Forum Home Forum Home > Progressive Music Lounges > Prog Bands, Artists and Genres Appreciation
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Genesis documentary
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Topic ClosedGenesis documentary

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <12345 6>
Author
Message
Rednight View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: January 18 2014
Location: Mar Vista, CA
Status: Offline
Points: 4807
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2014 at 10:33
I haven't seen said documentary on the BBC, but I can only imagine how Hackett got slighted. I'm surprised he was even part of the documentaries for the 2006 CD remasters. As for Banks being a control freak, that's a given with the majority of the writing he did for Wind and Wuthering, Hackett's opus. Then again, Genesis was his and Gabriel's and Rutherford's baby from the start, so he had plenty to be possessive about. Hackett didn't help matters when he ripped And Then There Were Three a new one in a few interviews when it was released. He gave the lads ample resolve in carrying on without him. The one quote that really bugged me though was when Collins was asked why Hackett was no longer in the group. His response of "There were too many musicians in the band," or something to that effect, was smug, arrogant, and downright odd. He was barely a musician in his solo efforts, and that reality, I think, eventually caught up with him, guiding him into retirement.
Back to Top
JD View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: February 07 2009
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 18372
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2014 at 11:23
Originally posted by burningthecurve burningthecurve wrote:

Hey everyone - 

I need some advice... I just found what looks to be  

PETER GABRIEL Peter Gabriel III (Rare original 1980 US Mercury promotional-only press pack comprising a 2-page press release, 2 pages of copies media articles and two 10" x 8" black & white publicity photographs). 


And the press release is on Mercury Records letter head and everything.  I have been looking all over the internet and can't find a way to figure out what this thing is worth.  lol....

Any ideas?  Where would I go to get something like this appraised correctly... I live in San Francisco, Ca.  




I have to believe items like this are market driven. Their only real value is in how much someone wants to possess it and thereby how much they are willing to pay. You may possess a one of a kind anything, but if no one else is interested in it it's value is exactly ZERO. Put it on eBay and see what the market will bare, my guess is maybe $25 - $50 tops.
Thank you for supporting independently produced music
Back to Top
Jim Garten View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Retired Admin & Razor Guru

Joined: February 02 2004
Location: South England
Status: Offline
Points: 14693
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2014 at 11:23
Quote There were too many musicians in the band," or something to that effect, was smug, arrogant, and downright odd


I'd see that in context with the rest of the documentary - Collins was being humorous & acting the fool I think to defuse what was an obviously tense reunion.

...and yes, I'd forgotten - Stuermer playing Firth Of Fifth? Hello?? Yes, he's a fantastic guitarist & did a fine job, but this really put the boot in with Hackett... "I know, we've ignored his entire solo career, how can we really insult him - ah yes - have his replacement play his most famous Genesis solo"

Jon Lord 1941 - 2012
Back to Top
Guldbamsen View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Retired Admin

Joined: January 22 2009
Location: Magic Theatre
Status: Offline
Points: 23098
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2014 at 11:28
LOL

Sorry but it's funny cause it's true.
“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”

- Douglas Adams
Back to Top
bucka001 View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: November 16 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 864
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2014 at 13:11
From Peter Hammill, on his Twitter account:
 
"A documentary about the career of Genesis/PG without a single mention of Stratton Smith or Charisma, eh? Not very classy...or accurate."
jc
Back to Top
lazland View Drop Down
Prog Reviewer
Prog Reviewer
Avatar

Joined: October 28 2008
Location: Wales
Status: Offline
Points: 13249
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2014 at 13:11
Originally posted by ProgMetaller2112 ProgMetaller2112 wrote:

Have not seen and simply right now don't care to. Genesis sold out. They might as well be called Philesis LOL

Well, you should see the documentary before you post such a comment, sorry, or, even, look at past threads on the site about them.

I have said it before, and will say it until my last breath. The vast majority of three man Genesis material was created by just that...Three men. Banks really could not have made that clearer. Collins didn't even seriously contribute to the writing until Duke, and after that it was very much a collaboration.

By all means accuse them of selling out. I don't, but you are perfectly entitled to. But at least do so with the facts in hand.
Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org
Back to Top
Horizons View Drop Down
Collaborator
Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: January 20 2011
Location: Somewhere Else
Status: Offline
Points: 16952
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2014 at 13:13
Originally posted by bucka001 bucka001 wrote:

From Peter Hammill, on his Twitter account:
 
"A documentary about the career of Genesis/PG without a single mention of Stratton Smith or Charisma, eh? Not very classy...or accurate."

This guy just never fails to make me love him. 


Crushed like a rose in the riverflow.
Back to Top
lazland View Drop Down
Prog Reviewer
Prog Reviewer
Avatar

Joined: October 28 2008
Location: Wales
Status: Offline
Points: 13249
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2014 at 15:19
Originally posted by Horizons Horizons wrote:

Originally posted by bucka001 bucka001 wrote:

From Peter Hammill, on his Twitter account:
 
"A documentary about the career of Genesis/PG without a single mention of Stratton Smith or Charisma, eh? Not very classy...or accurate."

This guy just never fails to make me love him. 



He was spot on, though. King, and no Strat? StaggeringConfused
Enhance your life. Get down to www.lazland.org
Back to Top
Hercules View Drop Down
Prog Reviewer
Prog Reviewer
Avatar

Joined: June 14 2007
Location: Near York UK
Status: Offline
Points: 7024
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2014 at 18:09
[QUOTE

...and yes, I'd forgotten - Stuermer playing Firth Of Fifth? Hello?? Yes, he's a fantastic guitarist & did a fine job, but this really put the boot in with Hackett... "I know, we've ignored his entire solo career, how can we really insult him - ah yes - have his replacement play his most famous Genesis solo"[/QUOTE]

What amazed me was that Stuermer played it note perfect but with an almost complete absence of "feel" and with none of the emotion Hackett imparted. It was technically perfect but sterile.
 


A TVR is not a car. It's a way of life.
Back to Top
twosteves View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: May 01 2007
Location: NYC/Rhinebeck
Status: Offline
Points: 4070
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2014 at 20:55
Originally posted by Hercules Hercules wrote:

[QUOTE

...and yes, I'd forgotten - Stuermer playing Firth Of Fifth? Hello?? Yes, he's a fantastic guitarist & did a fine job, but this really put the boot in with Hackett... "I know, we've ignored his entire solo career, how can we really insult him - ah yes - have his replacement play his most famous Genesis solo"

What amazed me was that Stuermer played it note perfect but with an almost complete absence of "feel" and with none of the emotion Hackett imparted. It was technically perfect but sterile.
 


Clap My thoughts exactly-------
Back to Top
Chris S View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: June 09 2004
Location: Front Range
Status: Offline
Points: 7028
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 06 2014 at 22:33
My my, i cannot be stoofed dissing Stuermer as sterile?? come on!!

As for PG he left circa 1974, major major influence but the work done without him was extraordinary too for 20++ years. Brilliant and Collins continues to get a bum rap, even when adding humour,  sometimes in the past to smooth over Bank's acutely clumsy way with the media. Rutherford perhaps the most normal of the lot :-)

These documentaries have worn thin surely by now...


<font color=Brown>Music - The Sound Librarian

...As I venture through the slipstream, between the viaducts in your dreams...[/COLOR]
Back to Top
Blacksword View Drop Down
Prog Reviewer
Prog Reviewer
Avatar

Joined: June 22 2004
Location: England
Status: Offline
Points: 16130
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 07 2014 at 02:58
Originally posted by Chris S Chris S wrote:

My my, i cannot be stoofed dissing Stuermer as sterile?? come on!!
As for PG he left circa 1974, major major influence but the work done without him was extraordinary too for 20++ years. Brilliant and Collins continues to get a bum rap, even when adding humour,  sometimes in the past to smooth over Bank's acutely clumsy way with the media. Rutherford perhaps the most normal of the lot :-)
These documentaries have worn thin surely by now...


I'm inclined to agree. Unless there is lots of previously unseen live and studio footage of the band at work, these films are not very intetesting.

I love Genesis but the likes of Banks and Rutherford have little of interest to say. They look and speak like politicians, giving sanitised, rehearesed and evasive answers to questions put to them. Hackett, Gabriel, Collins and Phillips are far more intetesting to listen to. An unofficial doc purely from the perspective of these guys would be quite interesting
Ultimately bored by endless ecstasy!
Back to Top
Dean View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Retired Admin and Amateur Layabout

Joined: May 13 2007
Location: Europe
Status: Offline
Points: 37575
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 07 2014 at 03:09
^ Sonja has just reminded me that Gabriel name-checked Hackett and Phillips when accepting his Prog God award. In hindsight I suspect his comments about TV interviews may be an oblique reference to this documentary.

What?
Back to Top
chopper View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: July 13 2005
Location: Essex, UK
Status: Offline
Points: 19943
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 07 2014 at 05:25
Originally posted by Zenbadger<div style=line-height: 14.3999996185303px;><br></div><div style=line-height: 14.3999996185303px;>3. Steve Hackett giving his reasons for leaving to do solo work with a sarcastic god forgive me guys as the camera switches to show a very unimpressed Tony Banks and Mike Rutherford.. Hilarious! Worth watching this documentary just for that.</div><div style=line-height: 14.3999996185303px;><br></div>[/QUOTE Zenbadger

3. Steve Hackett giving his reasons for leaving to do solo work with a sarcastic god forgive me guys as the camera switches to show a very unimpressed Tony Banks and Mike Rutherford.. Hilarious! Worth watching this documentary just for that.

[/QUOTE wrote:



Yes, if looks could kill....

I agree with others, Banks came over badly and very jealous of others solo success, although he tried to laugh it off. Interesting to hear that he wouldn't have let Gabriel dress up in the early days if he'd known in advance, even though Collins said it probably added a 0 to their earnings.

Yes, if looks could kill....

I agree with others, Banks came over badly and very jealous of others solo success, although he tried to laugh it off. Interesting to hear that he wouldn't have let Gabriel dress up in the early days if he'd known in advance, even though Collins said it probably added a 0 to their earnings.
Back to Top
chopper View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: July 13 2005
Location: Essex, UK
Status: Offline
Points: 19943
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 07 2014 at 05:30
Originally posted by Zenbadger Zenbadger wrote:

3. Steve Hackett giving his reasons for leaving to do solo work with a sarcastic "god forgive me guys" as the camera switches to show a very unimpressed Tony Banks and Mike Rutherford.. Hilarious! Worth watching this documentary just for that.


Yes, if looks could kill...

I agree with others that Banks didn't come across well. Although he tried to laugh it off he is obviously jealous of the greater solo success of Gabriel and Collins, also it was interesting to hear that he would not have let Gabriel dress up in the early days had he known in advance, even though Collins said it added a 0 to their earnings.
Back to Top
twosteves View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: May 01 2007
Location: NYC/Rhinebeck
Status: Offline
Points: 4070
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 07 2014 at 08:28
the Collins "joke" about after Steve left---fewer musicians in the group--is actually not a joke--the 3 super successful guys not only get along they think their success is based on fewer guys--fewer arguments and more agreement about songs. All three have said as much over the years.
Back to Top
Finnforest View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Honorary Collaborator

Joined: February 03 2007
Location: .
Status: Offline
Points: 16913
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 07 2014 at 09:13
I really enjoyed that Gabriel award speech below, he seems like such a good guy. 

Re some other posts, I have to stick up a bit for Tony.  I haven't seen this Doc yet but I have seen similar things written about him before.  I have a hunch he's a good guy too who is just not quite as skilled as "the singers" at coming off with warmth and humor, a bit aloof, not able to always come up with the great line in an interview.  Perhaps he's a bit introverted which can make one appear less warm when often that isn't the case.  Maybe he has not treated the other members with as much affection as he should have, but I think in every great band you need a person who does "direct" and who does "get it done."  As in the Floyd, with Roger.  As highly as I think of the other 3 gentlemen, I do firmly believe the many accounts I've read that had Roger not "taken the wheel" as he did in the later 70s, you would not have had nearly the same legacy of achievement as now exists.  Dave, and if I recall Nick too have basically admitted as much in interviews despite their resentments of his overbearing nature.

As to the idea of Tony being jealous of the success of the singers, maybe, maybe not.  But of course he should not be, because in my eyes he has a legacy just as great as theirs.  I firmly believe he was most important single member of the Genesis legacy I admire and the least replaceable.  Without any other single member the band can and did survive.  Without Tony the band would have lost something critical to my own enjoyment, could there have been a Wind and Wuthering without Tony?  I love his musical personality, his reserve, his great care of the sound in those days. 

Back to Top
Guldbamsen View Drop Down
Special Collaborator
Special Collaborator
Avatar
Retired Admin

Joined: January 22 2009
Location: Magic Theatre
Status: Offline
Points: 23098
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 07 2014 at 09:21
Great post JimClap
“The Guide says there is an art to flying or rather a knack. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.”

- Douglas Adams
Back to Top
altaeria View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: March 05 2004
Location: Philadelphia
Status: Offline
Points: 178
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 07 2014 at 11:00

The only phases that I am interested in hearing about now in more detail 
are the Wind-And-Wuthering and Calling-All-Stations eras. 
Everything else has already been elaborated on countless times. 

Thumbs Down

Back to Top
M27Barney View Drop Down
Forum Senior Member
Forum Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: November 09 2006
Location: Swinton M27
Status: Offline
Points: 3136
Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 07 2014 at 12:29
Lets face it - the BBC were always going to have a black woman as an "Expert" - it's all very PC at the BBC.....
I watched it and was appalled that Selling England by the Pound was virtually skipped - as was most of the earlier interesting stuff - none of which I didn't already know!!
I was also appalled by the fookin sh*te that genesis pedalled to mugs after W&W - hands up all you sheep that were fleeced when shelling out beer vouchers for ATTWT, D, A and the rest so appalling I'd rather go to watch a pantomime put on by the I.S.....And everybody is right - Rutherford & Banks obviously hate Hackett (probably because he didn't sell out and still produced music that he wanted to write - not just pop-sound-bites designed to part brain dead morons from their cash...
Ahhh that's better.....Catharsis on the Forum...
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <12345 6>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down



This page was generated in 0.551 seconds.
Donate monthly and keep PA fast-loading and ad-free forever.