but here's two spoilers from those who have...

1) Genesis and Pink Floyd used the same American drug dealer
2) The members of Genesis once owned a brothel in Texas
"We don't know a millionth of one percent about anything" - Thomas Edison
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mirror Image Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2014 at 08:22
Originally posted by Adams Bolero

Originally posted by Mirror Image

Originally posted by moshkito

Hi,
 
If I come across this, I will likely get it.
 
But honestly, I do not think that this would be any more than just a nice story about a pop music band from day one, with one or two pieces of music in the middle that broke the mold.
 
Artistically, I do not find this band any better, or more interesting than Banco or Ange. Not even close.

And yet they continue to be regarded as one of the most influential and original progressive rock bands that ever existed. Before you make another ignorant post like this one, you may want to actually THINK about what you're going to post. Banco and Ange were NOTHING compared to Genesis. If anything, they lived in their shadow as did so many other bands.
No need to criticize Banco and Ange just because you disagree with Moshkito. They were nothing in terms of commercial success compared to Genesis but musically to my tastes they were very much equals. Your entitled to your opinion but albums like 'Darwin' by Banco and 'Au-Delà Du Délire' by Ange are right up there with Foxtrot in my book. 

And yet Foxtrot has been more influential and continues to be sited by fans and critics as one of the greatest albums of progressive rock. Not to slight Banco or Ange, they are both unique bands, but they will continue to ride Genesis' coattails, because they really were minor bands. Regardless of whether you think they were equally as musically interesting or not, Genesis' place in progressive rock history is secured. Banco and Ange will always remain on the outside looking in.

IMHO, Foxtrot is better than anything Ange or Banco released. That's all I'll say here. 


Edited by Mirror Image - June 07 2014 at 09:17
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Post Options Post Options   Quote genbanks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2014 at 10:18
Originally posted by moshkito

Hi,
 
If I come across this, I will likely get it.
 
But honestly, I do not think that this would be any more than just a nice story about a pop music band from day one, with one or two pieces of music in the middle that broke the mold.
 
Artistically, I do not find this band any better, or more interesting than Banco or Ange. Not even close.

"...pop music band from day one with one or two pieces of music in the middle..." such an statement. Of course you have the freedom to say what you want. Sincerely I can not agree with this in anything. Here, in PA Genesis is the band with more albums in the top 10, or something like this, and maybe one of the bands with more albums with four or more stars...so? People here are all wrong?, well I don't think this. For me they were the paradigm of the prog rock. So I understand you but do not understand your motivations to do this kind of statement here in this poll. About the book, if you read clearly in my first post, I said that is a must for Genesis fans. In any case, this book is just a good moment, with bits of music and more of that, with things about life. For me it is a great book, just as the one of Nick Mason it is too.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Adams Bolero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2014 at 11:13
Originally posted by Mirror Image

Originally posted by Adams Bolero

Originally posted by Mirror Image

Originally posted by moshkito

Hi,
 
If I come across this, I will likely get it.
 
But honestly, I do not think that this would be any more than just a nice story about a pop music band from day one, with one or two pieces of music in the middle that broke the mold.
 
Artistically, I do not find this band any better, or more interesting than Banco or Ange. Not even close.

And yet they continue to be regarded as one of the most influential and original progressive rock bands that ever existed. Before you make another ignorant post like this one, you may want to actually THINK about what you're going to post. Banco and Ange were NOTHING compared to Genesis. If anything, they lived in their shadow as did so many other bands.
No need to criticize Banco and Ange just because you disagree with Moshkito. They were nothing in terms of commercial success compared to Genesis but musically to my tastes they were very much equals. Your entitled to your opinion but albums like 'Darwin' by Banco and 'Au-Delà Du Délire' by Ange are right up there with Foxtrot in my book. 

And yet Foxtrot has been more influential and continues to be sited by fans and critics as one of the greatest albums of progressive rock. Not to slight Banco or Ange, they are both unique bands, but they will continue to ride Genesis' coattails, because they really were minor bands. Regardless of whether you think they were equally as musically interesting or not, Genesis' place in progressive rock history is secured. Banco and Ange will always remain on the outside looking in.

IMHO, Foxtrot is better than anything Ange or Banco released. That's all I'll say here. 
Placing Genesis on a pedestal above bands like Ange and Banco, and countless other great prog bands of that era, because of critical and commercial success is unfair to those bands in my opinion. Just because they were not heralded by critics and fans does not make them minor bands. Their place in progressive rock history is secured as two of the most important prog bands to come out of Europe and are, to me anyway and I'm sure many others, equals to Genesis no matter what the critics or millions of fans think.. This dismissive attitude towards other prog bands is something I've encountered in the linear notes of the Genesis 1970-75 box set where David Baddiel dismisses bands like Van Der Graaf Generator and Gentle Giant as inferior to Genesis. Your entitled to your opinion but you can't expect this dismissal of the countless excellent prog bands that are not as critically or commercially successful as Genesis to go unchallenged.  I will say no more as well. This is going way off topic.


Edited by Adams Bolero - June 07 2014 at 12:48
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Post Options Post Options   Quote moshkito Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2014 at 15:22
Originally posted by Adams Bolero

.. This dismissive attitude towards other prog bands is something I've encountered in the linear notes of the Genesis 1970-75 box set where David Baddiel dismisses bands like Van Der Graaf Generator and Gentle Giant as inferior to Genesis. Your entitled to your opinion but you can't expect this dismissal of the countless excellent prog bands that are not as critically or commercially successful as Genesis to go unchallenged.  I will say no more as well. This is going way off topic.
 
It's a problem with folks that are so hardened by the top ten world. They will not accept/understand or give credit to anyone else in the whole world, because they did not speak English, and on top of that ... how dare they not sell in London.
 
I love Genesis and a lot of their music, but that's like saying that no one else had keyboards or wrote anything different out there. And YES, they were a pop band, and you might consider listening to "From Genesis to Revelation", which was the first album of theirs I ever bought when it first came out. And they ended as a pop band!


Edited by moshkito - June 07 2014 at 15:29
... none of the hits, none of the time ... you might actually find your own art, or self, and forego lousy heroes or Guru's!

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Post Options Post Options   Quote genbanks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2014 at 21:22
Originally posted by moshkito

 
It's a problem with folks that are so hardened by the top ten world. They will not accept/understand or give credit to anyone else in the whole world, because they did not speak English, and on top of that ... how dare they not sell in London.
 
I love Genesis and a lot of their music, but that's like saying that no one else had keyboards or wrote anything different out there. And YES, they were a pop band, and you might consider listening to "From Genesis to Revelation", which was the first album of theirs I ever bought when it first came out. And they ended as a pop band!

Agree about folks which only goes with the top ten world. Not my case and I'm not an english man, and I think that this has nothing to do with that, I think you are wrong about this. From Genesis to revelation is a pop album, of course, and after Wind &Wuthering, they became more pop of course too, but in between, they were mainly prog, so do not try to confuse things with tricks. All of this debate has its origin in that you started denigrating Genesis without any reason, unless in this post.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mirror Image Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2014 at 21:57
Originally posted by moshkito

Originally posted by Adams Bolero

.. This dismissive attitude towards other prog bands is something I've encountered in the linear notes of the Genesis 1970-75 box set where David Baddiel dismisses bands like Van Der Graaf Generator and Gentle Giant as inferior to Genesis. Your entitled to your opinion but you can't expect this dismissal of the countless excellent prog bands that are not as critically or commercially successful as Genesis to go unchallenged.  I will say no more as well. This is going way off topic.
 
It's a problem with folks that are so hardened by the top ten world. They will not accept/understand or give credit to anyone else in the whole world, because they did not speak English, and on top of that ... how dare they not sell in London.
 
I love Genesis and a lot of their music, but that's like saying that no one else had keyboards or wrote anything different out there. And YES, they were a pop band, and you might consider listening to "From Genesis to Revelation", which was the first album of theirs I ever bought when it first came out. And they ended as a pop band!

For me, it's not a matter of a "Top 10 World" maybe you're the one who lives in this world? I was simply stating that I think Banco and Ange weren't recognized as major prog bands. This doesn't mean that I don't think Banco and Ange weren't talented bands. For the record, I don't like Ange at all, but I know many listeners do. This is a question of you simply dragging one of the greatest progressive rock bands through the mud for no apparent reason. I don't really give a damn if you think Banco or Ange were equals to Genesis, it's apparent that you live in a fantasy world and have continued to turn your cheek to this music's history. We can argue about what we like until the cows come home, but history has spoken for Genesis, but you've forgotten that it has spoken for Banco and Ange as well. They will continue to be bands that live in the shadows as I do believe they lack the originality, inventiveness, and heart of the major prog bands like King Crimson, Yes, Pink Floyd, and, of course, Genesis.


Edited by Mirror Image - June 07 2014 at 21:57
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mirror Image Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2014 at 22:15
Originally posted by Adams Bolero

Originally posted by Mirror Image

Originally posted by Adams Bolero

Originally posted by Mirror Image

Originally posted by moshkito

Hi,
 
If I come across this, I will likely get it.
 
But honestly, I do not think that this would be any more than just a nice story about a pop music band from day one, with one or two pieces of music in the middle that broke the mold.
 
Artistically, I do not find this band any better, or more interesting than Banco or Ange. Not even close.

And yet they continue to be regarded as one of the most influential and original progressive rock bands that ever existed. Before you make another ignorant post like this one, you may want to actually THINK about what you're going to post. Banco and Ange were NOTHING compared to Genesis. If anything, they lived in their shadow as did so many other bands.
No need to criticize Banco and Ange just because you disagree with Moshkito. They were nothing in terms of commercial success compared to Genesis but musically to my tastes they were very much equals. Your entitled to your opinion but albums like 'Darwin' by Banco and 'Au-Delà Du Délire' by Ange are right up there with Foxtrot in my book. 

And yet Foxtrot has been more influential and continues to be sited by fans and critics as one of the greatest albums of progressive rock. Not to slight Banco or Ange, they are both unique bands, but they will continue to ride Genesis' coattails, because they really were minor bands. Regardless of whether you think they were equally as musically interesting or not, Genesis' place in progressive rock history is secured. Banco and Ange will always remain on the outside looking in.

IMHO, Foxtrot is better than anything Ange or Banco released. That's all I'll say here. 
Placing Genesis on a pedestal above bands like Ange and Banco, and countless other great prog bands of that era, because of critical and commercial success is unfair to those bands in my opinion. Just because they were not heralded by critics and fans does not make them minor bands. Their place in progressive rock history is secured as two of the most important prog bands to come out of Europe and are, to me anyway and I'm sure many others, equals to Genesis no matter what the critics or millions of fans think.. This dismissive attitude towards other prog bands is something I've encountered in the linear notes of the Genesis 1970-75 box set where David Baddiel dismisses bands like Van Der Graaf Generator and Gentle Giant as inferior to Genesis. Your entitled to your opinion but you can't expect this dismissal of the countless excellent prog bands that are not as critically or commercially successful as Genesis to go unchallenged.  I will say no more as well. This is going way off topic.

Banco were inspired by ELP, Jethro Tull, and Gentle Giant while Ange were inspired by Genesis and King Crimson. Both bands wore these influences on their sleeve and, according to prog history, they aren't considered major prog rock bands. Banco and Ange were talented bands don't get me wrong but they lacked that extra ounce of originality and inventiveness that the major prog bands had. There's a reason why nobody talks about these two bands and, for me, that reason is there's a lack of accessibility in their music. 


Edited by Mirror Image - June 07 2014 at 22:23
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Adams Bolero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2014 at 02:13
Originally posted by Mirror Image

Originally posted by Adams Bolero

Originally posted by Mirror Image

Originally posted by Adams Bolero

Originally posted by Mirror Image

Originally posted by moshkito

Hi,
 
If I come across this, I will likely get it.
 
But honestly, I do not think that this would be any more than just a nice story about a pop music band from day one, with one or two pieces of music in the middle that broke the mold.
 
Artistically, I do not find this band any better, or more interesting than Banco or Ange. Not even close.

And yet they continue to be regarded as one of the most influential and original progressive rock bands that ever existed. Before you make another ignorant post like this one, you may want to actually THINK about what you're going to post. Banco and Ange were NOTHING compared to Genesis. If anything, they lived in their shadow as did so many other bands.
No need to criticize Banco and Ange just because you disagree with Moshkito. They were nothing in terms of commercial success compared to Genesis but musically to my tastes they were very much equals. Your entitled to your opinion but albums like 'Darwin' by Banco and 'Au-Delà Du Délire' by Ange are right up there with Foxtrot in my book. 

And yet Foxtrot has been more influential and continues to be sited by fans and critics as one of the greatest albums of progressive rock. Not to slight Banco or Ange, they are both unique bands, but they will continue to ride Genesis' coattails, because they really were minor bands. Regardless of whether you think they were equally as musically interesting or not, Genesis' place in progressive rock history is secured. Banco and Ange will always remain on the outside looking in.

IMHO, Foxtrot is better than anything Ange or Banco released. That's all I'll say here. 
Placing Genesis on a pedestal above bands like Ange and Banco, and countless other great prog bands of that era, because of critical and commercial success is unfair to those bands in my opinion. Just because they were not heralded by critics and fans does not make them minor bands. Their place in progressive rock history is secured as two of the most important prog bands to come out of Europe and are, to me anyway and I'm sure many others, equals to Genesis no matter what the critics or millions of fans think.. This dismissive attitude towards other prog bands is something I've encountered in the linear notes of the Genesis 1970-75 box set where David Baddiel dismisses bands like Van Der Graaf Generator and Gentle Giant as inferior to Genesis. Your entitled to your opinion but you can't expect this dismissal of the countless excellent prog bands that are not as critically or commercially successful as Genesis to go unchallenged.  I will say no more as well. This is going way off topic.

Banco were inspired by ELP, Jethro Tull, and Gentle Giant while Ange were inspired by Genesis and King Crimson. Both bands wore these influences on their sleeve and, according to prog history, they aren't considered major prog rock bands. Banco and Ange were talented bands don't get me wrong but they lacked that extra ounce of originality and inventiveness that the major prog bands had. There's a reason why nobody talks about these two bands and, for me, that reason is there's a lack of accessibility in their music. 
Who wrote this prog history that has dammed Ange and Banco, and most non English prog bands it seems, but exalted Genesis? Are you basing this history on commercial sales and critical acclaim? Lets go beyond those two prog bands and look at Henry Cow. A band completely original and inventive and yet damned to obscurity. Yes you may be right that these bands are not talked about due to a lack of accessibility but is accessibility a good thing? Does Genesis being accessible make them superior to bands like Henry Cow, Amon Duul 2 and Samla Mammas Manna because they can appeal to a wider audience. I don't think so.  

Genesis are one of the cornerstones of prog and rightly heralded but there are a lot of great prog bands forgotten. Why should they not have a prominent place in prog history just because they didn't sell well or lacked accessibility. Henry Cow are a difficult band to get into and are totally non-commercial but I regard them as important to prog as Genesis. Yes they did not have the critical and commercial success but they were just as inventive and original. The same is true for countless other prog bands.

I completely disagree with the view that the original British highly acclaimed prog bands are the greatest and everything else is in the shadows. Gong and Soft Machine are two of the original cornerstones of prog but lack the critical acclaim, accessibility and commercial success of Genesis and Yes but that does not make them any less important in my book.


Edited by Adams Bolero - June 08 2014 at 02:21
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mirror Image Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2014 at 09:23
Originally posted by Adams Bolero

Originally posted by Mirror Image

Originally posted by Adams Bolero

Originally posted by Mirror Image

Originally posted by Adams Bolero

Originally posted by Mirror Image

Originally posted by moshkito

Hi,
 
If I come across this, I will likely get it.
 
But honestly, I do not think that this would be any more than just a nice story about a pop music band from day one, with one or two pieces of music in the middle that broke the mold.
 
Artistically, I do not find this band any better, or more interesting than Banco or Ange. Not even close.

And yet they continue to be regarded as one of the most influential and original progressive rock bands that ever existed. Before you make another ignorant post like this one, you may want to actually THINK about what you're going to post. Banco and Ange were NOTHING compared to Genesis. If anything, they lived in their shadow as did so many other bands.
No need to criticize Banco and Ange just because you disagree with Moshkito. They were nothing in terms of commercial success compared to Genesis but musically to my tastes they were very much equals. Your entitled to your opinion but albums like 'Darwin' by Banco and 'Au-Delà Du Délire' by Ange are right up there with Foxtrot in my book. 

And yet Foxtrot has been more influential and continues to be sited by fans and critics as one of the greatest albums of progressive rock. Not to slight Banco or Ange, they are both unique bands, but they will continue to ride Genesis' coattails, because they really were minor bands. Regardless of whether you think they were equally as musically interesting or not, Genesis' place in progressive rock history is secured. Banco and Ange will always remain on the outside looking in.

IMHO, Foxtrot is better than anything Ange or Banco released. That's all I'll say here. 
Placing Genesis on a pedestal above bands like Ange and Banco, and countless other great prog bands of that era, because of critical and commercial success is unfair to those bands in my opinion. Just because they were not heralded by critics and fans does not make them minor bands. Their place in progressive rock history is secured as two of the most important prog bands to come out of Europe and are, to me anyway and I'm sure many others, equals to Genesis no matter what the critics or millions of fans think.. This dismissive attitude towards other prog bands is something I've encountered in the linear notes of the Genesis 1970-75 box set where David Baddiel dismisses bands like Van Der Graaf Generator and Gentle Giant as inferior to Genesis. Your entitled to your opinion but you can't expect this dismissal of the countless excellent prog bands that are not as critically or commercially successful as Genesis to go unchallenged.  I will say no more as well. This is going way off topic.

Banco were inspired by ELP, Jethro Tull, and Gentle Giant while Ange were inspired by Genesis and King Crimson. Both bands wore these influences on their sleeve and, according to prog history, they aren't considered major prog rock bands. Banco and Ange were talented bands don't get me wrong but they lacked that extra ounce of originality and inventiveness that the major prog bands had. There's a reason why nobody talks about these two bands and, for me, that reason is there's a lack of accessibility in their music. 
Who wrote this prog history that has dammed Ange and Banco, and most non English prog bands it seems, but exalted Genesis? Are you basing this history on commercial sales and critical acclaim? Lets go beyond those two prog bands and look at Henry Cow. A band completely original and inventive and yet damned to obscurity. Yes you may be right that these bands are not talked about due to a lack of accessibility but is accessibility a good thing? Does Genesis being accessible make them superior to bands like Henry Cow, Amon Duul 2 and Samla Mammas Manna because they can appeal to a wider audience. I don't think so.  

Genesis are one of the cornerstones of prog and rightly heralded but there are a lot of great prog bands forgotten. Why should they not have a prominent place in prog history just because they didn't sell well or lacked accessibility. Henry Cow are a difficult band to get into and are totally non-commercial but I regard them as important to prog as Genesis. Yes they did not have the critical and commercial success but they were just as inventive and original. The same is true for countless other prog bands.

I completely disagree with the view that the original British highly acclaimed prog bands are the greatest and everything else is in the shadows. Gong and Soft Machine are two of the original cornerstones of prog but lack the critical acclaim, accessibility and commercial success of Genesis and Yes but that does not make them any less important in my book.

I'm basing my opinion on influence. Anyway, we'll agree to disagree here as I think the British progressive bands had their hands in the creation of this music we know as prog while other countries have failed to keep up and provide the same kind of originality and innovation.


Edited by Mirror Image - June 08 2014 at 09:24
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