Scotland |
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Blacksword
Prog Reviewer Joined: June 22 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 16130 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 13:45 | ||
Yeah I understad what's happening in Ukraine, but the military and economic technicalities aside I'm asking - European and Americans mainly - do they support, in principle the right of east Ukrainians to determine their own future, even if that means joining Russia, who lets face it are essentally an enemy of the west. |
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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Gerinski
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 10 2010 Location: Barcelona Spain Status: Online Points: 5091 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 13:53 | ||
Yes I think they should be given the right to decide, but as I said the majority should be broad and confirmed in time.
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Gerinski
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 10 2010 Location: Barcelona Spain Status: Online Points: 5091 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 14:13 | ||
BTW I'm not knowledgeable enough. May I ask why Scotland can enjoy the right of self-determination and not Northern Ireland? is it because Scotland joined the kingdom voluntarily and NI was the result of a decision by the British?
What would be approximately the current support in NI for a reunion with Southern Ireland?
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lazland
Prog Reviewer Joined: October 28 2008 Location: Wales Status: Offline Points: 13240 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 14:20 | ||
Yes, I have. I see it every bloody day, just as you do. And, no doubt, we would agree that the people who run these local institutions are as big, if not bigger, w**kers than the self serving w**kers at national level. You will have no argument from me there, Dean. There. Where I suspect we might diverge (I don't know) is the reasons why. As ever, there is no simple answer to that question. However, I am in no doubt that one of the biggest reasons why is that the political system, the media, and the establishment in general have, for years now, taken away, bit by bit by bit, local authorities power, and centralised them, to the extent that councils, in effect, now have to run on an ever diminishing dole by central government, and most legislation is governed nationally. It is virtually impossible for a local authority to actually physically run anything, and, of course, local council elections are, mainly, contested by the same political parties, and, thus, the same political w**kers, as are the national ones. Indeed, council elections these days are, basically, nothing more than a media beauty contest in order to judge the (Un)popularity of the ruling party's the day. There is, in effect, absolutely no incentive for the type of innovative and entrepreneurial people you used to get in local government, because they would not be able to do anything. That is one of the reasons why this referendum has been so important. Whatever happens, Scotland will get more powers. So will English and Welsh regions. What they do with it.........that will be the defining political debate of the next twenty years, IMO of course.
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Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org
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SteveG
Forum Senior Member Joined: April 11 2014 Location: Kyiv In Spirit Status: Offline Points: 20474 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 14:21 | ||
For Gerinski: As I understand it, which doesn't mean much, simply because they were afforded the opportunity by some crazy politician. The Brits can clue you in better as to how. Something about giving Scotland the right to ask for succession in return of votes.
Edited by SteveG - September 18 2014 at 14:22 |
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This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State.
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Blacksword
Prog Reviewer Joined: June 22 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 16130 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 14:22 | ||
Can't say for sure, but I'm half Irish and all my relatives (in the south) are catholics and want union. In fact, I don't know anyone in the south who doesn't and I know a fair few people in that town. In the north that would be very different. There are a lot of protestant unionists there. I can't imagine a referendum there being as 'good natured' as the Scottish referendum. |
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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lazland
Prog Reviewer Joined: October 28 2008 Location: Wales Status: Offline Points: 13240 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 14:23 | ||
Gerard, Ni does actually have a devolved Assembly, as does Wales, whilst Scotland has a devolved Parliament. NI has similar powers to the Welsh Assembly, I.e. Over health and education. They cannot, though, raise their own monies through taxation. As for union with Eire, give it a few years now,when the majority of the population will be Catholic. Then you will get critical mass (pardon the pun)
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Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org
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SteveG
Forum Senior Member Joined: April 11 2014 Location: Kyiv In Spirit Status: Offline Points: 20474 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 14:29 | ||
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This message was brought to you by a proud supporter of the Deep State.
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Gerinski
Prog Reviewer Joined: February 10 2010 Location: Barcelona Spain Status: Online Points: 5091 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 14:44 | ||
^ yeah it's terrible when in the 21st century national feelings may still be shaped by religions, disgraceful
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tszirmay
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: August 17 2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 6673 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 14:47 | ||
Indeed, the EUSSR ( ) is becoming more and more another 'socialist paradise' mistake. Contemptible red ideologues who , as Ian Anderson put it so well once long ago, are Living in the Past.
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I never post anything anywhere without doing more than basic research, often in depth.
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akamaisondufromage
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: May 16 2009 Location: Blighty Status: Offline Points: 6797 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 14:49 | ||
Of course that 'w**ker' Cameron may just be pretending that he wants the Scots to stay part of the Union. He may have deliberately left DevoMax off the agenda just so the Scots would leave us. THus guaranteeing a perpetual Tory Government for ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ev......... |
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Help me I'm falling!
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akamaisondufromage
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: May 16 2009 Location: Blighty Status: Offline Points: 6797 |
Posted: September 18 2014 at 16:38 | ||
You Gov pollsters say
54% NO 46% YES Hmm ? Edited by akamaisondufromage - September 18 2014 at 16:38 |
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Help me I'm falling!
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Blacksword
Prog Reviewer Joined: June 22 2004 Location: England Status: Offline Points: 16130 |
Posted: September 19 2014 at 00:38 | ||
It's NO!
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Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
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lazland
Prog Reviewer Joined: October 28 2008 Location: Wales Status: Offline Points: 13240 |
Posted: September 19 2014 at 00:53 | ||
45% yes. 55% no.
Easier win than originally touted, so never trust opinion pollsters Still, 45% is still a sizeable vote for change and disaffection from and with Westminster. In many ways, the interesting politics starts now.
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Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org
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tszirmay
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: August 17 2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 6673 |
Posted: September 19 2014 at 01:00 | ||
A new era of power has surfaced in the UK , the Scots are going to run the show, getting nothing but advantageous concessions from London, or else....next time....
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I never post anything anywhere without doing more than basic research, often in depth.
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Dean
Special Collaborator Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout Joined: May 13 2007 Location: Europe Status: Offline Points: 37575 |
Posted: September 19 2014 at 01:09 | ||
Yeah right, Tories have such a good track record of keeping their promises we believe every word they say.
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What?
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DaleHauskins
Forum Senior Member Joined: December 23 2005 Location: So.California Status: Offline Points: 239 |
Posted: September 19 2014 at 01:11 | ||
Poor Scotland hasn't broken free after 300 years tonight;all have voted
no except Edinburgh.
R.I.P. Mr.Kenny Wheeler. A inspirational musician and soloist to this Los Angeles lifelong guitarist. http://www.theguardian.com/music/2014/sep/19/kenny-wheeler-jazz-musician-dies-aged-84 |
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Dale Hauskins
(858) 401-2973 (310) 293-0432 https://artistecard.com/Dalehauskins |
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Jim Garten
Special Collaborator Retired Admin & Razor Guru Joined: February 02 2004 Location: South England Status: Offline Points: 14693 |
Posted: September 19 2014 at 02:05 | ||
Edinburgh - No
Glasgow - Yes ..."there could be trouble, aheaaaaad..." |
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Jon Lord 1941 - 2012 |
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tszirmay
Special Collaborator Honorary Collaborator Joined: August 17 2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 6673 |
Posted: September 19 2014 at 02:05 | ||
Not Edinburgh, but Glasgow , totally unsurprisingly
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I never post anything anywhere without doing more than basic research, often in depth.
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someone_else
Forum Senior Member VIP Member Joined: May 02 2008 Location: Going Bananas Status: Offline Points: 23993 |
Posted: September 19 2014 at 03:02 | ||
You have a good point here, but it would have shown that a superstate has no right to exist because the peoples that are trapped in it always prefer to govern their own affairs without an elusive superpower imposing some unwelcome rules. Never mind, the No-camp pulled it off .
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