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Topic ClosedA A Rush song vs A Henry Cow song

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Poll Question: Which is your favourite dystopia?
Poll Choice Votes Poll Statistics
27 [45.00%]
33 [55.00%]
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Jeffro View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 21 2016 at 06:39
Originally posted by mechanicalflattery mechanicalflattery wrote:

Originally posted by Jeffro Jeffro wrote:

Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

Originally posted by mechanicalflattery mechanicalflattery wrote:

I can't vote yet but:
LITHOTB > 2112
Henry Cow >> Rush
Dagmar Krause >>> Geddy Lee
Fred Frith >>> Alex Lifeson
Chris Cutler > Neal Peart (this one's actually pretty close)
Tim Hodgkinson lyrics >>>>>>> Neal Peart lyrics (and I'm a libertarian, so this isn't political bias talking)



that gets you some McClappies... ClapClap

but no... not close in this unverise or any alternative universe where you actually use ones ears to judge creativity and ability.

 Chris Cutler was 100 times the drummer Peart was. He just locked up the 'Rush RAWKS' kiddie vote.

Perhaps you could express your admiration for Cow without dumping on Rush.
I'm a little surprised to see quite a bit of Rush derision on this site. 

Rush is a fine group but their claims to making genuinely progressive music are vastly overstated (IMO of course). I've heard 4 Henry Cow albums and 5 Rush albums, and I'd rather listen to any album from HC over any from Rush.

As for Cutler and Peart, if we're talking creativity and advancement of percussion (and music in general) as an art form, Cutler surpasses Peart by a thousand leagues. Still, Peart's a pretty good drummer, especially for a more conventional group.  

If anything, I regret not putting Frith way, way farther ahead of Lifeson. Just compare the opening of The Decay of Cities to the acoustic section of 2112. That's not even citing Guitar Solos, which would just be unfair.

Has anyone in Rush ever made any claims to "making genuinely progressive music"? If they have, I must have missed it. What does "making genuinely progressive music" even mean anyway? Is it some kind of elitist attitude? Does it mean that if I consider Rush to be progressive (at some points in their career) that I somehow don't understand what "true" prog is? How can I learn from all you masters who somehow know what prog is and what prog is not?



Edited by Jeffro - August 21 2016 at 06:44
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Jeffro View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 21 2016 at 06:43
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

Originally posted by Jeffro Jeffro wrote:

Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

Originally posted by mechanicalflattery mechanicalflattery wrote:

I can't vote yet but:
LITHOTB > 2112
Henry Cow >> Rush
Dagmar Krause >>> Geddy Lee
Fred Frith >>> Alex Lifeson
Chris Cutler > Neal Peart (this one's actually pretty close)
Tim Hodgkinson lyrics >>>>>>> Neal Peart lyrics (and I'm a libertarian, so this isn't political bias talking)



that gets you some McClappies... ClapClap

but no... not close in this unverise or any alternative universe where you actually use ones ears to judge creativity and ability.

 Chris Cutler was 100 times the drummer Peart was. He just locked up the 'Rush RAWKS' kiddie vote.

Perhaps you could express your admiration for Cow without dumping on Rush.
I'm a little surprised to see quite a bit of Rush derision on this site. 


dumping on Rush?...

oh trust me... you haven't seen anything to that effect.  I can if you wish..

Rush fans Unhappy No wonder you all have such bad names.. can't take the slightest bit of criticism of your heroes. Critism in that people don't think they were god's gift to music. No Peart was not the greatest drummer ever.. there were better..  same with Lifeson.. same with Geddy..

good group.. a few great songs..a couple good albums..  passionate loyal fanbase... let's leave it at that aye.Thumbs Up

Leave it at that? Just before typing that sentence, you typed another dig at Rush fans. Not too hypocritical there. LOL

I, for one, have never claimed that Rush is gods gift to music. I am glad that they are finally getting their due though. Took way too long for it to happen.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 21 2016 at 06:49
Wink  We love Rush around here... it is just they have a giant 'kick me' sign plastered on their asses.

Picking on them.. and their fans is merely signs of affection. Warped affection perhaps.. but this is Prog Archives.  Where we love warping the notion of being warped.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 21 2016 at 07:18
Originally posted by Jeffro Jeffro wrote:


Has anyone in Rush ever made any claims to "making genuinely progressive music"? If they have, I must have missed it. What does "making genuinely progressive music" even mean anyway? Is it some kind of elitist attitude? Does it mean that if I consider Rush to be progressive (at some points in their career) that I somehow don't understand what "true" prog is? How can I learn from all you masters who somehow know what prog is and what prog is not?


By progressive, I really just meant innovative and creative. Whether or not a group is "prog" versus "not prog" matters far less than whether it's worthwhile to listen to. I never established that anyone must share my opinions on anything. I like Rush (to a limited degree). You like Rush more, I assume. There is nothing wrong with that. The assertion of an opinion contrary to yours does not signify a claim to intellectual superiority.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 21 2016 at 07:49
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

Wink  We love Rush around here... it is just they have a giant 'kick me' sign plastered on their asses.

Picking on them.. and their fans is merely signs of affection. Warped affection perhaps.. but this is Prog Archives.  Where we love warping the notion of being warped.

Ah, okay. I'll take this at face value.  I'm still essentially a noob here.




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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 21 2016 at 07:50
Originally posted by mechanicalflattery mechanicalflattery wrote:

Originally posted by Jeffro Jeffro wrote:


Has anyone in Rush ever made any claims to "making genuinely progressive music"? If they have, I must have missed it. What does "making genuinely progressive music" even mean anyway? Is it some kind of elitist attitude? Does it mean that if I consider Rush to be progressive (at some points in their career) that I somehow don't understand what "true" prog is? How can I learn from all you masters who somehow know what prog is and what prog is not?


By progressive, I really just meant innovative and creative. Whether or not a group is "prog" versus "not prog" matters far less than whether it's worthwhile to listen to. I never established that anyone must share my opinions on anything. I like Rush (to a limited degree). You like Rush more, I assume. There is nothing wrong with that. The assertion of an opinion contrary to yours does not signify a claim to intellectual superiority.

Fair enough.
I'm not knocking on Henry Cow at all. In fact, what I've heard about them intrigues me. I plan on diving in to their catalog very soon. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 21 2016 at 07:51
I just found a kick me sign on my back. Okay, which one of you wiseasses did that?  Wink
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 21 2016 at 09:14
One of the few polls I'd pick Rush for anything. I find Henry Cow unlistenable.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 21 2016 at 09:28
When I set up this poll - ages ago - I felt aggrieved that Rush were generally more celebrated than the Cow.  I had to endure smug Rush fans since being a teenager.  Endless arguments on the back seat of the bus about how weird Henry Cow were compared to the 'exciting' Rush.  The Cow disbanded in 78 around the time when their peers were simplifying the music often with dire results.  The Cow refused to compromise.  On the other hand, I felt that Rush expertly moved into the vacuum left by prog as the originators moved into stadium rock/sophisticated pop.  I actually own two of their albums 'Signals' and 'Grace Under Pressure' and saw them once on the 'Power Windows' tour, but I found that experience dire.
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