Why do we love Prog concept albums?

SteveG wrote: dr wu23 wrote: SteveG wrote: ^So, you must really not like concept albums then.   I like them fine they are just not my favorites among all, the prog albums I own and like. For instance; I like Stand Up, Benefit , and Aqualung ( I don't consider this a concept lp) better than TAAB. Meddle better than DSOTM and WYWH (which I never thought of as a concept lp either btw..)   IMHO many of these so-called concept albums are weak regarding their ..er..concepts.   I think in a roundabout way, Doc, you may have just provided some profound wisdom on concept albums that I have failed to grasp. Perhaps it's their weak concepts, generally speaking, that causes me place an album like Aqualung in with the rest. I'll have to meditate on this.

Nonsense! "The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars" is a splendid album, a great rock release. So what if Bowie's concept was banal? One could say the same for any of Mozart's insipid plots -- doesn't make the music any less spectacular.

Edited by The Dark Elf - August 19 2014 at 16:41

^Ziggy Stardust actually has a good over all story line.

Yes, I think the weak link in many concept albums is a weak link between desperate songs that are strung together. That's probably why a coherent work like DSOTM or The Wall really stands out.

Edited by SteveG - August 19 2014 at 16:52

SteveG wrote: ^Are you still with me Greg? Greg?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Weak. Got it.

But I think, from a lyrical standpoint, TAAB, and even more so A Passion Play, are very clever. Certainly beyond the level of most albums, even pretentious prog ones.

SteveG wrote: ^I'm not throwing the baby out with the bath water, dear boy. Just the opposite as TAAB and Aqualung are cleaver lyrical works but perhaps weakly linked together. I'm trying to get at why people are so dismissive of them. I'm on your side. And that goes for APP also.

You are on my side? I wasn't aware I was on any side. As far as concept albums go, I think most folk who are contemptuous of the milieu consider musicians to be piss-poor authors. And this is easiest to notice in the plot of a concept album.

Edited by The Dark Elf - August 19 2014 at 17:25

SteveG wrote: dr wu23 wrote: SteveG wrote: ^So, you must really not like concept albums then.   I like them fine they are just not my favorites among all, the prog albums I own and like. For instance; I like Stand Up, Benefit , and Aqualung ( I don't consider this a concept lp) better than TAAB. Meddle better than DSOTM and WYWH (which I never thought of as a concept lp either btw..)   IMHO many of these so-called concept albums are weak regarding their ..er..concepts.   I think in a roundabout way, Doc, you may have just provided some profound wisdom on concept albums that I have failed to grasp. Perhaps it's their weak concepts, generally speaking, that causes me place an album like Aqualung in with the rest. I'll have to meditate on this.

^Subjective as they are and can only ever be, do they qualify as "concept" albums? I think so.

And with that, I'll say Goodnight.


Edited by SteveG - August 19 2014 at 17:59

Lets be careful not to mix 'themed' albums with 'concept' albums for they are both entirely different, especially on a structural level.

Anyhow. Why I love concept albums?

The sheer bloody adventure of it all! Love how all the tracks connect both musically and lyrically.
Concept albums work for me. Take Operation Mindcrime by Queensrÿche for example. That is a very clever, well thought out album that in the end created a very glaring and underlying message.
:)

Also. Concept albums can be extremely educational. You can learn about historical figures. For instance, Judas Priest did an incredible conceptual double album on Nostradamus, and I learned a lot about his life and how he developed his 'quatrains'. Ian Anderson with 'homo Erectus' pretty much gives a history lesson spanning 300 years in 62min.

All in all. Concept albums rock and expand your immagination.

Rednight wrote: Wouldn't consider the first two examples prog concept albums (wouldn't ever listen to them, either).

Ok. Don't be fooled by the Judas Priest album. It's actually a progressive metal effort and its the only one they have ever done, and quite frankly it's their best album they have ever done as a band. I was shocked when I heard it, but man it really worked. I wish they would've continued to build on the more progressive side of metal rather than just returning back to what they do best as stated on, 'The Redeemer of Souls.' Good concept album actually, but not Prog and its just playing it safe.

Operation mindcrime? Please fill me in on how this is not a prog effort from the Ryche? I'm curious. You
Have my attention.

SteveG wrote: dr wu23 wrote: SteveG wrote: dr wu23 wrote: SteveG wrote: ^So, you must really not like concept albums then.   I like them fine they are just not my favorites among all, the prog albums I own and like. For instance; I like Stand Up, Benefit , and Aqualung ( I don't consider this a concept lp) better than TAAB. Meddle better than DSOTM and WYWH (which I never thought of as a concept lp either btw..)   IMHO many of these so-called concept albums are weak regarding their ..er..concepts.   I think in a roundabout way, Doc, you may have just provided some profound wisdom on concept albums that I have failed to grasp. Perhaps it's their weak concepts, generally speaking, that causes me place an album like Aqualung in with the rest. I'll have to meditate on this.   In your opinion what is the 'concept' of Aqualung and DSOTM..? A good question Doc, that deserves an answer. DSOTM, to me, is about the desperation of life along with themes of death and madness that are sonically linked togther to give the impression of a concept. But the lyrics are vivid, not vague. Aqualung is diatribe against organized  religions, their creators versus their creation (God) and the people who suffer because of it:  Aqualung and Cross Eyed Mary.  Again, the lyrics to me are vivid and not vague.

I can see those ideas in DSOTM though I'm not sure I would consider it a true concept album based on just similar themes in some of the songs..

Edited by dr wu23 - August 20 2014 at 11:33

dr wu23 wrote: SteveG wrote: dr wu23 wrote: SteveG wrote: dr wu23 wrote: SteveG wrote: ^So, you must really not like concept albums then.   I like them fine they are just not my favorites among all, the prog albums I own and like. For instance; I like Stand Up, Benefit , and Aqualung ( I don't consider this a concept lp) better than TAAB. Meddle better than DSOTM and WYWH (which I never thought of as a concept lp either btw..)   IMHO many of these so-called concept albums are weak regarding their ..er..concepts.   I think in a roundabout way, Doc, you may have just provided some profound wisdom on concept albums that I have failed to grasp. Perhaps it's their weak concepts, generally speaking, that causes me place an album like Aqualung in with the rest. I'll have to meditate on this.   In your opinion what is the 'concept' of Aqualung and DSOTM..? A good question Doc, that deserves an answer. DSOTM, to me, is about the desperation of life along with themes of death and madness that are sonically linked togther to give the impression of a concept. But the lyrics are vivid, not vague. Aqualung is diatribe against organized  religions, their creators versus their creation (God) and the people who suffer because of it:  Aqualung and Cross Eyed Mary.  Again, the lyrics to me are vivid and not vague. I can see those ideas in DSOTM though I'm not sure I would consider it a true concept album based on just similar themes in some of the songs.. And regarding Aqualung only one song is directly about God  and or creation....I don't see that in most of the other tracks at all. Aqualung and Crosseyed Mary to name just 2 have nothing to do with God per se imho...or am I missing something?   btw some one mentioned theme vs concept.....to me these albums seem to be  more themed than conceptual...but then maybe I'm getting the terms confused.

I see Doc. If you're not familiar with the songs on Aqualung that are about God, the placement of the songs, Anderson's liner note's stating that God is a man made construct along with some form of man made subhuman species assumed to not have a soul of which the Aqualung character is a part, then a concept album would be hard to imagine indeed.

So I will tell you the four songs that are directly about God which are on the original LP's side 2.

1) My God
2) Hymn 43
3) Slipstream
5) Wind Up.

After the vitriolic spew of songs 1 through 3 comes song no .4, the vaguely lyrical but importantly climatic Locomotive Breath (a song about an impending train wreck, perhaps the lyrics are not so vague), which Anderson himself stated was needed to climax the side two suite of songs before concluding with song No.5, the yarning gently reflective Wind Up. A song in which Anderson opines that God is not only available on a Sunday, after his side 2 diatribe about all that is bad about the hypocrites and those that misuse God's name for ill purposes along with the others that misunderstand the message that they themselves created. Hmmm, sounds conceptual to me.

The side 1 songs that connect with side 2 through Anderson's liner notes are the opening title track character Aqualung, how he suffers, and his the lyrical connection with the school yard prostitute Cross Eyed Mary.

The rest of the songs connect up about as well as most other concept albums, which is to say that they do not. Be as may, that's Aqualung's concept and that's why even some people other than myself consider it to be one. (Just check Wikipedia. LOL)

My personal contention is that Anderson never said that Aqualung was a concept album. He did just about everything but actually say that it was. Did I say that he was a Cheeky devil?   

However Doc, if you do not read the original album liner notes or the album lyrics carefully and at least consider them as some PA members have failed to do or even dismissed them out of hand without even considering them, for God knows what reason, then I doubt you will get past connecting more than three or four of the albums songs together. Peace be upon you my friend.

Edited by SteveG - August 20 2014 at 19:46