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ExittheLemming View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2014 at 05:50
Originally posted by Slartibartfast Slartibartfast wrote:

People who have trashed prog come across as idiots as best or merely ignorant, if I were to be kind...

punk has been assimilated, resistance is futile...


Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

The Cla$h... middle class rockabilly white boy ska reggae funk punk... badum tish!


I'm not sure which is worse really as both sides appear particularly inept at trashing anything. Transposing an 's' into a dollar sign seems crassly glib as an attempt to undermine what became a band's admittedly gauche left wing posturing and yes, John Mellor was the son of a diplomat but how does that undermine either his sincerity or the working class origins of his bandmates?Confused (I suspect your tongue is in the region of a cheek, location tbaWink)




Edited by ExittheLemming - July 20 2014 at 06:12
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2014 at 06:45
Originally posted by ExittheLemming ExittheLemming wrote:



Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

The Cla$h... middle class rockabilly white boy ska reggae funk punk... badum tish!


I'm not sure which is worse really as both sides appear particularly inept at trashing anything. Transposing an 's' into a dollar sign seems crassly glib as an attempt to undermine what became a band's admittedly gauche left wing posturing and yes, John Mellor was the son of a diplomat but how does that undermine either his sincerity or the working class origins of his bandmates?Confused (I suspect your tongue is in the region of a cheek, location tbaWink)


I don't consider The Clash to be the epitome of the Punk Rock ethos or their knowing blend of musical styles to be typically Punk - to me they were about as convincing as Punks as The Stranglers were (love them as I do, they weren't Punk). I wasn't alluding to Strummer's middle-class heritage, their Pub Rock origins or Jones & Simonon's earlier attempts at glam rock but at their Guardian reading fan-base. Glibness abounds on the Internet but also in the after-Punk era before Post-Punk where The Clash emerged, the $-sign was merely a trite attempt at provocative humour late on a Saturday night, hence the badum tish!.
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ExittheLemming View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2014 at 07:03
^ OK the badum tish should have altered me to your jesting mood perhaps. I agree that both the Clash and the Stranglers were really just brilliant rock bands whose relationship to Punk was that as a platform to launch their respective careers. The 'Guardian reading fanbase' bit I don't really get (but I haven't lived in the UK since 2000) as the sort of looney lefty egalitarian mindset hasn't been extant in Albion since the days of Derek Hatton and Ken Livingstone's GLC surely? You can't blame the paint factory for the graffiti.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2014 at 07:12

Yes the Clash were a 'punk' band for only a very short time while it suited them and then they did London Calling and that was a very good album (although perhaps not great).  They were the 'Guradian readers' punk band of choice 'cos of their politics.  I don't think punk died in 76 really, I still think there were some decent bands around and at least one classic punk album (Stiff Little Fingers: Inflamable Material came out in1978).  After that it depends on what you think punk is I tend to think its an attitude rather than a type of music.  I am sure that Mr Lydon felt being a fan of VDGG was perfectly in tune with being a 'punk'.   Those that dropped liking other music because punk came along didn't really understand. 

 
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ExittheLemming View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2014 at 07:32
^ I agree that it's only the 1st Clash album that could be credibly described as Punk music (and it mostly sucks hugely IMO) but Give "Em Enough Rope was a tantalising transition record which culminated in the masterpiece London Calling which is on a par with anything by the Stones, the Who or the Kinks i.e. plain vanilla brilliant rock music. I also agree that the attitude and mindset of Punk dwarfed the longevity of the rudimentary and mostly forgettable music but the year zero fervour, the confrontational mindset and DIY attitude were exactly what the music industry required to drag it screaming and kicking into the 80's. I admit that what ultimately followed was no better than what had gone before but at least we got to enjoy in the interim, the so-called post-punk treasures of the Cure, Banshees, XTC, Monochrome Set, Wall of Voodoo, Television, Joy Division, New Order, Talking Heads, Orange Juice, the Sound, the Fall, Josef K, PIL, Magazine, Teardrop Explodes,Echo & the Bunnymen, the Wild Swans, Cocteau Twins (the list goes on)


Edited by ExittheLemming - July 20 2014 at 07:34
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2014 at 07:35
^ absolutely. The Clash début was voted album of the decade or album of the century or somesuch in a Guardian readers poll some years back - of course criticism of a band's fan-base (and I was a Guardian reader for the best part of 30 years), is not criticism of the band itself - they cannot dictate who likes their music or their brand of palatable liberal/socialist politics. 

In general terms was referring to actual Punk type of music rather than an attitude (which certainly endured long after them music itself went into a rapid decline) - it simply lacked the substance to sustain itself past those early (1976) releases - the classic example being The Banshees whose eventual recording career missed Punk by two clear years, their début signalled the cusp of Punk into Post Punk.

But enough of this serious stuff, this is supposed to be a light-hearted comedy thread, now where is my recording of Peter Gabriel giving his Punk version of a Whiter Shade of Pale?.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2014 at 07:40
Originally posted by Dean Dean wrote:

But enough of this serious stuff, this is supposed to be a light-hearted comedy thread, now where is my recording of Peter Gabriel giving his Punk version of a Whiter Shade of Pale?.

LOL
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 20 2014 at 08:29


Great read you guys! Thanks.
“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”

- Douglas Adams
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 01 2014 at 13:23
Hi,
 
Steve ... you know what's sad here?
 
Not a single discussion on Roy Harper! And he's more progressive and out there than 50% of all the bands listed in this board!
 
Personal favorites include "Jugula +4" and "The Unknown Soldier" which comes around before Roger Waters did the WALL. I also like "Stormcock" a lot. Both HQ and One of These Days in England were acquired as imports and were played mercilessly at KTYD by my roomie (Guy Guden - Space Pirate Radio) for a heck of a long time, and by the time WUWH was out, pretty much all of the folks at the station had played something. "The Game" was played so much that the album was replaced, and I had to get a 2nd copy!
 
Btw, one of the favorites at the station was the song about a load of crap ... because it was fun and cute! Went well with Dumb Kate, too, from the Incredible String Band!


Edited by moshkito - August 01 2014 at 14:01
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 01 2014 at 13:37
*note* the thread title was changed. But since this is now a discussion about Roy Harper and flooding posts with random YouToob videos seems to be popular posting style around here, here goes...






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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 01 2014 at 14:19
Hi,
 
Did not see a title change ... hmmm ... sorry!
 
I can't even imagine but a handfull of folks even CONSIDERING discussing Roy Harper, other than us 3 or 4!
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 01 2014 at 21:08
Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Hi,
 

Did not see a title change ... hmmm ... sorry!

 

I can't even imagine but a handfull of folks even CONSIDERING discussing Roy Harper, other than us 3 or 4!

I'll ignore your usual incredibly snobby comment as a cry for help.

Anyway, regarding Harper, I have been listening to the sublime APP remix and I was really struck by how Ian Anderson's acoustic chord structures were very reminiscent of Stormcock-era Harper. I remember Ian once referring to Harper's influence, it just took a few listens in 5.1 to really notice it. Not a coincidence, particulary in the acoustic sections of the Chateau D'Isaster sessions.

Edited by The Dark Elf - August 01 2014 at 22:28
...a vigorous circular motion hitherto unknown to the people of this area, but destined
to take the place of the mud shark in your mythology...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 01 2014 at 22:53
Thanks to SG for the piece on Harper. I've been a fan for a long time and was lucky to see him twice at the Abbey Pub in Chicago in the late 90's. Six of us managed to get our picture taken with him in front holding a Heineken beer bottle.
A very nice man and he was very pleasant and spent time talking with us and signing album covers.
One of my fondest memories of any show I have ever been to.
Cool
One does nothing yet nothing is left undone.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 02 2014 at 14:20
Originally posted by The Dark Elf The Dark Elf wrote:

...
Anyway, regarding Harper, I have been listening to the sublime APP remix and I was really struck by how Ian Anderson's acoustic chord structures were very reminiscent of Stormcock-era Harper. I remember Ian once referring to Harper's influence, it just took a few listens in 5.1 to really notice it. Not a coincidence, particulary in the acoustic sections of the Chateau D'Isaster sessions.
 
My understanding was, a while back, that they were neighbors.
 
But just as good, and different, is Jimmy Page on so many of Roy's albums and no one has noticed it, because he is not the ego/hero Jimmy that everyone wants to hear do Stairway to Nothing one more time!
 
NP: The Game (Pts 1-5) ... if that is not prog, we have no ears!!!! And that Gilmour/Spedding duet is outstanding!
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2014 at 05:18
I am from India and I could indeed relate to the lyrics of When An Old Cricketer Leaves the Crease, though I wonder if that was more on account of the fact that it reminded me a bit of the first chapter of Psmith in the City.  Well, in the 1970s, Harvest could have hoped to promote that song successfully in Australia, who had both a rock culture as well as a passion for cricket.  I don't know that they did. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2014 at 15:08
Steve, this is all very interesting, but have you ever considered
using
paragraphs?
You know, just to make it a little bit easier for the reader.
He say nothing is quite what it seems;
I say nothing is nothing
(Peter Hammill)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2014 at 09:15









Originally posted by refugee refugee wrote:

Steve, this is all very interesting, but have you ever consideredusingparagraphs?You know, just to make it a little bit easier for the reader.

Absolutely and I apologise as there's a problem with transfering my post from Excel to the PA site which alters it's format. Same deal with the old MS Word system and I do not have this problem transfering to any  other websites. I'm going out to CA for awhile to record some demos with one of my favorite 7 string players so I hope my PC guru can I can get this remedied before I get back. Sent From My I Phone









Edited by SteveG - August 04 2014 at 14:07
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2014 at 14:05
Originally posted by rogerthat rogerthat wrote:

I am from India and I could indeed relate to the lyrics of When An Old Cricketer Leaves the Crease, though I wonder if that was more on account of the fact that it reminded me a bit of the first chapter of Psmith in the City.  Well, in the 1970s, Harvest could have hoped to promote that song successfully in Australia, who had both a rock culture as well as a passion for cricket.  I don't know that they did. 
I didn't know cricket was still so popular in Australia, so thanks for the update.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 09 2014 at 10:16
Originally posted by refugee refugee wrote:

Steve, this is all very interesting, but have you ever considered
using
paragraphs?
You know, just to make it a little bit easier for the reader.
 
Point taken!
 
However, you are preventing the development of language and communication by forcing someone to do exactly what you want be it with grammar or not. That is highly UNPROGRESSIVE of you, btw!
 
There are many ways to be expressive, and I, personally, have no issues with his wording, any more than I do with yours!
 
And this is the difference between "progressive" and "ordinary". Progressive is ACCEPTIVE to the differences in languages and countries and sometimes the way we say it is very different. Ordinary, is just another person on this board that only knows the top ten, and then spends their time not reading things, because they do not have the douche that you want, that makes your personal top ten, your favorite TP!


Edited by moshkito - August 09 2014 at 10:19
Music is not just for listening ... it is for LIVING ... you got to feel it to know what's it about! Not being told!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 09 2014 at 11:56
Originally posted by moshkito moshkito wrote:

Originally posted by refugee refugee wrote:

Steve, this is all very interesting, but have you ever considered
using
paragraphs?
You know, just to make it a little bit easier for the reader.
 
Point taken!
 
However, you are preventing the development of language and communication by forcing someone to do exactly what you want be it with grammar or not. That is highly UNPROGRESSIVE of you, btw!
 
There are many ways to be expressive, and I, personally, have no issues with his wording, any more than I do with yours!
 
And this is the difference between "progressive" and "ordinary". Progressive is ACCEPTIVE to the differences in languages and countries and sometimes the way we say it is very different. Ordinary, is just another person on this board that only knows the top ten, and then spends their time not reading things, because they do not have the douche that you want, that makes your personal top ten, your favorite TP!
Ermm I think you'll find that was: "Point completely missed."
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