Remasters, Remixes and importance of the Original

progbethyname wrote: Catcher10 wrote: 180g vinyl "sounds" as good as those gold colored CD's of the 90's They are different. SACD's offer a more 'surround sound' approach, so the music is more channeled off creating a massive separating, wide sound stage. However SACD's don't sound as 'real' cause the resolution is so damn high it sounds a little fake and compressed. The definition and clarity is amazing, but I would take the 180g pressing anyday. It's not that it's better. It's just different. A difference that I love. SACD's are a pure digital feed. They are the same as an 5.1 mix DVD in either Dolby or DTS 5.1.

It was a joke!
If you remember back in the 90's there was a period when CDs were being issued as gold CD's had nothing to do with SACD. It was because the aluminum layer in the disc was actually rotting away, they called it "CD Rot". So some started to make that layer with gold to avoid the rot, plus also stated it sounded better....I never thought it added any sonic qualities.

Now on to 180g vinyl. Again, I am not sure it adds any sonic qualities, it does add some longevity to the LP as JD states because it is thicker, beefier. Like the gold vs aluminum in the CDs, it will last longer.
Warped vinyl is not an issue if you use a clamp or weight to hold the LP down firmly on the platter, of course a badly warped record may still exhibit a less than pristine sound. Those very thin LPs like 100-110g are fine, again as long as it is flat while playing.

Not 100% sure if the 180g allows deeper groove cuts, probably, but you can still only go so deep. What has really helped IMO is that most reissues are dbl LP's on 180g. No need to squeeze all that music onto 1 LP where those end tracks can exhibit sibilance because the circle is getting smaller and the rotation is faster, the cartridge has a tough time tracking inner grooves.....Google Inner Groove Distortion. It is so critical to align your cartridge to that inner point when using a 2-point protractor to align, once done correctly it is all good and glorious!

Do I prefer 180g over standard weight...absolutely!!! But the mastering is what makes it sound better.

Sterling Sound has a nice quick tutorial on their process for mastering, excellent read and its why I think next to Bob Ludwig, the Sterling Sound engineers are the best. Greg Calbi and the late George Marino have done incredible work.

http://sterling-sound.com/mastering/

Cheers!

^

Edited by SteveG - August 12 2014 at 14:28

Agree with The Doctor....consensus was the original early Genesis albums were veiled with a muddy sound. The Rhino vinyl remasters I have are excellent, the detail of music and what you hear is amazing. I just finished listening to SEBTP and More Fool Me is stunning!

Vapor Trails does sound a whole lot better..I never really had any issue with my original CD, but I can sure hear a big improvement now with the vinyl version. I actually hear new bits and pcs here and there...
As far as albums that have multiple remasters, you really have to research on different forums and see which version people agree has the best sound, usually they agree too which sounds bad and to stay away from.

JD wrote: Thanks Steve, I'm certainly no Alan Parsons or Eddie Offord, but I've had my fingers in it on and off for many years (decades actually, egad!) Always happy to share knowledge that I have and to gain it from those more in the know than I.

Groove on, my friend. :)

genbanks wrote: There was some remasters of Genesis albums done in the past, Nursery Cryme 1994 remaster I remember, and this process carried the tracks to a worst condition than the originals. The new remasters are totally differents. So the process could be better or worst deppending on the case. About King Crimson ITCOTCK, I can't see a big improvment. For me, if the remaster implies an improvment in the sound, I do not care much about the original sound.

Edited by Mirror Image - August 11 2014 at 17:36

Catcher10 wrote: Mirror Image wrote: genbanks wrote: There was some remasters of Genesis albums done in the past, Nursery Cryme 1994 remaster I remember, and this process carried the tracks to a worst condition than the originals. The new remasters are totally differents. So the process could be better or worst deppending on the case. About King Crimson ITCOTCK, I can't see a big improvment. For me, if the remaster implies an improvment in the sound, I do not care much about the original sound. My problem with the newer Genesis remixes/remasters is the compression which seems to rob the music of a lot of subtlety. Also, each song is mixed at the same level: LOUD, LOUD, and more LOUD. After awhile, I started to realize that these remixes aren't all they cracked up to be. I mean they do provide a different sound than the original mix, but that's all. They will not replace the originals IMHO. The original CDs were much warmer and you can listen to them for a prolonged period of time without ever feeling tired. The overall dynamics on the original CD issues are also much better to me. While I stated on another thread that I liked these remixes for the different sound-world they provide, I feel that they can't even begin to touch the originals and I'm not the only one who feels this way. I would like Steven Wilson to get ahold of these classic Genesis albums and then maybe can get a remix that doesn't make my ears bleed. The Rhino half speed remasters by Nick Davis are pretty sweet! My originals are now put away for safe keeping...

Edited by Mirror Image - August 11 2014 at 17:55

Mirror Image wrote: Catcher10 wrote: Mirror Image wrote: genbanks wrote: There was some remasters of Genesis albums done in the past, Nursery Cryme 1994 remaster I remember, and this process carried the tracks to a worst condition than the originals. The new remasters are totally differents. So the process could be better or worst deppending on the case. About King Crimson ITCOTCK, I can't see a big improvment. For me, if the remaster implies an improvment in the sound, I do not care much about the original sound. My problem with the newer Genesis remixes/remasters is the compression which seems to rob the music of a lot of subtlety. Also, each song is mixed at the same level: LOUD, LOUD, and more LOUD. After awhile, I started to realize that these remixes aren't all they cracked up to be. I mean they do provide a different sound than the original mix, but that's all. They will not replace the originals IMHO. The original CDs were much warmer and you can listen to them for a prolonged period of time without ever feeling tired. The overall dynamics on the original CD issues are also much better to me. While I stated on another thread that I liked these remixes for the different sound-world they provide, I feel that they can't even begin to touch the originals and I'm not the only one who feels this way. I would like Steven Wilson to get ahold of these classic Genesis albums and then maybe can get a remix that doesn't make my ears bleed. The Rhino half speed remasters by Nick Davis are pretty sweet! My originals are now put away for safe keeping... My dad owns all the Genesis albums (or the ones from Trespass to ..And Then There Were Three...<em style="font-style: italic; ">) on vinyl and these puppies sound sweet, but I'm still a CD man at the end of the day. I like these original CDs.

Do you have a DAC by chance when you listen to the Nick Davis mixes/remasters?